Albert Pujols numbers not encouraging

[GrittyVeterans]

4 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

Yes pay him.

There is one tiny slice of optimism in the back of my brain that the Angels and Pujols are on the same project to get him 2000 rbi as fast as possible so he can leave gracefully with his milestone numbers.

If I knew that, I would be fine batting him where he hits.

It's just not happening man. The guy has given no indication that he won't play out the entire contract. Batting him 4th is just Scioscia being Scioscia

Like the post above by @Blarg says, they just need to cut him and let him sign with the Cardinals if he wants to pursue further milestones. That roster spot can be used on a younger player who might have some kind of upside

[Dick B Back]

55 minutes ago, TM3 said:

What is puzzling is that Scioscia is playing musical chairs with the batting lineup, everyone is getting shuffled around all except Pujols like this guy is untouchable.  Very weird.  

Mang got shuffled to the bench today. Happy?

[Dtwncbad]

4 minutes ago, GrittyVeterans said:

It's just not happening man. The guy has given no indication that he won't play out the entire contract. Batting him 4th is just Scioscia being Scioscia

Like the post above by @Blarg says, they just need to cut him and let him sign with the Cardinals if he wants to pursue further milestones. That roster spot can be used on a younger player who might have some kind of upside

They are not going to cut him.  They HAVE openly shown they want to respect his legacy by batting him where they bat him.  This is an important point.

Do you really think they are going to be dumb enough to bat this guy cleanup but suddenly smart enough to cut him?

So let's deal in reality.  They are going overboard to "respect" him regardless of performance.  Given that FACT, don't you think they might be trying to orchestrate an exit that makes sense for both Pujols and the Angels?

Let's get you your 2000 rbi, and Albert retires with all his milestones AND the additional legacy of being a middle of the order hitter his entire career.

Can someone say I am being optimistic amd unrealiatic here?  You bet.

But this is more realistic than to think they are going to be too dumb to move him down in the lineup but suddenly smart enough to cut him.

I personally believe the money part of it is already settled.  He will get every penny.  The optimism is the player and the team are in sync on how to end the book.

[Angelsjunky]

I'd like to see Albert batting 10th.

[eligrba]

How many more hit-less at bats does Albert need for his career avg to fall below .300?

He is accruing lots of them at an impressive rate.

[Glen]

1 hour ago, Angelsjunky said:

I'd like to see Albert batting 10th.

As tdawg said, benchth.

[Blarg]

1 hour ago, Dick B Back said:

Mang got shuffled to the bench today. Happy?

Yes. 

[Blarg]

1 hour ago, Dtwncbad said:

Let's get you your 2000 rbi, and Albert retires with all his milestones AND the additional legacy of being a middle of the order hitter his entire career.

Or win the wildcard. Tough decisions. 

[kevinb]

3 hours ago, Blarg said:

The way he is playing he won't make it this season. We are over a quarter of the way into the season and he has 21 rbi. In half as many plate appearances Ohtani has 17 batting behind him.

My bold prediction is by mid season Albert is batting behind Ohtani and spends more bench time in favor of Marte. 

No way do the Angels or Mike S sit Albert. If it was going to happen it would have happened a long time ago. 

[tomsred]

The funniest part of cutting Pujols is why would they do that before cutting Chris Young, Valbuena, Kinzler, Marte, or Calhoun for that matter.  If you want to cut all six, then bring up  Eric Young Jr, Cowart, Fletcher, Carter, Blash, and Fernandez.  

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[JarsOfClay]

16 hours ago, TM3 said:

What is puzzling is that Scioscia is playing musical chairs with the batting lineup, everyone is getting shuffled around all except Pujols like this guy is untouchable.  Very weird.  

I'm guessing Scioscia wants to get him more RBI opportunities to pad his HOF stats.

Whatever the reason, you have to seriously ask yourself why the angels would rather lose than move Pujols from the 4th spot or pinch run for him late in the game.

[Lou]

Of the players with more than 70 ABs, Pujols has the 5th highest BA and OPS on the team. We have bigger problems than him.

[Lou]

Hitless games (games played):

Pujols - 11 (43)

Trout - 17 (46)

[Inside Pitch]

23 hours ago, TM3 said:

What is puzzling is that Scioscia is playing musical chairs with the batting lineup, everyone is getting shuffled around all except Pujols like this guy is untouchable.  Very weird.  

I completely disagree with it -- but I get WHY they are doing it. 

The Angels from the top down have all publicly stated that Albert is still solid in situations where men are on base.   You look at his splits and he's got a .740 OPS with men on base .vs a 633 with nobody on.   He's got a .881 OPS in high leverage situations.   

Basically it comes down to his being less shitty with men on base -- put him at the bottom of the order where he belongs and he might be even worse if his splits are any indication.   I think they are trying to avoid a run of black hole bats (with Kole and Kinsler) at the bottom of the order.

So..  in closing -- it all sucks.

Edited May 21, 2018 by Inside Pitch

[Dtwncbad]

20 hours ago, Blarg said:

Or win the wildcard. Tough decisions. 

I understand your point and believe me I care more about winning that managing Albert.  I think I have said more than enough times that Pujols on the roster at all is a major obstacle to other opportunities, and how not having those opportunities may ultimately cost the Angels.

My comments are only attempting to consider how they are treating Albert now, and then base a plausible explanation of what could happen going forward based on the reality of how they are treating him.

I cannot reasonably hope they will bench him or cut him or drop him in the order right now.  There is not a single piece of information that would let me hope that.

I can, at the very least, HOPE they are going to bat him 4th to get him to 2k rbi as fast as possible and hope the organization is massaging him to exit in a window where he has all his milestones, doesn't mess up his .300 batting average milestone,  and doesn't want to linger on with really nothing else to gain except money (and I already said the Angels would have to just pay him in full to take this last incentive for him to linger away).

Its the only thing I can reasonably hope for.

[Angel Oracle]

35 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

I understand your point and believe me I care more about winning that managing Albert.  I think I have said more than enough times that Pujols on the roster at all is a major obstacle to other opportunities, and how not having those opportunities may ultimately cost the Angels.

My comments are only attempting to consider how they are treating Albert now, and then base a plausible explanation of what could happen going forward based on the reality of how they are treating him.

I cannot reasonably hope they will bench him or cut him or drop him in the order right now.  There is not a single piece of information that would let me hope that.

I can, at the very least, HOPE they are going to bat him 4th to get him to 2k rbi as fast as possible and hope the organization is massaging him to exit in a window where he has all his milestones, doesn't mess up his .300 batting average milestone,  and doesn't want to linger on with really nothing else to gain except money (and I already said the Angels would have to just pay him in full to take this last incentive for him to linger away).

Its the only thing I can reasonably hope for.

This would clearly point to Strad's thought, that I'm in agreement on.   That Pujols retires after 2019, which should get him 2000 rbis and keep the BA over .300.   Just spread out the remaining $59 million at that point over 8-10 years.

Not as big of a deal if he doesn't catch Mays for 5th spot in HRs 

[FanSince'98]

On 5/19/2018 at 3:42 PM, ten ocho recon scout said:

We hire that guy to figure out the loophole for eppler, than get pujols' agent and get him to testify.

How is medical retirement insurance fraud? It happened with Fielder, while uncommon, if a player is forced into retirement due to injury they all have insurance to cover what he would've been owed if he wasn't injured. It's kind of like professional athlete worker's compensation, but the question is does that count against our payroll or not? Not fraud. 

[T.G.]

I think this notion that Pujols is going to retire after he reaches all his milestones is a pipe dream.  Albert doesn't care about advanced metrics and what his WAR is... he points to things like RBI's and feels justified in what he's doing.  Right or wrong.  It is what it is.

Some pretend like they know what's in his mind and in his heart.  Some think that finishing his career with something less than a .300 batting average would be something he'd like to avoid.  There are all kinds of posts about Pujols' motives, etc. - but the fact remains none of us know what is inside of him.  Not one of us.  No one.

It's crazy to read speculation that he has it in his contract that he has to hit in the middle of the order, etc.  Or that all he does is swing for homeruns.  I don't know what world some of you are living in. 

All I know is that it appears that he still has the respect and adoration of Mike Trout and the rest of his teammates.  He still works hard and prepares like he always has.  He's not mailing it in.  The results just aren't there. 

Albert is not the problem.  He's a part of the problem, but it's not all on him. 

The time and energy some of you put into hating on Albert is insane.  What's worse is that some of you want him to fail and I don't get that.  It's an unhealthy obsession, IMO.

Albert is definitely not what he once was and it's not even close.  I get it.  We all get it. 

I drank the cool aid and bought into the off-season reports of his losing weight, etc. It hasn't worked out so far.  Ok.  Fine.  Again - he's not the problem. 

Inside Pitch posted some perfectly good reasons why he continues to bat in the middle of the lineup.  That's what we have right now. That's it. 

This team has several players who are under performing.  Several!  And yet - they're in the hunt.  It's a long season.  I trust Eppler will continue to try and improve the team.  The offense is going to be fine over the course of the year.  The sky is not falling. 

[Taylor]

9 hours ago, Lou said:

Hitless games (games played):

Pujols - 11 (43)

Trout - 17 (46)

To be fair, in Trout's hitless games, he tends to walk at least a couple times. There was an article about how his WAR has increased in some of his hitless games.

[Dtwncbad]

1 hour ago, True Grich said:

I think this notion that Pujols is going to retire after he reaches all his milestones is a pipe dream.  Albert doesn't care about advanced metrics and what his WAR is... he points to things like RBI's and feels justified in what he's doing.  Right or wrong.  It is what it is.

Some pretend like they know what's in his mind and in his heart.  Some think that finishing his career with something less than a .300 batting average would be something he'd like to avoid.  There are all kinds of posts about Pujols' motives, etc. - but the fact remains none of us know what is inside of him.  Not one of us.  No one.

It's crazy to read speculation that he has it in his contract that he has to hit in the middle of the order, etc.  Or that all he does is swing for homeruns.  I don't know what world some of you are living in. 

All I know is that it appears that he still has the respect and adoration of Mike Trout and the rest of his teammates.  He still works hard and prepares like he always has.  He's not mailing it in.  The results just aren't there. 

Albert is not the problem.  He's a part of the problem, but it's not all on him. 

The time and energy some of you put into hating on Albert is insane.  What's worse is that some of you want him to fail and I don't get that.  It's an unhealthy obsession, IMO.

Albert is definitely not what he once was and it's not even close.  I get it.  We all get it. 

I drank the cool aid and bought into the off-season reports of his losing weight, etc. It hasn't worked out so far.  Ok.  Fine.  Again - he's not the problem. 

Inside Pitch posted some perfectly good reasons why he continues to bat in the middle of the lineup.  That's what we have right now. That's it. 

This team has several players who are under performing.  Several!  And yet - they're in the hunt.  It's a long season.  I trust Eppler will continue to try and improve the team.  The offense is going to be fine over the course of the year.  The sky is not falling. 

Pujols is 24th among 1B in WAR so farvthis year, with absolutely no indication there is any chance on earth this is going to do anything but get worse.

I understand the team is doing pretty well and there are other players underperforming but what does that really have to do with a discussion about the Angels terrible production at 1B?

And talking about Pujols not being good anymore is not hating Albert Pujols.  I love Pujols.  I dont recall in my life any individual hitter over a decade that was more scary, and he sure seems to be a grown man in his personal life (which is getting more rare among pro athletes).

Not that doesn't mean I have to pretend he is still good does it?

I also trust Eppler to improve the team.  I predict he has probably has some kind of plan that isnt just "have the worst 1B in baseball"  for the next three years, or would that be Eppler hating Pujols?

Relax.  Talking about what they Angels could do in this situation is just normal fan behavior.

[Make Angels Great Again]

10 hours ago, Lou said:

Hitless games (games played):

Pujols - 11 (43)

Trout - 17 (46)

 

Games without reaching base safely:

Pujols - 10

Trout - 7 (one of them being a game with 1 PA late)

[T.G.]

1 hour ago, Dtwncbad said:

Pujols is 24th among 1B in WAR so farvthis year, with absolutely no indication there is any chance on earth this is going to do anything but get worse.

I understand the team is doing pretty well and there are other players underperforming but what does that really have to do with a discussion about the Angels terrible production at 1B?

And talking about Pujols not being good anymore is not hating Albert Pujols.  I love Pujols.  I dont recall in my life any individual hitter over a decade that was more scary, and he sure seems to be a grown man in his personal life (which is getting more rare among pro athletes).

Not that doesn't mean I have to pretend he is still good does it?

I also trust Eppler to improve the team.  I predict he has probably has some kind of plan that isnt just "have the worst 1B in baseball"  for the next three years, or would that be Eppler hating Pujols?

Relax.  Talking about what they Angels could do in this situation is just normal fan behavior.

There is a distinct difference between talking about Albert's terrible production and "hating" on him.  I'm sure you know that.  But thank you for taking my words and trying to make this about something it's not.  I made a broad statement and obviously that doesn't pertain to everyone talking about Albert.  No one is pretending he's still good.   My post is more about people thinking they know his motivations, etc.  Sorry, I wasn't more clear for you.

I'm very relaxed - but thank you for trying to make it look like I'm upset or on edge.  Again - talking about the situation is fine - but again - you know as well as I do that some people here are just pushing the same old narrative and that's what my post is more about than anything else.

[Angel Oracle]

So much for hit #3000 relaxing Albert and spurring him to do better:

Past 45 at bats since that game on May 4 = .222/.311/.267/.578 with 0 HRs, 2 rbis, 2 doubles, ELEVEN K's!!!!   

[ten ocho recon scout]

3 hours ago, FanSince'98 said:

How is medical retirement insurance fraud? It happened with Fielder, while uncommon, if a player is forced into retirement due to injury they all have insurance to cover what he would've been owed if he wasn't injured. It's kind of like professional athlete worker's compensation, but the question is does that count against our payroll or not? Not fraud. 

I was just making a joke from cals' joke, saying that capone went to prison for tax evasion, so maybe we can hire the nerdy untouchables guy to put it together. But he died in that movie, so it would be tough.

[Angel Oracle]

39 minutes ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

I was just making a joke from cals' joke, saying that capone went to prison for tax evasion, so maybe we can hire the nerdy untouchables guy to put it together. But he died in that movie, so it would be tough.

They needed to stop killing off Charlie Martin Smith characters.   He also goes MIA in Vietnam, during the American Graffiti credits.