Breaking: Alex Cobb TRADED to Angels for Jahmai Jones

[Lou]

4 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Remember 20 minutes ago when the shittiest news of the day was this trade?  

Not even close.

I'm out of peanut butter.

[Inside Pitch]

1 minute ago, Lou said:

Not even close.

I'm out of peanut butter.

Jif or Skippy?

[Lou]

Just now, Inside Pitch said:

Jif or Skippy?

Um, I'm out of all peanut butter, so it's obviously both.

[NorCal Halo]

1 hour ago, James said:

I preferred it in white text. Thanks

Made me laugh so hard I scared my family.

 

[Angelsjunky]

20 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Remember 20 minutes ago when the shittiest news of the day was this trade?  

Did something happen?

[Docwaukee]

1 hour ago, beatlesrule said:

Arte hasn't been burned by any big SP contracts so I'm not sure why he's obsessed with All these 1 year deals for mediocre pitchers.All of these stupid one-year contracts are baffling. Party hasn't been burned by any It’s rather surprising to see Jones included in this sw stock has tumbled in recent seasons, he’s a former second-round draft pick who at one point ranked among MLB’s top 100 prospects at Baseball America, MLB.com and Baseball Prospectus. Baseball America ranked Jones 11th on the Halos’ 2020-21 The 23-year-old Jones went 3-for-7 in a very brief MLB debut with the Angels in 2020, so he’s a departure from some of the Orioles’ other prospect acquisitions. He’s a near-MLB-ready piece that could be plugged into the big league mix as soon as this season. Jones has played second base and center field throughout his minor league career. His bat has stalled a bit in Double-A, where he’s batted .237/.315/.338 in a very pitcher-friendly environment.

racist

[Lou]

Jif

[Angelsjunky]

#Whitelettersmatter

[Inside Pitch]

10 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

Did something happen?

Callaway mess

[Warfarin]

1 hour ago, Angelsjunky said:

Well as Trendon says, we don't know the exact details of the contract. But what we do know (or think we know)--that it is Cobb plus $8M or so ("more than half") for Jones, then I would question the judgement of that front office. I don't buy the idea that the Angels know something about Cobb. He's a 34-year old who has pitched like a #5 starter for the past three seasons.

The only thing I can see in his record is that he actually had his highest average velocity in 2020, 92.5 MPH. But that's hardly a huge jump from his career 91.4 and it obviously didn't make any difference in his performance, as he's been worse in 2018-20 then he was before.

The guy is the definition of mediocre, and the Angels are just taking on a salary dump. That only makes sense when the team dumping the player is adding a prospect, not the other way around.

Remember that the Angels threw in Will WIlson to dump Zack Cozart. Jones isn't significantly worse than Wilson as a prospect, but they're actually sending him to the Orioles to take on their dump. It doesn't make sense.

So I would expand my previous possibilities to three:

1. Cobb adds another arm, as they have a trade involving Canning or Barria.

2. The Orioles are throwing in a good prospect.

3. Perry and his gang aren't very smart.

Well .. Cozart was damaged goods and truly a sunk cost at 12mil.  So we effectively traded Wilson away for someone to pick up that remaining 12mil and release Cozart.

Cobb isn't damaged goods and can actually be a serviceable MLB player.  He is not worth 15mil obviously, but he's probably worth ~6-8mil.  If the deal ends up being Cobb + 10mil for Jones, such that we only pay around 5mil, that's probably a decent enough trade.  

[Angelsjunky]

1 minute ago, Warfarin said:

Well .. Cozart was damaged goods and truly a sunk cost at 12mil.  So we effectively traded Wilson away for someone to pick up that remaining 12mil and release Cozart.

Cobb isn't damaged goods and can actually be a serviceable MLB player.  He is not worth 15mil obviously, but he's probably worth ~6-8mil.  If the deal ends up being Cobb + 10mil for Jones, such that we only pay around 5mil, that's probably a decent enough trade.  

I don't think he's worth 6-8M, but hope I'm wrong. Again, he's nothing that the Angels couldn't have picked up for ~4M on the open market and kept Jones. I'm worried that Minasian is enamoured with the Proven Veteran.

[Warfarin]

10 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

I don't think he's worth 6-8M, but hope I'm wrong. Again, he's nothing that the Angels couldn't have picked up for ~4M on the open market and kept Jones. I'm worried that Minasian is enamoured with the Proven Veteran.

Well, if he can simply just do what he did last season, over the course of a full season, then that gives ~150IP and 1.8 fWAR.  If he's able to achieve that, I would say that's definitely worth 6-8mil, IMO.

He posted rather similar numbers in 2017 and 2018, and the above was his 2020 pace, so it seems reasonable that he can achieve that again.

[Docwaukee]

15 minutes ago, Warfarin said:

Well, if he can simply just do what he did last season, over the course of a full season, then that gives ~150IP and 1.8 fWAR.  If he's able to achieve that, I would say that's definitely worth 6-8mil, IMO.

He posted rather similar numbers in 2017 and 2018, and the above was his 2020 pace, so it seems reasonable that he can achieve that again.

it only makes sense if you have no other way to get that sort of value for less than that.  Barria can do it for free.  Half a dozen guys can likely do it for less money with similar risk and no prospect capital in return.  

You can get an Alex Cobb equivalent plus a decent reliever on the FA market for about the same amount of money and still have one of your top 20 prospects.  

For every reason that someone like Quintana made sense for 8m, this is the complete opposite to me.  

[Warfarin]

4 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

it only makes sense if you have no other way to get that sort of value for less than that.  Barria can do it for free.  Half a dozen guys can likely do it for less money with similar risk and no prospect capital in return.  

You can get an Alex Cobb equivalent plus a decent reliever on the FA market for about the same amount of money and still have one of your top 20 prospects.  

For every reason that someone like Quintana made sense for 8m, this is the complete opposite to me.  

I think at this point, Minasian is just trying to cast a wide net and find as many serviceable pitchers as Barria.

You are correct in that Barria could do that for the minimum, but he also did get crushed in 2019.  Hopefully that was just an aberration, but it seems to be that Minasian is attempting to load up on as many average-to-above average SP options as possible.

I'm okay with that strategy.  It's not exciting, but if it helps us avoid having to start terrible options, it seems worthwhile to me.

Also, perhaps Minasian seems some ability to somewhat optimize Cobb's performance a bit more.  Who knows exactly.

[Hubs]

3 hours ago, Hubs said:

We also don’t know if they’re sending a lower level prospect back or how the final trade will look, so let’s hold off on the judgements and overreactions 

$5 M pitcher with $1 M deferred is a lot different than 7 or 10 or 15. For $4M This season it’s a flyer to see if he performs. 

[Angels in 2030]

Maybe they are taking Callaway off our hands in the trade.  

[Angelsjunky]

20 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

it only makes sense if you have no other way to get that sort of value for less than that.  Barria can do it for free.  Half a dozen guys can likely do it for less money with similar risk and no prospect capital in return.  

You can get an Alex Cobb equivalent plus a decent reliever on the FA market for about the same amount of money and still have one of your top 20 prospects.  

For every reason that someone like Quintana made sense for 8m, this is the complete opposite to me.  

This. Again, kinda baffling.

[Torridd]

9 hours ago, Chuckster70 said:

Maybe we have a deal in place and needed a guy for this season because Heaney or Sandoval and say Barria + another prospect or two are headed to Colorado for German Marquez. You just never know.

I love the Angels, Chuck, but this seems like another Eppler move. "The Angels need pitching" :  That song is now very old. 

[Second Base]

13 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

This. Again, kinda baffling.

I agree with you completely that the price that has been paid is baffling. I'm just not as optimistic as you are that there's more headed the Angels way. 

I think it's just a lopsided trade. 

One or two happen every winter and this winter, we're on the wrong side of one. Just like last year, we were on the right side of one, though the other side didn't know it.

 

[angelsnationtalk]

Yeah I wonder if this opens up a trade involving a pitcher + one of Adell/Marsh/Adams. 
I just worry who that pitcher would be that we'd trade if we were to get another arm. It'd have to be the perfect return if Canning is involved. He's young, cost controlled and has great years ahead of him.

It'd be completely dumb to assume Cobb fills his spot for him to be delt for another arm. Even if it's for someone like Marquez. I'd rather have Marquez and Canning in the rotation vs Marquez and Cobb who will be gone after the season. 

[angelsnationtalk]

4 minutes ago, Second Base said:

I agree with you completely that the price that has been paid is baffling. I'm just not as optimistic as you are that there's more headed the Angels way. 

I think it's just a lopsided trade. 

One or two happen every winter and this winter, we're on the wrong side of one. Just like last year, we were on the right side of one, though the other side didn't know it.

 

There's gotta be another trade coming after this. Let's say the Angels only pay about $5M for him. I wonder if Heaney could be dealt in a package deal with one of Adell/Marsh/Adams for someone of really good value that puts the team over the top. 

Angels would actually be taking roughly $1.75M off their payroll if they can trade Heaney away and only pay Cobb $5M. 

Just a thought. I just can't see this being the final rotation. At all. 

[Pancake Bear]

It seems to most of us that it's an overpay. The question is why? 

A: The new FO is really stupid.

B: They really like Cobb a lot, hopefully see something everyone else is missing in him, and are willing to give up a prospect they aren't high on to get him.

C : A or B is true, AND They're really short of cash in the budget and he's the only one they could afford that they like that much.

Hopefully the best case version of B is true.

[BTH]

1 hour ago, Pancake Bear said:

It seems to most of us that it's an overpay. The question is why? 

A: The new FO is really stupid.

B: They really like Cobb a lot, hopefully see something everyone else is missing in him, and are willing to give up a prospect they aren't high on to get him.

C : A or B is true, AND They're really short of cash in the budget and he's the only one they could afford that they like that much.

Hopefully the best case version of B is true.

We should hopefully get a better idea once the trade is official and Minasian has a conference call with reporters to discuss the move. That should provide more clarity on what they think of Cobb and whether they believe they can get more out of him.

[beatlesrule]

5 hours ago, Chuckster70 said:

Your best post to date! 

 

5 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

Well said.

 

5 hours ago, Chuckster70 said:

He either pasted something with a white text color where there's a white background, or changed the text color accidently. 

Here you go!

Arte hasn't been burned by any big SP contracts so I'm not sure why he's obsessed with All these 1 year deals for mediocre pitchers.All of these stupid one-year contracts are baffling. Party hasn't been burned by any It’s rather surprising to see Jones included in this sw stock has tumbled in recent seasons, he’s a former second-round draft pick who at one point ranked among MLB’s top 100 prospects at Baseball America, MLB.com and Baseball Prospectus. Baseball America ranked Jones 11th on the Halos’ 2020-21 The 23-year-old Jones went 3-for-7 in a very brief MLB debut with the Angels in 2020, so he’s a departure from some of the Orioles’ other prospect acquisitions. He’s a near-MLB-ready piece that could be plugged into the big league mix as soon as this season. Jones has played second base and center field throughout his minor league career. His bat has stalled a bit in Double-A, where he’s batted .237/.315/.338 in a very pitcher-friendly environment.

LOL!! I tried 2 different posts from my phone but it was really messing up. This website and google chrome on my phone do not get along. It's better if I use this website with firefox which I do from my laptop but not my phone. Anyway, 2 separate posts were supposed to be:

MLBTR wrote; It’s rather surprising to see Jones included in this swap. While his stock has tumbled in recent seasons, he’s a former second-round draft pick who at one point ranked among MLB’s top 100 prospects at Baseball America, MLB.com and Baseball Prospectus. Baseball America ranked Jones 11th on the Halos’ 2020-21 list. The 23-year-old Jones went 3-for-7 in a very brief MLB debut with the Angels in 2020, so he’s a departure from some of the Orioles’ other prospect acquisitions. He’s a near-MLB-ready piece that could be plugged into the big league mix as soon as this season. Jones has played second base and center field throughout his minor league career. His bat has stalled a bit in Double-A, where he’s batted .237/.315/.338 in a very pitcher-friendly environment.

The next post was Arte hasn't been burned by any big SP contracts so I'm not sure why he's obsessed with all these 1 year deals for mediocre pitchers. All of these stupid one year contracts are baffling and they have proven over and over that they don't help the club win.

[Stradler]

1 hour ago, Pancake Bear said:

It seems to most of us that it's an overpay. The question is why? 

A: The new FO is really stupid.

B: They really like Cobb a lot, hopefully see something everyone else is missing in him, and are willing to give up a prospect they aren't high on to get him.

C : A or B is true, AND They're really short of cash in the budget and he's the only one they could afford that they like that much.

Hopefully the best case version of B is true.

Even if you get more out of the guy in retrospect, paying more than he's worth to a desperate team willing to unload him is outright stupid.