The Official 2017-2018 Hot Stove Thread

[Taylor]

14 minutes ago, Turd Ferguson said:

This article has a breakdown of what each team has left. We have $150k, which is toward the bottom of the heap:
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/rangers-can-offer-shohei-otani-money-not-much-may-think-230357634.html

Something something Baldoquin something something thanks, Dipoto!

[beatlesrule]

This was taken from today's MLBTR chat

 

CO

4:43

Any shot the Angels trade for Dee Gordon and sign Moose? What a deep lineup that would be...

 

Jason Martinez

4:45

I don't think they have the prospect talent to get Gordon. I think they'll sign one of the top free agents. Not sure how much they're willing to add to payroll, though. They need some starting pitching, too. Mous is an excellent fit and he's from Los Angeles.

[DMVol]

18 minutes ago, beatlesrule said:

This was taken from today's MLBTR chat

 

CO

4:43

Any shot the Angels trade for Dee Gordon and sign Moose? What a deep lineup that would be...

 

Jason Martinez

4:45

I don't think they have the prospect talent to get Gordon. I think they'll sign one of the top free agents. Not sure how much they're willing to add to payroll, though. They need some starting pitching, too. Mous is an excellent fit and he's from Los Angeles.

That's stupid and wrong on several levels...Gordon will be cheap if you take on his contract...Eppler and Scioscia have both said we're going to ride with the pitchers we have and look for offense....honestly, most of these guys know less than most of us....

[beatlesrule]

47 minutes ago, DMVol said:

That's stupid and wrong on several levels...Gordon will be cheap if you take on his contract...Eppler and Scioscia have both said we're going to ride with the pitchers we have and look for offense....honestly, most of these guys know less than most of us....

This came a little later:

HalosFanOR

6:07

Gordon to Angels is not all that bad of a fit... Halos have cash, and more intriguing prospects than the industry pretends (Barria comes to mind); Fish need to clear payroll. Why is my favorite baseball site, MLBTR, so quick to dismiss this as a legitimate possibility?

 

Jason Martinez

6:10

It's not that they don't have the prospects to acquire Gordon. Barria, Thaiss. Jahmai Jones and Jo Adell are really good prospects. Their farm system is slowly improving, but still not very deep. Why trade away 1-2 of their best prospects for a 2B when there are decent options on the FA market and other trade possibilities that wouldn't cost a top prospect?

 

Mike

6:11

Where will Neil Walker end up? Seems like an under appreciated player.

 

Jason Martinez

6:11

Angels seem like a good fit.

 

I agree that if Gordon is only payroll to get him but if Jason is right and he will cost prospects, Walker is the way to go.

[tdawg87]

Well he's definitely going to cost prospects but there's no way he costs any one of Adell, Jones, or Barria. If the Marlins ask for any of those guys you tell them to eat shit and play in traffic.

But I'd prefer Walker anyway so whatever.

[Ohtaniland]

13 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

Well he's definitely going to cost prospects but there's no way he costs any one of Adell, Jones, or Barria. If the Marlins ask for any of those guys you tell them to eat shit and play in traffic.

But I'd prefer Walker anyway so whatever.

Lol 

You know that we’re finally going to get Utley at second base. Eppler might even offer Napoli a job. 

Poor mans version of Gordon and Hosmer.

[ukyah]

6 hours ago, nando714 said:

hard pass

 

angels are out of the outfield market anyway. i have a hard time believing they want to trade calhoun just to bring in an extremely high priced FA. that doesn't seem like their plan at all.

[ten ocho recon scout]

6 hours ago, m0nkey said:

Don't know where to put this, but another death in baseball today.  

Red Sox #5 prospect (according to MLB.com) Daniel Flores died today from complications with cancer.  Just 17 years old, signed this year for $3.1 million.

Damn, thats sad. 17! 

Id imagine when he signed for that much, a physical was done. I wonder how soon this developed?

[ten ocho recon scout]

1 hour ago, Calzone said:

Lol 

You know that we’re finally going to get Utley at second base. Eppler might even offer Napoli a job. 

Poor mans version of Gordon and Hosmer.

Quit being stupid, we wont finally get chase utley to fix our 2B problem.

We will finally get chase headley to solve our 3B problem.

You were close, I acknowlege that.

[Ohtaniland]

3 hours ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

Quit being stupid, we wont finally get chase utley to fix our 2B problem.

We will finally get chase headley to solve our 3B problem.

You were close, I acknowlege that.

It will be Utley and Pluoffe coupled with another year of Maybin and we’ll see you all at spring training.

Oh and they will sign Otani.

[Docwaukee]

Not sure that the difference between 150k and 3.5mil is chump change to a guy who hasn't ever seen a big contract.  

I wonder if we see some sort of system manipulation like an 'option'  or something.  Don't think it really matter, he's going to the yanks.  

[Inside Pitch]

8 hours ago, ukyah said:

 

angels are out of the outfield market anyway. i have a hard time believing they want to trade calhoun just to bring in an extremely high priced FA. that doesn't seem like their plan at all.

Smartest thing Eppler has done is getting Upton set up early before the Boras hype train gets rolling -- check this ESPN article chock full of Boros quotes..    

http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/21344607/scott-boras-expects-arizona-diamondbacks-involved-free-agent-bidding-jd-martinez  

"Do any of them hit 40-something home runs and hit .300?" Boras said. "Neither have hit 40 in a season. You have to look at performance and say, 'Where is the performer who is comparable?' And you go from there. I don't believe any of those performers are in that place."

"He's a superstar talent," Boras told the Republic. "He's done things that few players have done."

Jay Bruce is also telling people he wants a 5 year deal...   So, yeah....  Getting an extra year and loweing the AAV may end being quite the deal.

[Inside Pitch]

3 hours ago, Dochalo said:

Not sure that the difference between 150k and 3.5mil is chump change to a guy who hasn't ever seen a big contract.  

I wonder if we see some sort of system manipulation like an 'option'  or something.  Don't think it really matter, he's going to the yanks.  

Check this out..... 

http://nypost.com/2017/11/08/mlb-has-tentative-shohei-otani-agreement-with-one-hurdle-left/  "Major League Baseball and its Japanese counterparts have reached a tentative understanding to grandfather the now-expired posting system for one more year, clearing yet another hurdle to facilitate Shohei Otani coming to an MLB team this offseason." 

If they do that it's essentially gift wrapping him to the Yanks.   

Up until now MLB had been saying they would act and act hard if there was even a trace the team that signs him ends up giving him a follow up contract out of line with the normal one for a second year player, but given how MLB knowingly and willingly tampered with the balls in the postseason after allowing a juiced ball during the season I have zero faith they would actually do anything, particularly if it were the Yankees and if they do grandfather the old system in they dont even have to deal with the possibility.

[Ohtaniland]

We can’t get butthurt now for not protecting or adding international pool slot money through smart trades. I believe the Yankees did that with the Sonny Gray trade. We as an organization have done a very poor job building a sustainable winning formula that would make us an attractable option for a guy like Otani. We really haven’t been a relevant organization in quite a while.

Billy Eppler is making some positive changes but we’re still 3-5 years away from being a noteworthy competitive firepower in this league. Yes Hamilton is finally off the books but his contract along with Albert’s were absolutely crippling. The fact that we are still trying to build around Trout after six seasons is inexcusable. 

[tdawg87]

14 minutes ago, Calzone said:

Billy Eppler is making some positive changes but we’re still 3-5 years away from being a noteworthy competitive firepower in this league.

I wonder if you said this in the 2003 offseason. 

[Jeff Fletcher]

5 hours ago, Dochalo said:

Not sure that the difference between 150k and 3.5mil is chump change to a guy who hasn't ever seen a big contract.  

I wonder if we see some sort of system manipulation like an 'option'  or something.  Don't think it really matter, he's going to the yanks.  

if that's all he's getting, then yeah, there's a difference between $300K and $3M. But he's going to make some huge sum from a marketing deal (or else he wouldn't even be doing this now), and within a few years he's going to sign a $50-100M deal. But the team he picks now is going to be the team he's stuck with. He'll start as a 0-3, with 6 years till free agency. Is he really going to go someplace he doesn't want to go for another $2M, when there's another $100M out there no matter what team he's on?

MLB has been very clear that they won't allow any sort of work-around to pay him up front, but at some point they won't be able to prevent it. Sometime in his first two years, a team will be able to sign him to whatever it wants, because there's a precedent for that happening already.

[gotbeer]

6 hours ago, Dochalo said:

Not sure that the difference between 150k and 3.5mil is chump change to a guy who hasn't ever seen a big contract.  

I wonder if we see some sort of system manipulation like an 'option'  or something.  Don't think it really matter, he's going to the yanks.  

You do know that he makes a bit over $2 million in Japan right?   

[gotbeer]

46 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

if that's all he's getting, then yeah, there's a difference between $300K and $3M. But he's going to make some huge sum from a marketing deal (or else he wouldn't even be doing this now), and within a few years he's going to sign a $50-100M deal. But the team he picks now is going to be the team he's stuck with. He'll start as a 0-3, with 6 years till free agency. Is he really going to go someplace he doesn't want to go for another $2M, when there's another $100M out there no matter what team he's on?

MLB has been very clear that they won't allow any sort of work-around to pay him up front, but at some point they won't be able to prevent it. Sometime in his first two years, a team will be able to sign him to whatever it wants, because there's a precedent for that happening already.

Puig or Maeda?  Puig has the clause that he can opt into arbitration once he hits 3 years of service time.  You could say with Ohtani after 2 years of service time if you treat him like a super 2.  So that wouldn't be technically skirting the rules.  Maeda was loaded with performance bonus.  He had game started (which could amount to $6.5 million a year) and innings pitched (which could amount to $3.5 million) on top of his $3 million international signing cap.  And they may have to redo his contract if they want to put him in the pen on a permanent basis.  I imagine with Ohtani, you will have the pitching bonus' (both starting and relieving) and the hitting bonus'.  

So even if you only offered $300k.  You could really load up the bonus' so that in theory he could make $20 million a year.  

[Jeff Fletcher]

15 minutes ago, gotbeer said:

Puig or Maeda?  Puig has the clause that he can opt into arbitration once he hits 3 years of service time.  You could say with Ohtani after 2 years of service time if you treat him like a super 2.  So that wouldn't be technically skirting the rules.  Maeda was loaded with performance bonus.  He had game started (which could amount to $6.5 million a year) and innings pitched (which could amount to $3.5 million) on top of his $3 million international signing cap.  And they may have to redo his contract if they want to put him in the pen on a permanent basis.  I imagine with Ohtani, you will have the pitching bonus' (both starting and relieving) and the hitting bonus'.  

So even if you only offered $300k.  You could really load up the bonus' so that in theory he could make $20 million a year.  

Well that would be a pretty obvious skirting of the rules, so it wouldn't be allowed. You can't do anything you wouldn't do with a normal international 17 year old from the Dominican.

Also, the rules are different now than they were with Puig and Maeda.

[Blarg]

Just now, Jeff Fletcher said:

Well that would be a pretty obvious skirting of the rules, so it wouldn't be allowed. You can't do anything you wouldn't do with a normal international 17 year old from the Dominican.

Also, the rules are different now than they were with Puig and Maeda.

Check his birth certificate to make sure he's not 25?

[gotbeer]

1 minute ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

Well that would be a pretty obvious skirting of the rules, so it wouldn't be allowed. You can't do anything you wouldn't do with a normal international 17 year old from the Dominican.

Also, the rules are different now than they were with Puig and Maeda.

So whatever team should just pay the millions to Ohtani's parents.  

[Blarg]

Go the NCAA route and make dad a coach.

[gotbeer]

4 minutes ago, Blarg said:

Check his birth certificate to make sure he's not 25?

[KDWells]

I'm just trying to avoid doing work and read Hot Stove rumors instead, so if these front office big wigs could cancel their vacations and get to making those splashy moves I would really appreciate it.

[Blarg]

Just when is it you think MLB GMs get vacation time? This isn't the 70's anymore when once your season was over you left the office until December, that's when sign free agents and make trades. 

Bill Stoneman was quoted as saying on retiring he wanted to spend time with his wife, the GM position had become 24/7/365 with Christmas off on leap years. 

A little exaggerated but even if Eppler took a week off he would still be on his cell phone and email making sure he never missed out on a deal.