Ken Rosenthal: No more excuses for Eppler

[Claude]

28 minutes ago, mymerlincat said:

Rosenthal is arguably the best in the business.  Hilarious to see people discredit this

Yeah so last nights Angels starting lineup costs $107M while Oakland’s cost $38M so it’s time to stop with the nonsense and start winning. This has got to get Arte’s and Eppler’s attention. If we’re thinking about next season you have to remember that we are only missing La Stella right now so let that sink in. Outside of Trout and Ohtani, the offense isn’t all that.

Edited September 4, 2019 by Calzone 2

[angelsnationtalk]

12 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

You tell Cole he's there priority and they'll wait it out for him, but at the same time you go out and get a #2 and #3 guy who can give you some solid innings. 

This rotation needs to pencil Ohtani in at #3 and Heaney at #4 IMO and land a solid #2 and a guy like Cole to headline the rotation. Let Canning, Sandoval, Barria, Suarez and some other young kid battle it out for the 5th spot. 

Anything less than the above and it's a failure IMO. It has been a long time since this club has had a good rotation, let alone a decent one. 

There's no more excuses left. Let's see some facking results. 

Let's change it a bit. We're likely going to a 6 man rotation again with "Ohtani Sundays". so let's go: Cole, #2 guy, Ohtani, Heaney, Canning, Sandoval/Barria/Suarez.

[Catwhoshatinthehat]

Offensively the Angels can save money by buying out Kole.  They need at least 2 starters and if they wait for Cole to decide that's fine but like Chuck said they need to be aggressive bringing in at least 1 more arm.  They didn't acquire anyone that was moved at the deadline and that's fine but it's now or never come the off season and I don't want to hear people saying they'll have better luck at next year's deadline.  Arms aren't cheap but they need them and they have some pieces to try and make it happen.  

[Bronson]

3 minutes ago, Calzone 2 said:

Yeah so last nights Angels starting lineup costs $107M while Oakland’s cost $38M so it’s time to stop with the nonsense and start winning. This has got to get Arte’s and Eppler’s attention. If we’re thinking about next season you have to remember that we are only missing La Stella right now so let that sink in. Outside of Trout and Ohtani The offense isn’t all that.

What about Fletcher?

[Inside Pitch]

2 hours ago, Chuckster70 said:

Anything less than the above and it's a failure IMO. It has been a long time since this club has had a good rotation, let alone a decent one. 

The rotation issues weren't his making, and you have seen what options were available since he got here -- I'm not willing to put the sins of the father onto the son so to speak..   

I also don't know that I would term anything less than two studs a failure but ultimately that's what needs to happen.. so, it's not an outlandish statement by any means.  I see this more of an off-season for Arte to prove his mettle than Eppler.  Eppler has proven he has a plan and can stick to it.  He's proven he can draft, he's proven he develop players and make solid hires (not talking Ausmus), what he hasn't proven is that if given the money that JD was given he will fair any better. 

The Mike Trout situation being resolved more than ANYTHING else has made it put up or shut up time, I have said before I think it hung over the franchise and IMO may have impacted other people's view of the Angels as a future home -- why go to Anaheim if they ended up losing the one guy that made them attractive.   In previous years you could argue the team had to worry about how that would play out -- well, it's played out now.  So, this is Arte's moment to prove that his always saying the team would spend if the right situation came up is more than just a sound byte.  

For me this off-season is more about Arte, than Eppler.   There has never been a more right time IMO.

[Taylor]

32 minutes ago, mymerlincat said:

Rosenthal is arguably the best in the business.  Hilarious to see people discredit this

The "best in the business" (which is very arguable) still has to rack up the clicks.

[Claude]

4 minutes ago, Bronson said:

What about Fletcher?

Solid defender but not much power in the juiced baseball era and his numbers have gradually come down. I like him in the lineup though. He’s a worker for sure.

Edited September 4, 2019 by Calzone 2

[Taylor]

8 minutes ago, Calzone 2 said:

Yeah so last nights Angels starting lineup costs $107M while Oakland’s cost $38M so it’s time to stop with the nonsense and start winning. This has got to get Arte’s and Eppler’s attention. If we’re thinking about next season you have to remember that we are only missing La Stella right now so let that sink in. Outside of Trout and Ohtani, the offense isn’t all that.

The offense is about 5 percent of the problem. The pitching is 95 percent of the problem.

[mulwin444]

5 minutes ago, Calzone 2 said:

Yeah so last nights Angels starting lineup costs $107M while Oakland’s cost $38M so it’s time to stop with the nonsense and start winning. 

 

Pretty irrelevant...Pujols is gone in 2 years while OAK's Olson, Chapman, and Semien are arb eligible soon.  Yeah, I know, facts...

"Outside of Trout and Ohtani The offense isn’t all that."

Angels are 6th out of 15 in runs scored

[Claude]

Just now, Taylor said:

The offense is about 5 percent of the problem. The pitching is 95 percent of the problem.

Not going to argue that we need pitching. 

[Claude]

3 minutes ago, mulwin444 said:

 

Pretty irrelevant...Pujols is gone in 2 years while OAK's Olson, Chapman, and Semien are arb eligible soon.  Yeah, I know, facts...

"Outside of Trout and Ohtani The offense isn’t all that."

Angels are 6th out of 15 in runs scored

I’m not going to debate this issue but I believe that our offenses overall output is masked by the MVP performance of Mike Trout. I’m going to leave it at that and avoid a 5 page discussion on it. 

[mulwin444]

1 minute ago, Calzone 2 said:

I’m not going to debate this issue but I believe that our offenses overall output is masked by the MVP performance of Mike Trout. I’m going to leave it at that and avoid a 5 page discussion on it. 

Good idea since it wouldn't hold up under scrutiny...

[stormngt]

I have like how Eopler made some improvements.   I am not expecting Eppler to build a works series winner next year.  However it would be nice if we improved in win column. Showing improvement would be nice.  He hasn't had a winning season yet.  This year maybe worse than his first.

[Catwhoshatinthehat]

The Angels have scored the 11th most runs with a team ERA that ranks 24th.  The offense isn't what they need to focus on.

[Taylor]

9 minutes ago, Calzone 2 said:

I’m not going to debate this issue but I believe that our offenses overall output is masked by the MVP performance of Mike Trout. I’m going to leave it at that and avoid a 5 page discussion on it. 

"I'm not going to debate this issue, but I am going to state my opinion in this debate."

[kevinb]

1 hour ago, Baghdad Strad said:

Sure, if he can sign two VERY high end arms and Arte opens up the check book to do so then yea.  If Arte won’t and if Cole chooses to stay in Houston, then sure fire Eppler.  Most GMs can’t do what he has done, given what he was left with.  What if he signs Cole and whoever the next best guy is and Cole goes down with an injury and we aren’t a Championship caliber team, should he still be fired?  There is just too much going on to have some blanket statement like, “he’s gone if they aren’t a championship team”.  What if Trout goes down next year?  What if the Dodgers lose in the World Series and they say, “F*ck it” and give Cole $40 million a year.  Should Eppler offer $41 million a year?  This is a rebuild, it takes years to accomplish.  

Most GM's can't do what? Not get to the playoffs 4 years in a row with a top 10 payroll? 

[Blarg]

42 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

I dont think Rosenthal actually said that -- he's mostly saying that everything is in place.  It's not critical of him, so much as it's basically saying -- it's time.

It is.

Imagine though, if you can, where the Angels would be had Eppler been chosen over Dipoto, with all of the same resources available to him. The kinds of player aquisitions, trades made, draft picks, hell, Mike Scioscia might even still be the manager but one thing is for sure, we wouldn't be taking about time's up. 

[Angel Oracle]

1 hour ago, Baghdad Strad said:

Sure, if he can sign two VERY high end arms and Arte opens up the check book to do so then yea.  If Arte won’t and if Cole chooses to stay in Houston, then sure fire Eppler.  Most GMs can’t do what he has done, given what he was left with.  What if he signs Cole and whoever the next best guy is and Cole goes down with an injury and we aren’t a Championship caliber team, should he still be fired?  There is just too much going on to have some blanket statement like, “he’s gone if they aren’t a championship team”.  What if Trout goes down next year?  What if the Dodgers lose in the World Series and they say, “F*ck it” and give Cole $40 million a year.  Should Eppler offer $41 million a year?  This is a rebuild, it takes years to accomplish.  

Agreed, just wish they could at least contend for a 2nd WC spot next season, while the rebuilding continues towards long term farm stabilization.

This will be the first time since 1972-1977, that they finished under .500 for at least 4 straight seasons.  It is starting to get a little bit old. 

[Claude]

So if we sign Cole and win 85 games (4 games above .500) next year but still miss the playoffs, will everyone here be jumping for joy? 

Edited September 4, 2019 by Calzone 2

[angelsnationtalk]

3 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

Agreed, just wish they could at least contend for a 2nd WC spot next season, while the rebuilding continues towards long term farm stabilization.

They should be able to

[mulwin444]

2 minutes ago, Calzone 2 said:

So if we sign Cole and win 85 games (4 games above .500) next year but still miss the playoffs, will everyone here be jumping for joy? 

If they have 85 wins, they'll be 85-77, 8 games over .500.

As for missing the playoffs after signing Cole, we'll know you'll be jumping for joy so there's that...

[nate]

Eppler honestly has an impossible job.  I think he has done good work getting the system back to a decent spot, not sure about scouting though.  Pitching continues to be decimated, and I really doubt the Angels will sign Cole.  Gigantic FA contracts for pitchers never work out.  Neither do one year contracts.  The fact is, unless you are the Astros and you can swindle a team for a pitcher of Verlander's quality, the Angels will be right back in their current situation until they can develop more pitchers.

Also don't forget that the Astros were bad for a long time, all those years of drafting in the top 3 obviously paid off.  The Angels meanwhile were dominant for a decade and then just became an average to below average team, not many sure picks in the MLB draft outside of the top 10.

The Angels go into next season with a very young pitching staff and a Skaggs sized hole.  Plus all the injuries that will inevitably happen.

You also cannot underestimate how much Reagins/Scioscia and Diputo emptying out the farm system year after year sets you back.

[yk9001]

14 minutes ago, Calzone 2 said:

So if we sign Cole and win 85 games next year but still miss the playoffs, will everyone here be jumping for joy? 

If we win 85 games, at least there will be some mildly interesting September games.

Better than this dreck.

[Stradling]

32 minutes ago, Kevinb said:

Most GM's can't do what? Not get to the playoffs 4 years in a row with a top 10 payroll? 

Yep, that is all he has done, you are right.  He’s accomplished nothing other than that.  

[floplag]

I see a lot of people saying if if if.   
If he can sign 2 arms... well, thats a self created situation.  Thats what happens when you wait till the last minute and dont take care of some of that in advance.  Weve had a ton of opportunities to make trades or sign FAs in the last couple of years and have chosen not to.  We have backed ourselves into that corner, no one put us there. 
This isnt an IF at this point, its a must in my opinion.  one thru FA, another perhaps thru trade if necessary, we have some tradable assets, use them.
It tells me a great deal that they picked up his option, but did not extend him.  If this club doesnt take significant strides next season, im not sure hes back. 
We wasted one of the best seasons a player has ever had in Trout this year, and probably the best we will get out of Albert.  Again a wholly self inflicted wound.  If we had gotten 2 actual pitchers over the dumpster diving we did this year we are in the playoff mix now, today, not this time next year.
Yes i know hindsight is always 20/20 but many of us believe this was possible now and got told be patient, work the plan, they will when the time is right... well, this is what we got for that. 
The org should legit be embarrassed right now to be this bad, with what we have gotten from some of the position players.