Official 2021-22 Hot Stove League Thread.

[Angel Oracle]

1 minute ago, totdprods said:

They're in very good shape heading into the lockout. We are basically right at 2021 payroll levels. They've added two SP, retained the closer, and added one more plus bullpen arm. 

Would not surprised me if they flipped the switch from proactivity to being more opportunistic once the lockout ends. There will be a ton of free agents available still and I'm assuming not much time before the season begins. It'll be a good climate for nabbing some impact on one-year deals. Maybe someone like Mark Melancon or Brad Hand fails to find a closing opportunity. The corner outfield market is a little thick, perhaps you get someone like Joc Pederson or Tommy Pham or Jorge Soler for 1/$10m. Angels could still revisit Marsh for Meyer and add another potential MLB-ready SP into the mix.

Guys like Chris Archer, Danny Duffy, Vince Velasquez, Aaron Sanchez, Chad Kuhl, Jordan Lyles, Martin Perez, Jacob Junis, Mike Foltynewicz all have some viability of being solid pick-ups on the cheap. 

Can’t forget Ryan Tepera, he seems to be the forgotten reliever in FA.  Has had solid success in the late innings.

[Dtwncbad]

I am not comfortable with “they have added two starting pitchers.”  They have added one, and added a reliever they will let TRY to be a starter.

I am not ripping on Lorenzen but I don’t view him as any kind of lock to be better than the parade of bodies the Angels have marched out there over the last couple of years.

We all hope he is good.  But I view him as a lottery ticket, and not evidence that they have added what they need to the rotation.

 

[Stradling]

 

[totdprods]

1 minute ago, Angel Oracle said:

Can’t forget Ryan Tepera, he seems to be the forgotten reliever in FA.  Has had solid success in the late innings.

Yup. There's a lot of solid arms on the relief market still. I don't know that they'd move on someone of his profile quite yet, but would not surprise me if they added one more RP at $5m-$8m AAV before all is said and done. I actually think that will be more likely than another SP or a SS or RF. We may disagree, but there's enough internal options to at least start with at those positions coming out of the gate.

If I was building this team, I'd try to add one more vet RP like mentioned above, and then replicate the $1m deals for Watson and Cishek at the close of winter again. Not those two (necessarily) but something similar, and start the season with the new kid relievers mostly in AAA, ready to roll out once the $1m gambles flopped and were DFAed. Short leash. Build depth. Maybe you get lucky. Watson finished the year very strong.

[totdprods]

1 minute ago, Stradling said:

 

Morosi posted the Rangers were looking into these guys the same minute this was posted.

[Stradling]

I’d love to get one of them at the right price.  Obviously Castillo is the guy I want but if the cost is Adell and Detmers I’m not down with that. 

[wopphil]

3 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

I am not comfortable with “they have added two starting pitchers.”  They have added one, and added a reliever they will let TRY to be a starter.

I am not ripping on Lorenzen but I don’t view him as any kind of lock to be better than the parade of bodies the Angels have marched out there over the last couple of years.

We all hope he is good.  But I view him as a lottery ticket, and not evidence that they have added what they need to the rotation.

 

Not only this, but the starter they added is a massive injury risk. They absolutely cannot rest on what they have done. A dependable starter with a track record of being able to make 30 starts - e.g., Castillo or Stroman - is still necessary. 

[DMVol]

5 minutes ago, Stradling said:

 

Mahle had a really good year in 21.....wouldn't be surprised to see us trade for him or Gray....probably makes more sense than overpaying for Stroman, if we can get it done....I was pleasantly surprised with the Iglesias signing and, if he pulls off a trade for a solid starter, I'll give Minasian a thumbs up....

[totdprods]

4 minutes ago, Stradling said:

I’d love to get one of them at the right price.  Obviously Castillo is the guy I want but if the cost is Adell and Detmers I’m not down with that. 

100% agree. I'd part with Adell and Bachman for Castillo if the cost didn't go much beyond that, but otherwise think nabbing any one of them would be huge. 

Would have to think that with what @Inside Pitch said about them wanting pitching matches up really well with our last two drafts. I'd be pretty open to a quantity over quality package for Gray or Mahle. Give them any 2-3 of our recent pitching draftees not named Bachman or Adell, maybe a SS prospect. See if you can pry back Amir Garrett as a wild-card relief arm.

[Warfarin]

12 minutes ago, Stradling said:

 

I don’t see how a last minute trade is possible.  They’d have to agree to the trade and then get those guys in to have physicals by 859pm tonight.

[DMVol]

1 minute ago, Warfarin said:

I don’t see how a last minute trade is possible.  They’d have to agree to the trade and then get those guys in to have physicals by 859pm tonight.

I think you could agree to the trade "pending physicals", even with the lock out looming....if something shows up later in the week or whenever the physicals get done, no trade.....the lock out wouldn't prohibit you from nullifying a trade, I wouldn't think.....

[Blarg]

I am so fucking tired of having only two outfielders the last 5 years that the thought of trading one of Adell or Marsh sickens me. Buy a damn pitcher but leave those two guys alone. 

[Warfarin]

Just now, DMVol said:

I think you could agree to the trade "pending physicals", even with the lock out looming....if something shows up later in the week or whenever the physicals get done, no trade.....the lock out wouldn't prohibit you from nullifying a trade, I wouldn't think.....

I don't think they can actually have trade consummated after 859pm though. So if they agree to a trade, they can't actually sign off on the trade without the physicals, I would think?

[Dtwncbad]

2 minutes ago, wopphil said:

Not only this, but the starter they added is a massive injury risk. They absolutely cannot rest on what they have done. A dependable starter with a track record of being able to make 30 starts - e.g., Castillo or Stroman - is still necessary. 

Yes.  As fans we always want things to root for.  We now have some new things to root for.  But we should not confuse that with believing the team has adequately actually “fixed” what needs to be fixed.

It is possible Syndergaard is a beast, etc.

But I think if the team is serious about winning they should still be doing everything in their power right now to acquire a healthy, established  #2ish starter.

[halonatic13]

Just finished watching highlights of Castillo.  That changeup is NUTS!  Give them Adell, Bachman & Canning.  That has to be enough.

[totdprods]

8 minutes ago, Blarg said:

I am so fucking tired of having only two outfielders the last 5 years that the thought of trading one of Adell or Marsh sickens me. Buy a damn pitcher but leave those two guys alone. 

I really want them to snag one of the FA OFs for like 1/$5m-$12m, even if we don't trade anyone. Flip 'em at the deadline if the kids are ready. 

Jorge Soler would be a great add, IMO. Worst case scenario he's basically an expensive version of Jo Adell. Low contact, lots of strikeouts, iffy defense, still has big power. Best case scenario he's a huge offensive boon for a year. He may be fine with a one-year too, because a universal DH would greatly expand his market next year.

Edited December 1, 2021 by totdprods

[totdprods]

1 minute ago, halonatic13 said:

Just finished watching highlights of Castillo.  That changeup is NUTS!  Give them Adell, Bachman & Canning.  That has to be enough.

And we saw how much the Halos got out of changeups last year, especially with Sandoval. 

[Dtwncbad]

4 minutes ago, Blarg said:

I am so fucking tired of having only two outfielders the last 5 years that the thought of trading one of Adell or Marsh sickens me. Buy a damn pitcher but leave those two guys alone. 

And many others are “so fucking tired” of having a subpar rotation.

I don’t want to NOT have Marsh or Adell.   But I also believe it is easier to find a third outfielder that it is to get the quality starting pitching the team needs.

[Stradling]

14 minutes ago, Warfarin said:

I don’t see how a last minute trade is possible.  They’d have to agree to the trade and then get those guys in to have physicals by 859pm tonight.

 

[Dtwncbad]

18 minutes ago, totdprods said:

100% agree. I'd part with Adell and Bachman for Castillo if the cost didn't go much beyond that, but otherwise think nabbing any one of them would be huge. 

Would have to think that with what @Inside Pitch said about them wanting pitching matches up really well with our last two drafts. I'd be pretty open to a quantity over quality package for Gray or Mahle. Give them any 2-3 of our recent pitching draftees not named Bachman or Adell, maybe a SS prospect. See if you can pry back Amir Garrett as a wild-card relief arm.

Just curious if you have considered that:

1). Detmers might bring more back in a trade than Bachman

2). Bachman with his arsenal could have a shot at being a damn good reliever as soon as this year, which the Angels could really use

[CanadianHalo]

 

[DMVol]

10 minutes ago, Warfarin said:

I don't think they can actually have trade consummated after 859pm though. So if they agree to a trade, they can't actually sign off on the trade without the physicals, I would think?

I'm not sure.....There were some trades yesterday and Monday.  Not sure whether physicals can get done that quickly but maybe so.  If you are going big---Castillo, Mahle, Gray or somebody like that---you'd want to be pretty comfortable with the medical.  

[totdprods]

Just now, Dtwncbad said:

Just curious if you have considered that:

1). Detmers might bring more back in a trade than Bachman

2). Bachman with his arsenal could have a shot at being a damn good reliever as soon as this year, which the Angels could really use

Absolutely. That's why I'd rather keep Detmers. I'm actually pretty on-board the idea of Bachman being a reliever even on the Opening Day roster. 

Being an Ohio product, I could see Cincinnati having a smidge of over-valuation of Bachman, so he might mean more to them than to us or other teams. If that's true, 'exploiting' that interest and value makes the shrewdest sense.

 

[Dtwncbad]

7 minutes ago, totdprods said:

Absolutely. That's why I'd rather keep Detmers. I'm actually pretty on-board the idea of Bachman being a reliever even on the Opening Day roster. 

Being an Ohio product, I could see Cincinnati having a smidge of over-valuation of Bachman, so he might mean more to them than to us or other teams. If that's true, 'exploiting' that interest and value makes the shrewdest sense.

 

Fair position.  I would tend to go the other way and include Detmers under the assumption that if the Angels trade Detmers they are landing a pretty high quality STARTER and therefore would have less of a need for Detmers over the next couple of years. .  .but will definitely have a use for a dynamic reliever where Bachman has the profile to be.

But these things are hard because I dig Detmers’ potential.  It’s tough to be truly comfortable trading Gus like this away.

[totdprods]

Just now, Dtwncbad said:

Fair position.  I would tend to go the other way and include Detmers under the assumption that if the Angels trade Detmers they are landing a pretty high quality STARTER and therefore would have less of a need for Detmers over the next couple of years. .  .but will definitely have a use for a dynamic reliever where Bachman has the profile to be.

But these things are hard because I dig Detmers’ potential.  It’s tough to be truly comfortable trading Gus like this away.

If they really needed to address it, it's usually fairly easy to find a good near-MLB-ready bullpen arm available in the draft in the 2nd-5th rounds. There's usually some plus-plus college closers going off the board in that range.

I guess what I'm saying it's somewhat easier to replace a good bullpen prospect than a good SP prospect.