Angels in on Turner!?!?!?!?!

[Troll Daddy]

6 minutes ago, WeatherWonk said:

I love it when mods tell members to take a hike from the website, simply for expressing their opinions. It's just so darn mature and professional.

Then, they defend all the other puerile behavior on this board with "hey, man, it's the internet".

Par for the course

[AngelsLakersFan]

5 hours ago, ettin said:

I sincerely believe by the time the 2017 season starts we will have a team strong enough to effectively compete. Will it be a really strong foundation? Probably not but it will be enough to give the A.L. West a run for its money. 2018 should be even better.

Just like last year. "With just about any of the available LFers and a decent second basemen this team is post season bound!"

For all we know we may have already made our big splash. 

[Ohtaniland]

4 minutes ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

Just like last year. "With just about any of the available LFers and a decent second basemen this team is post season bound!"

For all we know we may have already made our big splash. 

I don't believe a big splash was even considered this offseason. As I've mentioned before in a prior thread, I would not be surprised to see Arte actually reduce his budget this season for two reasons.

1) There's not enough impact talent available at a reasonable cost (and with Hamilton still on the books) that would have enough impact to send us to a championship.

2) We have 2 frontline pitchers that won't be available until 2018 so Arte is not interested in spending much (wasting money) this season.

Eppler will take a much different approach in 2018. The stench of Dipoto still lingers in the FO.

[Hubs]

49 minutes ago, CALZONE said:

I don't believe a big splash was even considered this offseason. As I've mentioned before in a prior thread, I would not be surprised to see Arte actually reduce his budget this season for two reasons.

1) There's not enough impact talent available at a reasonable cost (and with Hamilton still on the books) that would have enough impact to send us to a championship.

2) We have 2 frontline pitchers that won't be available until 2018 so Arte is not interested in spending much (wasting money) this season.

Eppler will take a much different approach in 2018. The stench of Dipoto still lingers in the FO.

I don't see them adding anyone except a 2B. And maybe another reliever. Turner would be a huge get, and expensive, and would require Escobar to likely play 2b, which may be a problem. But I don't see them adding another top starter unless they can get a guy on a 1 year prove it type deal, or maybe a non-tender. Like Santiago? 

[nikkachez]

1 hour ago, Hubs said:

I don't see them adding anyone except a 2B. And maybe another reliever. Turner would be a huge get, and expensive, and would require Escobar to likely play 2b, which may be a problem. But I don't see them adding another top starter unless they can get a guy on a 1 year prove it type deal, or maybe a non-tender. Like Santiago? 

 

This is definitely the most likely outcome. Mike Moustakas could be an option next winter, maybe save a majority of the spending flexibility for next offseason? He'll be three years younger than Turner, left-handed bat, good defender, put it together in 2015 then had the bad luck this year with his ACL, fantastic at making contact. Moustakas, Simmons, ?, and Cron would make for a pretty sweet infield. Still have to figure something out at second, but they'll have a toooon of cash to spend next winter. 

[totdprods]

13 minutes ago, nikkachez said:

This is definitely the most likely outcome. Mike Moustakas could be an option next winter, maybe save a majority of the spending flexibility for next offseason? He'll be three years younger than Turner, left-handed bat, good defender, put it together in 2015 then had the bad luck this year with his ACL, fantastic at making contact. Moustakas, Simmons, ?, and Cron would make for a pretty sweet infield. Still have to figure something out at second, but they'll have a toooon of cash to spend next winter. 

I'm intrigued by next year's FA SP class more than anything. It's part of the reason why I don't want them committing to more than one year for any FA SP they sign this year. Too many good options next year, from top of rotation guys like Darvish, Tanaka, Arrieta, numerous younger guys who could take a step forward, and several solid older vets who could shore up the bottom of the rotation. We can try and cash in some lotto tickets in the rotation in '17 and see where we win, and then invest in a legitimate arm next winter.

[SlappyUtilityMIF]

3 hours ago, nikkachez said:

This is definitely the most likely outcome. Mike Moustakas could be an option next winter, maybe save a majority of the spending flexibility for next offseason? He'll be three years younger than Turner, left-handed bat, good defender, put it together in 2015 then had the bad luck this year with his ACL, fantastic at making contact. Moustakas, Simmons, ?, and Cron would make for a pretty sweet infield. Still have to figure something out at second, but they'll have a toooon of cash to spend next winter. 

I don't see the Royals letting Moose walk.

 

3 hours ago, totdprods said:

I'm intrigued by next year's FA SP class more than anything. It's part of the reason why I don't want them committing to more than one year for any FA SP they sign this year. Too many good options next year, from top of rotation guys like Darvish, Tanaka, Arrieta, numerous younger guys who could take a step forward, and several solid older vets who could shore up the bottom of the rotation. We can try and cash in some lotto tickets in the rotation in '17 and see where we win, and then invest in a legitimate arm next winter.

Darvish and Tanaka scare me. I would never trust their arms after reading that they were throwing 180+ pitches and 12 innings in high school.... That's a ton of wear on arms whether they are returning from surgery or not. The liability is there and I believe more so on the entire arm in regards to Pacific Rim pitchers.... Elbow, Shoulder/rotator cuff and capsule/labrum.

 

Maybe, just me~    I'd pass.

[totdprods]

10 hours ago, SlappyUtilityMIF said:

I don't see the Royals letting Moose walk.

Darvish and Tanaka scare me. I would never trust their arms after reading that they were throwing 180+ pitches and 12 innings in high school.... That's a ton of wear on arms whether they are returning from surgery or not. The liability is there and I believe more so on the entire arm in regards to Pacific Rim pitchers.... Elbow, Shoulder/rotator cuff and capsule/labrum.

Maybe, just me~    I'd pass.

As with any FA, or any player really, there's risk. Hiroki Kuroda averaged 180 innings for 17 seasons from age 25 to 41.
Neither of them would necessarily be my top targets, just pointing out that there's a dearth of arms next season, and we stand to have a cheap, controllable, and talented rotation that could be nicely supplemented adding a free agent SP - either roll the dice on a potential #1-2 guy like Arrieta, Tanaka, Darvish, Arrieta, or a more durable, consistent mid or back of rotation type. 

Arrieta, Buchholz, Cain, Cashner, Chatwood, Chen, Cobb, Colon, Cueto, Darvish, Duffy, Eovaldi, Gallardo, Garcia, Gio Gonzalez, Miguel Gonzalez, Hellickson, Jimenez, Kennedy, Lackey, Liriano, Lynn, Miley, Minor, Moore, Nolasco, Pineda, Ross, Sanchez, Santiago, Tanaka, Tillman, Tomlin, Vargas are all SPs who have a good chance of hitting FA as it stands presently. Lots and lots to choose from. 

I have a hunch the Angels are going to be looking at someone like Trevor Cahill this season as another Chavez-like arm. Someone who can relieve and start.

[Troll Daddy]

Is there any truth that a pitchers arm wears down through many years of pitching? or is it just poor management (diet/stretching/extreme use during a game or season)? or type of pitches.

 

[mtangelsfan]

20 hours ago, WeatherWonk said:

I love it when mods tell members to take a hike from the website, simply for expressing their opinions. It's just so darn mature and professional.

Then, they defend all the other puerile behavior on this board with "hey, man, it's the internet".

I think you are overstating.  Nobody is being banned, nobody is being edited.

I love it when the rest of the board think that mods shouldn't have opinions.

[eaterfan]

On 11/28/2016 at 6:19 AM, Glen said:

http://dlvr.it/MlnR9b

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/the-dodgers-payroll-situation-is-far-from-dire/

They probably still will be able to sign both if they want to.

[m0nkey]

I love it when people say "I love it" when they don't really love it

[beatlesrule]

I really wish people here wouldn't have such high hopes for the offseason.  You are setting yourselves up for disappointment.  I sound like a broken record but Arte does not want to spend the money it will take to make his team a threat.  Justin Turner is not the missing piece.  Like it's already been stated, we would even have a healthy rotation until 2018.  Prepare for more and more and more threads and posts about how he is wasting Mike Trout.  The Angels won't sign Turner and they won't win the World Series in 2017 or even make the playoffs.  I know being realistic is the same as being negative but I really don't understand why folks here can't grasp the concept of the situation the Angels are in.

[Stradling]

Just now, beatlesrule said:

I really wish people here wouldn't have such high hope for the offseason.  You are setting yourselves up for disappointment.  I sound like a broken record but Arte does not want to spend the money it will take to make his team a threat.  Justin Turner is not the missing piece.  Like it's already been stated, we would even have a healthy rotation until 2018.  Prepare for more and more and more threads and posts about how he is wasting Mike Trout.  The Angels won't sign Turner and they won't win the World Series in 2017 or even make the playoffs.

Or you could simply stay out of threads that don't match your narrative.  You very well could be right, but I'm sure the optimists have been fans long enough to know how to handle disappointment. 

[SlappyUtilityMIF]

7 hours ago, totdprods said:

As with any FA, or any player really, there's risk. Hiroki Kuroda averaged 180 innings for 17 seasons from age 25 to 41.
Neither of them would necessarily be my top targets, just pointing out that there's a dearth of arms next season, and we stand to have a cheap, controllable, and talented rotation that could be nicely supplemented adding a free agent SP - either roll the dice on a potential #1-2 guy like Arrieta, Tanaka, Darvish, Arrieta, or a more durable, consistent mid or back of rotation type. 

Arrieta, Buchholz, Cain, Cashner, Chatwood, Chen, Cobb, Colon, Cueto, Darvish, Duffy, Eovaldi, Gallardo, Garcia, Gio Gonzalez, Miguel Gonzalez, Hellickson, Jimenez, Kennedy, Lackey, Liriano, Lynn, Miley, Minor, Moore, Nolasco, Pineda, Ross, Sanchez, Santiago, Tanaka, Tillman, Tomlin, Vargas are all SPs who have a good chance of hitting FA as it stands presently. Lots and lots to choose from. 

I have a hunch the Angels are going to be looking at someone like Trevor Cahill this season as another Chavez-like arm. Someone who can relieve and start.

See below~

Arrieta - I would be interested in his services! And he isn't going to be cheap.

Buchholz - Possibly a change of scenery will do him good.

Cain - Aging and arm injuries the last couple seasons if he drops some innings in 2017 (170+) I might make a move on him in 2018.

Cashner - Good arm hasn't had the results or the mindset as a true #1 or top of the rotation "The GUY type" but the ability and arm were there early on.

Chatwood - Not going back no matter what he costs! Soft tossing guys.... I don't want to roll into a long term deal and have another Weaver issue play out in the future.

Chen - Meh~

Cobb - I'm in!

Colon - The dude is going to be 46.... "Let him go Bull"

Cueto - If he opts out I opt in!

Darvish - scary no thanks!

Duffy - I think he could be a steal didn't have much success early on then settled into a bully/swing roll. I like the arm and he's a lefty! I would like to see him put 200+ innings in just out of the rotation. I don't know if the Royals will allow that.

Eovaldi - Might be a flier guy. Might also be done!....

Gallardo - I liked him early with the Brewers after watching him pitch for the Rangers and O's.... His arm is shot gradual drop of innings each year and the K's are dropping just as fast hits are rising and bombs are increasing....R U N! Don't walk~

Garcia - Underrated always hurt. Flip a coin as to which you buy!

Gio Gonzalez - I like him. I've wanted him. He's a 500 winning % guy! and will give a ton of innings! I'm in again! mid to back end guy long term this lefty will age well.

Miguel Gonzalez - We signed him out of an adult beer league in 2004 he's ok. Just not great. If we had payroll issues and needed a very cheap arm ok...I want a TOP of Rotation guy or a very good back end dude! He would do well to sign long term in Colorado and just get hammered!

Hellickson - Maybe, let's see what he does in 2017 for 17.5M

Jimenez - Toast Mentally and he can't find the plate! Let him sign with the Pirates! If Searage can fix him then he should be named Supreme Ruler of the USA.

Kennedy - Maybe, back end guy! Just doesn't make me start to unravel.

Lackey - Let Mr. Ed go elswhere! FTG

Liriano - Arm may have finally hit another wall last year.... I bail.

Lynn - Interested! Coming back from TJ.... See what he does in 2017

Miley - Interested as the same as Gio Gonzalez back end Lefty.

Minor - Hasn't pitched since 2014... WTF>?

Moore - I'm in he would be my #1B........

Nolasco - No... It is my hope he builds off last year after he was traded here and then his arm falls off the day after the close of the 2017 season!

Pineda - How many arm injuries till they start falling off?

Ross - meh~ 

Sanchez - No! 

Santiago - Been there done that!

Tanaka - Scared of Pacific Rim arm issues.

Tillman - I might like him around I wouldn't break the Bank!

Tomlin - back end guy that wouldn't hurt you. He knows how to pitch! 

Vargas - Been there done that. Will he ever have another full season?....Doubt it!

[beatlesrule]

15 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Or you could simply stay out of threads that don't match your narrative.  You very well could be right, but I'm sure the optimists have been fans long enough to know how to handle disappointment. 

Who pissed in your cheerios?

[totdprods]

Point is, at this point I would rather focus on next year's SP class. Almost all of those above are more interesting than Hill, Nova, and....? Feldman? Hammel?

We are actually going to be in a position where we will likely need to address LF, 3B, 2B, UT IF, 4th OF. Marte may be able to handle one of those, but Calhoun and Cron also start to become quite a little more realistically tradeable in a year. Not sure if Turner would be the answer this offseason, but I can see why Eppler may be interested in finding one more long-term offensive piece this offseason.

[Ohtaniland]

31 minutes ago, beatlesrule said:

I really wish people here wouldn't have such high hope for the offseason.  You are setting yourselves up for disappointment.  I sound like a broken record but Arte does not want to spend the money it will take to make his team a threat.  Justin Turner is not the missing piece.  Like it's already been stated, we would even have a healthy rotation until 2018.  Prepare for more and more and more threads and posts about how he is wasting Mike Trout.  The Angels won't sign Turner and they won't win the World Series in 2017 or even make the playoffs.

For some fans it's very difficult to understand why their favorite team won't sign their new favorite free agent. It's not rocket science. All Eppler has to do is look at the back of the players baseball card to see how good he is. 

[Inside Pitch]

43 minutes ago, beatlesrule said:

I really wish people here wouldn't have such high hopes for the offseason.  You are setting yourselves up for disappointment.  I sound like a broken record but Arte does not want to spend the money it will take to make his team a threat.  Justin Turner is not the missing piece.  Like it's already been stated, we would even have a healthy rotation until 2018.  Prepare for more and more and more threads and posts about how he is wasting Mike Trout.  The Angels won't sign Turner and they won't win the World Series in 2017 or even make the playoffs.  I know being realistic is the same as being negative but I really don't understand why folks here can't grasp the concept of the situation the Angels are in.

Likewise I wish people who claimed to be realistic didn't really just mean they think they know whats really up...    

Realistically, based on projections the Angels are an 85 win team -- that's not homer driven optimism that's an unbiased data based guess.  Realistically for that to happen they need to avoid injuries.... it's not smart to count on perfect health so they need to add some depth still.   I'm a realist, I don't expect them to play up to those numbers but I know better than to think they couldn't, they need to be both smart, and lucky.  I've said I don't believe they will add any marquee names, I don't believe they are in a position where they can control their own destinies as in other years but I've watched baseball long enough to expect the unexpected.

Feel free to preach caution -- just spare us the talk about who is being realistic or what that even means...

[Glen]

40 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Or you could simply stay out of threads that don't match your narrative.  You very well could be right, but I'm sure the optimists have been fans long enough to know how to handle disappointment. 

 

This may be the truest thing ever said on this board.

[mtangelsfan]

I am an Angels fan and a Browns fan.

I'm also an optimist.  I'm quite used to being disappointed.  

[Stradling]

13 minutes ago, Glen said:

 

This may be the truest thing ever said on this board.

You mean I didn't eat pissed soaked cheerios?

[CanadianHalo]

18 minutes ago, mtangelsfan said:

I am an Angels fan and a Browns fan.

I'm also an optimist.  I'm quite used to being disappointed.  

Im sorry to hear that 

[AngelsLakersFan]

51 minutes ago, beatlesrule said:

Who pissed in your cheerios double double?

FIFY

[Ohtaniland]

31 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Likewise I wish people who claimed to be realistic didn't really just mean they think they know whats really up...    

Realistically, based on projections the Angels are an 85 win team -- that's not homer driven optimism that's an unbiased data based guess.  Realistically for that to happen they need to avoid injuries.... it's not smart to count on perfect health so they need to add some depth still.   I'm a realist, I don't expect them to play up to those numbers but I know better than to think they couldn't, they need to be both smart, and lucky.  I've said I don't believe they will add any marquee names, I don't believe they are in a position where they can control their own destinies as in other years but I've watched baseball long enough to expect the unexpected.

Feel free to preach caution -- just spare us the talk about who is being realistic or what that even means...

Or this is a message board that all walks of life come together and express their opinions. Opinions is what you'll get here and it's not a bakery so why try to sugar coat anything. Don't be mad when it's not something you want to hear.