Angels renew stadium talks with Anaheim after striking out in Tustin

[Stradling]

Just now, Kevinb said:

This isn't the argument and like I know disneys inner workings? Is this a fucking Disney message board? Why would I know Disney doesn't pay taxes on their sales tickets? 

I have no idea, but why would you suggest giving them the land, when they are just as greedy as you make Arte out to be.  

[gotbeer]

11 minutes ago, Stradling said:

I'm pretty sure Arte wants to develop the land around the stadium, I don't think he want the city to develop it.  

No, but he wants the city to pay for the stadium.

[gotbeer]

9 minutes ago, Stradling said:

My point is being consistent.  You are up in arms on giving billionaires stadiums, but you aren't up in arms about one of the largest companies in the world not paying ticket tax.  

yes. Let's be consistent.

Disney.  no tax on tickets.  Invest $1 billion

Arte.  Land for free.  Invest $1 billion.

[Stradling]

He wants the city to pay for the renovation.  I'm guessing they will come to an agreement that goes something like, Arte pays for the renovations in exchange for the rights to build on the land.  

[Stradling]

1 minute ago, gotbeer said:

yes. Let's be consistent.

Disney.  no tax on tickets.  Invest $1 billion

Arte.  Land for free.  Invest $1 billion.

Apples to apples.  I would expect Arte to pay for the development, but not spend a billion dollars.  

[Ohtaniland]

10 minutes ago, Stradling said:

He wants the city to pay for the renovation.  I'm guessing they will come to an agreement that goes something like, Arte pays for the renovations in exchange for the rights to build on the land.  

The City doesn't have the money to renovate the stadium. Arte needs to pony up the money with no strings attached other than another extended rent free lease agreement. The surrounding land should be sold to the highest bidder with a development plan that best serves the community not Arte. 

[Stradling]

1 minute ago, CALZONE said:

The City doesn't have the money to renovate the stadium. Arte needs to pony up the money with no strings attached other than another extended rent free lease agreement. The surrounding land should be sold to the highest bidder with a development plan that best serves the community not Arte. 

And if the city and Arte come to an agreement that's short of that will you still be mad at Arte?  

[Stradling]

But realistically what would an agreement look like?  

[Jobu]

21 minutes ago, Stradling said:

But realistically what would an agreement look like?  

If both parties want the parking lots developed, then I would think that there's a number greater than $1/yr that works for Anaheim. @red321 is correct in pointing out that, despite the land's perceived value, Anaheim hasn't had the best track record building out the Platinum triangle. It's only just now that construction is taking off again, and not the high-rise towers like they originally envisioned. Much of that was the recession, but having a willing partner is probably worth something.

@CALZONE is correct in pointing out the it's a pretty generous lease already, so it's doubtful there is much room there. Arte has been consistently targeting 3M fans to maximize his profits and minimize payments to the city, but is there even much fan capacity beyond that if ticket thresholds were removed? They maxed out at 3.4M in the mid-2000's.

As for the stadium itself, it's still a nice place to watch a ballgame. Its poor showing against newer parks in Seattle, SF, Denver probably has more to do with it's location in suburbia (or conversely, those other parks' proximity to lively downtown scenes) than the ballpark itself. I just spent a weekend at Safeco in Seattle and the most valuable "amenity" was proximity and amazing views of the city. The game in the seat was about the same (shitty). There is definite room for improvement inside the walls, but I do think a renovation (not just a facelift) could make meaningful strides.

[Ohtaniland]

19 minutes ago, Stradling said:

But realistically what would an agreement look like?  

The reality is that Arte the billionaire wanted free land from his city hall cronies (Pringle and the cities free luxury box) for his own benefit. Tom Tate called him out and the rest of the City Council did some major back peddling in fear of the backlash. The public spoke loud and clear when they voted two of them out because of this issue. Arte was way too greedy with that land deal. 

[Stradling]

Oh ok, so that's the realistic framework of a deal, got it.  thanks for your version of the history behind it and not trying to answer my actual question.  

[Ohtaniland]

5 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Oh ok, so that's the realistic framework of a deal, got it.  thanks for your version of the history behind it and not trying to answer my actual question.  

Well I do think Arte needs to section off one section of the stadium for the non spending fans. 

[Stradling]

Claude you complain more about this than anyone, you have more knowledge on this than anyone on here.  Have you given a thought to what a realistic resolution would look like?  

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

13 hours ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

I already have the stadium site picked out.

Dream On! It's a smaller market than Oakland, and Kansas City which are small market teams. The Angels would be leaving a market second only to New York.

[kevinb]

2 hours ago, Stradling said:

I have no idea, but why would you suggest giving them the land, when they are just as greedy as you make Arte out to be.  

Ya thanks for removing what I said. Never said give I said sell. 

[Stradling]

5 minutes ago, Kevinb said:

Ya thanks for removing what I said. Never said give I said sell. 

You're welcome. 

[Vegas Halo Fan]

1 hour ago, Ace_Shoemaker said:

Dream On! It's a smaller market than Oakland, and Kansas City which are small market teams. The Angels would be leaving a market second only to New York.

Two owners have already been here to talk with the city.

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

4 minutes ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

Two owners have already been here to talk with the city.

But not the Angels right. They are a big market team, and they won't give it up. I have no doubt a team might want to move there just not the Angels.

The new commissioner has hinted about expansion teams and Las Vegas has been mentioned. If they do have an expansion, maybe one of the teams will take Pujols. I doubt we would protect him.

[Angel Oracle]

2 hours ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

Two owners have already been here to talk with the city.

The NHL awarding a franchise there, may have opened the flood gates?

[Oz27]

5 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

The NHL awarding a franchise there, may have opened the flood gates?

Montreal and Portland are pretty comfortably the strongest contenders for MLB expansion/relocation in my book. MLB should probably wait on Vegas to see how hockey goes there.

As for the stadium news, this always seemed likely. There are two things which badly need to happen - new development around the stadium and a redevelopment of the stadium itself. The stadium itself is old and tired - I'm not as fussed about things like the rockpile as others are but the bathrooms, concourses and so on are really dated and there are clearly some basic infrastructure issues which could use some attention. There would also be merit in doing something like the Indians are planning and taking out a few blocks of the upper deck to turn into a patio type area (but probably on a smaller scale than they are planning). The area around the stadium is pretty sad at the moment, especially when you compare it to other venues which have heaps of hospitality venues in close proximity. The City of Anaheim has a need to make that area better. The Angels need an updated stadium and could really use better surroundings to the venue to help to draw people in. When there is a need for both parties, there has to be a way to make it happen. $1 might not be the right price and the $250 million valuation is absurd. But there has to be somewhere in between, as others have pointed out.

[Ohtaniland]

The Montreal Angels would be perfect. 

[Homebrewer]

Widen and deepen the Santa Ana river for yacht access. Put in a new marina and waterpark.

Pray for rain.

#Artesyacht.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

5 hours ago, Angel Oracle said:

The NHL awarding a franchise there, may have opened the flood gates?

The Raiders have already said that they are coming if the stadium is built, and the NBA is known to have interest. That would leave only MLB - and there has been speculation for years that the Athletics would like to move here.

[ELEVEN]

13 hours ago, Kevinb said:

Ya thanks for removing what I said. Never said give I said sell. 

Congrats on your 1000th post.

Where all of them in this thread?

[Rico]

Can't get rid of the Big A.  Where would all the rats go?