Embrace the losing

[howie]

It's officially time to get excited for what all this losing does for us.  If I'm correct, there are only 5 teams with worse records than the Angels and we're only 3 games out of having the second worse record in the majors.  That would give us the 2nd pick in the draft.  

As far as I'm concerned, not getting a top 10 pick next year would be utter failure for this team.  There's a real possibility of getting a top 5 pick, with an outside chance of top 3.  

In this day and age, young, cost-controlled players is what it's all about.  Not only would we get a higher pick in the first round, but every round thereafter.  That can make a real difference.  

From what I've been reading, the 2017 draft appears to be better than 2016, and it's possible to pick up a stud college pitcher in the top 3 picks that may be ready in 2018. Couple that with top 10 picks being protected and it gives lots of flexibility if Eppler decides to go after a free agent.  

All is not lost friends- Just this season.  So let's keep losing a lot and embrace the losing.  

[kevinb]

Heck ya

[Vegas Halo Fan]

What are the chances that we would use said high pick to take a toolsy middle infielder?

[NachoPop]

30 minutes ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

What are the chances that we would use said high pick to take a toolsy middle infielder?

Don't the Angls only pick catchers in the first round?

[Ohtaniland]

But some people will want Arte to sign a big splash instead.

[Puget Sound Angel]

Tank City Baby!

[Rico]

#2!

[tdawg87]

6 hours ago, CALZONE said:

But some people will want Arte to sign a big splash instead.

Guess what Claude: He can do both. That's what a protected pick is. 

[ten ocho recon scout]

6 hours ago, Dipoto's Voodoo Doll said:

Don't the Angls only pick catchers in the first round?

Beat me to it, jerk

[ten ocho recon scout]

4 hours ago, Puget Sound Angel said:

Tank City Baby!

Glendale?

[eaterfan]

I'm still hoping they win. There is some benefit from moving up in the draft, but having a higher pick is only marginally better than having a pick around 8-10 and the benefit is delayed if we are talking about expected talent from that pick. That being said, the biggest advantage will be from the difference in slot money allocated to the 3-5 pick compared to the 8-10 pick. That money can be used to sign otherwise unsignable players in later rounds (which picks we could still lose even with a protected first rounder). I think this team is a lock for a protected first rounder.

There's no way to objectively argue that losing is more beneficial than winning right now, but I'm still rooting for them to win because the benefit is so marginal that I'd just rather see them win. This isn't the NBA or NFL where moving up or down 2-3 picks makes a huge difference if there isn't a Harper, A-Rod, Strasburg, or Griffey at the top and you're getting a protected pick anyway.

[California Cajun]

7 hours ago, CALZONE said:

But some people will want Arte to sign a big splash instead.

We should want Arte to butt out of baseball affairs and either trust his baseball peoplease or get new baseball people he can trust.

[Jason]

This team has embraced losing so I guess we should as well

[Inside Pitch]

1 hour ago, eaterfan said:

I'm still hoping they win. There is some benefit from moving up in the draft, but having a higher pick is only marginally better than having a pick around 8-10 and the benefit is delayed if we are talking about expected talent from that pick. That being said, the biggest advantage will be from the difference in slot money allocated to the 3-5 pick compared to the 8-10 pick. That money can be used to sign otherwise unsignable players in later rounds (which picks we could still lose even with a protected first rounder). I think this team is a lock for a protected first rounder.

There's no way to objectively argue that losing is more beneficial than winning right now, but I'm still rooting for them to win because the benefit is so marginal that I'd just rather see them win. This isn't the NBA or NFL where moving up or down 2-3 picks makes a huge difference if there isn't a Harper, A-Rod, Strasburg, or Griffey at the top and you're getting a protected pick anyway.

You're right about the talents involved but let's not forget the slot money can be huge...   The difference between the 5th and the 10th pick this year was a cool mil...  even sicker, the difference between the 5th pick and the third was 2.25 million..  Based on how well they spread the money around this past draft, any extra money per round could go a long ways.

[eaterfan]

4 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

You're right about the talents involved but let's not forget the slot money can be huge...   The difference between the 5th and the 10th pick this year was a cool mil...  even sicker, the difference between the 5th pick and the third was 2.25 million..  Based on how well they spread the money around this past draft, any extra money per round could go a long ways.

Absolutely. And not losing their second round pick by signing a FA would also be huge for the pool.

Are you rooting for them to win or lose right now?

[Inside Pitch]

15 minutes ago, eaterfan said:

Absolutely. And not losing their second round pick by signing a FA would also be huge for the pool.

Are you rooting for them to win or lose right now?

I've never rooted for them to lose, but I'm okay with them not winning at this point.  They tried, they made moves to try to stay afloat....  They actively went about trying to stave off the inevitable..  Now it's time to think about next year and the future.   I don't want them to purposely tank -- I don't think guys like Trout, Calhoun or Pujols have it in them to do that, but I'm all for the Angels auditioning everyone in AAA a month early and if that means they lose, they end up ahead IMO.  Being at the bottom has more value to them right now that trying to finish in 4th place -- also a better chance at picking up someone worth having via waivers the lower they get.

Looking at the teams below them, I wouldn't put it past the Ray's or the Twins to purposely tank -- the Twins have screwed their fan base over more than once over the decades.  But the Twins do have a lot of young guys with upside they could call up still and they might accidentally win -- they likely need to have their fans believe this year was a fluke too.  In the NL, the Braves are def tanking at this point, the Reds might be too -- that division is sorta meh, so they might play better than the Angels moving forward, especially if Pitt starts testing out it's younger guys.   The Padres GM is a shady little prick so he could likely push for them to tank but I don't think Dave Stewart has it in him to force losing on his team -- he's a red ass and I'm sure he would like to see them finish strong.   Anyway..  I think we have a really solid shot at the 5th spot, if SD goes on a run maybe even the 4th.   Our pitching situation is so awful I can't see us getting hot anytime soon.

Whether we want them to lose or not - I don't think it matters.  Bad team will play bad.

[DMVol]

15 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

.....Whether we want them to lose or not - I don't think it matters.  Bad team will play bad.

^^^This^^^....Unless Shoe or Skaggs are starting, we're in trouble....and even if Shoe or Skaggs pitch well, the pen is a crap shoot to hold a lead....this could be a historically bad stretch.....

[ELEVEN]

25 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

I've never rooted for them to lose, but I'm okay with them not winning at this point.  They tried, they made moves to try to stay afloat....  They actively went about trying to stave off the inevitable..  Now it's time to think about next year and the future.   I don't want them to purposely tank -- I don't think guys like Trout, Calhoun or Pujols have it in them to do that, but I'm all for the Angels auditioning everyone in AAA a month early and if that means they lose, they end up ahead IMO.  Being at the bottom has more value to them right now that trying to finish in 4th place -- also a better chance at picking up someone worth having via waivers the lower they get.

Looking at the teams below them, I wouldn't put it past the Ray's or the Twins to purposely tank -- the Twins have screwed their fan base over more than once over the decades.  But the Twins do have a lot of young guys with upside they could call up still and they might accidentally win -- they likely need to have their fans believe this year was a fluke too.  In the NL, the Braves are def tanking at this point, the Reds might be too -- that division is sorta meh, so they might play better than the Angels moving forward, especially if Pitt starts testing out it's younger guys.   The Padres GM is a shady little prick so he could likely push for them to tank but I don't think Dave Stewart has it in him to force losing on his team -- he's a red ass and I'm sure he would like to see them finish strong.   Anyway..  I think we have a really solid shot at the 5th spot, if SD goes on a run maybe even the 4th.   Our pitching situation is so awful I can't see us getting hot anytime soon.

Whether we want them to lose or not - I don't think it matters.  Bad team will play bad.

Feel the suckage!

I agree tho. Play the kids and see if we have anything for the future who can help.

[eligrba]

Is this in the Angel's DNA?

[howie]

The 2017 draft has some real potential-  in the article I linked to-  they say that the top 5 college pitchers available in 2017 would have been drafted ahead of any of the college pitchers picked in 2016.  It may not look like any amazing, once in a generation type players are there, but you never know-  while the draft is a crapshoot, at the very least, I'd hope we can get a Troy Glaus or Jered Weaver (when he had a fastball) with our first pick.  It would be awesome if we can get a difference maker.  

http://www.si.com/mlb/2016/06/13/2017-mlb-draft-tanner-houck-jaren-kendall

[Angels#1Fan]

1 hour ago, DMVol said:

Unless Shoe or Skaggs are starting, we're in trouble....and even if Shoe or Skaggs pitch well, the pen is a crap shoot to hold a lead....this could be a historically bad stretch.....

I'm afraid this is what we have to look forward to the rest of the season.

This could possibly be the worst pitching staff in Angel history..bad starting rotation (due to major injuries) and bad bullpen (due to lack of talent).

[DMVol]

29 minutes ago, Angels#1Fan said:

.....bad bullpen (due to lack of talent).

Plus injuries (Street, Bedrosian) and trades (Smith).....

[Pujols4MVP]

3 hours ago, howie said:

The 2017 draft has some real potential-  in the article I linked to-  they say that the top 5 college pitchers available in 2017 would have been drafted ahead of any of the college pitchers picked in 2016.  It may not look like any amazing, once in a generation type players are there, but you never know-  while the draft is a crapshoot, at the very least, I'd hope we can get a Troy Glaus or Jered Weaver (when he had a fastball) with our first pick.  It would be awesome if we can get a difference maker.  

http://www.si.com/mlb/2016/06/13/2017-mlb-draft-tanner-houck-jaren-kendall

The 2nd round pick could be very good as well, the First 2nd round pick in 1995 was Jarod Washburn by the Angels.

[Dreams]

6.5 games back from the #1 pick

3.5 games back from the #2 pick

Finally Scioscia doing some good

[Vegas Halo Fan]

3 hours ago, eligrba said:

Is this in the Angel's DNA?

Let's find out.