Sayonara Hamilton

[Mile High Dreams]

Arte won't say that Hamlton will play again for the Halos

[CaliAngel]

Good. Can't say there are too many people who are gonna miss him.

Too bad we gave away Bourjos, would be nice to have him out there with Trout and Calhoun.

[beatlesrule]

Good. Can't say there are too many people who are gonna miss him.

Too bad we gave away Bourjos, would be nice to have him out there with Trout and Calhoun.

Who plays 3rd? I'm more bummed Dipoto didn't resign Hunter. I made a post about the Hamilton issue in the other thread.

[bloodbrother]

To think, the lasting images we'll have of Josh is all those marvelous AB's of his in the ALDS last year

[Bruce Nye]

My lasting image is of Hamilton jogging to 1B on a groundout.

[Mauch Won]

Unfortunately, every contract is governed by the collective bargaining agreement which includes the joint drug agreement. For the same reason ARod's contract was not voided, Hamilton's will remain in force. At best, the Angels will be able to collect damages for time missed due to the relapse. If Hamilton comes back when his shoulder has healed, the Angels won't recover any money.

[Glen]

A link, for those interested.  No way it's gonna happen, as Mauch Won indicated.

 

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/04/angels-may-seek-contract-action-against-josh-hamilton.html

[Ohtaniland]

The image of Hamilton snorting 20' of the first base line before injuring his thumb was enough for me.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

To think, the lasting images we'll have of Josh is all those marvelous AB's of his in the ALDS last year

 

Yeah, that RBI on an infield groundout was the turning point of the series. Oh, wait...

[disarcina]

this whole Hamilton thing is just lousy........

 

but as other posters have pointed out -- what were the Angels thinking (or NOT thinking at all) when they signed him to that multi-year contract with all his history?

 

Hamilton is a guy who IF you sign him -- gets a one maybe two year deal with low base salary tied to incentives.......like extra money for every game he plays.....

 

my enduring image of Hamilton is any one of his 13 ABs vs. KC in last year's playoffs.......all were awful.

[fan_since79]

In fairness to Hamilton, most of the Angels hitters were awful in that series.

[CaliAngel]

this whole Hamilton thing is just lousy........

but as other posters have pointed out -- what were the Angels thinking (or NOT thinking at all) when they signed him to that multi-year contract with all his history?

It is lousy.

Arte as far as I'm concerned, is a good man. He trusted Hamilton.

He met up with Hamiltons wife and daughters before they signed the contract. Hamilton put on a good face, which I'm sure in his mind was very honest, to get the contract. Arte took his word, and put his faith in Hamilton. Hamilton either doesn't give a shit, can't grow up and stop doing drugs, or is just a complete f***wit.

It's one of those things; give a guy with drug problems millions of dollars and there's no reason to do drugs anymore, or give a guy millions of dollars and he says "F*** You!" while he takes off with the money and runs.

If I were Arte, I would never want to see Hamilton again. The money to Arte means nothing. Get the f*** off my team and good luck playing baseball ever again (although with Hamilton and his stupid attitude, probably could care less).

I would have NEVER have signed Hamilton in the first place, but what's done is done. Cut your losses and keep this cancer out of the clubhouse. The Angels are not a team to let distractions off the field affect play on the field, and i'd rather they not start now. Especially with Hamilton.

Josh if you ever read this, we ALL gave you a shot. Even I did. But get your f***ing head out of yer ass. I don't even care if I ever see you in a baseball uniform ever again. But for goddamns sake, if anything, be a f***ing MAN and be a role model for the daughters YOU decided to bring into this world.

[ukyah]

this whole Hamilton thing is just lousy........

 

but as other posters have pointed out -- what were the Angels thinking (or NOT thinking at all) when they signed him to that multi-year contract with all his history?

 

Hamilton is a guy who IF you sign him -- gets a one maybe two year deal with low base salary tied to incentives.......like extra money for every game he plays.....

 

my enduring image of Hamilton is any one of his 13 ABs vs. KC in last year's playoffs.......all were awful.

 

 

i'm not defending the contract, but that's not how mlb contracts work, and was never gonna happen on any team. if the conversation is going to be had, have the conversation that could actually happen. the angels f'ed up and signed a high risk player to a high risk AAV and a high risk term contract. that's a lot of risk to spread all over that bad boy.

[AngelsSurfer]

Unfortunately, every contract is governed by the collective bargaining agreement which includes the joint drug agreement. For the same reason ARod's contract was not voided, Hamilton's will remain in force. At best, the Angels will be able to collect damages for time missed due to the relapse. If Hamilton comes back when his shoulder has healed, the Angels won't recover any money.

I mentioned this in the other thread, but I have to think that this is going to be one of the talking points whenever the CBA is re-negotiated. There has to be a compromise somewhere that would protect players overall but allow owners to discipline players or end contracts in cases like this.

At this point I do think there's a distinct possibility that they will release Hamilton and eat the contract.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

Moreno sounds like a man who is totally fed up.

[Tyler]

A link, for those interested.  No way it's gonna happen, as Mauch Won indicated.

 

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/04/angels-may-seek-contract-action-against-josh-hamilton.html

 

How does an owner not know the facts of one of his contracts? Or is the Players Union wrong in that update?

[HeavenlyHalos]

this whole Hamilton thing is just lousy........

 

but as other posters have pointed out -- what were the Angels thinking (or NOT thinking at all) when they signed him to that multi-year contract with all his history?

 

Hamilton is a guy who IF you sign him -- gets a one maybe two year deal with low base salary tied to incentives.......like extra money for every game he plays.....

 

my enduring image of Hamilton is any one of his 13 ABs vs. KC in last year's playoffs.......all were awful.

 

It's easy to say that now, but Hamilton was one of the best hitters from 2010-2012. Coming off a season where he hit 43 HR and had an OPS+ of 141, he was certainly going to get more than a two year deal.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

The contract with the MLBPA prohibits clauses like that in contracts. A team can put one in, but it can't be enforced.

[Puget Sound Angel]

I'm worried this experience may scare off Artie from signing other big-time free agents.

[mancini79]

-Arte states he has recourse in the contract that the Angels, Josh, his agents, MLB, AND MLBPA agreed upon when the contract was signed.

-MLBPA disagrees with that statement.

 

So it sounds like Arte did try due diligence to protect the organization for when Josh relapses. This may go to civil court where each side could agree on a compromised settlement to dissolve the contract.

[Lhalo]

I'm worried this experience may scare off Artie from signing other big-time free agents.

I hope it will.

[Docwaukee]

How does an owner not know the facts of one of his contracts? Or is the Players Union wrong in that update?

it's 90/10 that Arte is just pissing in the wind here.  

 

We have seen in the past where teams can take disciplinary action against their players for conduct related issues so there could be a small loophole that the team will try to exploit.  

 

Since he did not 'violate' the terms of his treatment program, and the league has no grounds to take action.  However, my understanding is that most contract include a morals clause and even though what Josh has done does not constitute an offense punishable by the joint drug program, the team may argue that since it doesn't fall into that category, then it could certainly be construed as a violation of conduct.  

 

To me, the interesting part of this is that if he was found to have violated his treatment program then only the league ie the commissioner would have jurisdiction over his punishment whereas now that it has been determined not to be a violation, the team may argue that since it's not a true union or league matter that they might have the ability to punish the player for reasons of conduct. In other words, the ruling may have done the halos a favor.  

 

But my guess is that nothing will happen.  

[Tyler]

it's 90/10 that Arte is just pissing in the wind here.  

 

We have seen in the past where teams can take disciplinary action against their players for conduct related issues so there could be a small loophole that the team will try to exploit.  

 

Since he did not 'violate' the terms of his treatment program, and the league has no grounds to take action.  However, my understanding is that most contract include a morals clause and even though what Josh has done does not constitute an offense punishable by the joint drug program, the team may argue that since it doesn't fall into that category, then it could certainly be construed as a violation of conduct.  

 

To me, the interesting part of this is that if he was found to have violated his treatment program then only the league ie the commissioner would have jurisdiction over his punishment whereas now that it has been determined not to be a violation, the team may argue that since it's not a true union or league matter that they might have the ability to punish the player for reasons of conduct. In other words, the ruling may have done the halos a favor.  

 

But my guess is that nothing will happen.  

 

It's hard for any of us to have a clue what we're talking about here since we don't have access to the written contract, which makes it hard for me to understand how Arte could be so wrong and express it publicly. 

 

Drugs seems like a whole different ball park than performance enhancing drugs, which makes sense as to why they would have something in his contract given his past.

 

 

"However, on Friday, Moreno said the team indeed had included such language and had it approved by Hamilton, the league and the union. Moreno also said the contracts of other Angels players had similar provisions. -LA Times"

 

We'll see.

Edited April 11, 2015 by Shane

[Angel Oracle]

If anything, Arte learned that drugs can do two things: make a body more susceptible to injury ( numerous Hamilton injuries), and potentially be a media firestorm.

It's too late to turn back the clock, but the Players Assoc has to be shown that at least a compromise (pointed out by Mancini) is maybe best here, by say paying Hamilton $40-50 million of the $83 million owed and then releasing him.

[Lou]

Good. Can't say there are too many people who are gonna miss him.

Too bad we gave away Bourjos, would be nice to have him out there with Trout and Calhoun.

lol @ "we gave away Bourjos"