The shift has ruined Pujols

[BackUpTheTruck]

2 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

What’s your opinion on Ward again ?

Give the guy at bats. Season over.

[Angelsjunky]

Pujols is #22 out of 27 qualified 1B in fWAR.  

But for 1B and DH, I tend to look at wRC+ (or OPS+) because it is such an offense-heavy position. Pujols is...wait for it...#22 out of 27 in wRC+ at 95.

So Albert is exactly at replacement level and 95% of an average hitter playing the most premium offensive position in the game.

 

[kevinb]

1 hour ago, Angelsjunky said:

Pujols is #22 out of 27 qualified 1B in fWAR.  

But for 1B and DH, I tend to look at wRC+ (or OPS+) because it is such an offense-heavy position. Pujols is...wait for it...#22 out of 27 in wRC+ at 95.

So Albert is exactly at replacement level and 95% of an average hitter playing the most premium offensive position in the game.

 

[ten ocho recon scout]

17 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

 

As @Kevinb pointed out, 0 WAR is not "average." It is replacement level - a scrub - someone who can easily be replaced. 

floplag, paying Paul McAnulty $27 million a year is a problem. Change the name to someone who was once great and somehow it seems more palatable. I guess. 

According to Fangraphs:

0-1 WAR Scrub

1-2 WAR Role Player

2-3 WAR Solid Player

3-4 WAR Good Player

4-5 WAR All-Star

5-6 WAR Superstar

6+ WAR MVP

Albert Pujols, year by year:

2001: MVP

2002: Superstar

2003-10: MVP

2011: All-Star

Angels career begins:

2012: Good Player

2013: Scrub

2014: Solid Player

2015: Role Player

2016: Scrub

2017: Scrub

2018: Scrub

So step back and look at what the Angels have gotten out of Pujols: One year as each a Good, Solid, and Role Player, and four years as a Scrub.  Or 6.9 fWAR over 7 years, so about an average of 1 WAR per year.

Tell me again that he's not under-performing. The dude is an absolute disaster. And yes, contract matters.

 

[GrittyVeterans]

18 hours ago, floplag said:

As you say, league average.  The money doesnt factor into performance.  Its a huge leap from where he was last year. 
Production isnt relative to contract, under that standard there are maybe half dozen guys in the league at most that hold up to that. 
I agree he shouldnt be batting 4th, 5th, but realistically, we have noone better, thats the problem, not him. 

[Stradling]

Flop is victim of assuming the stats were pretty equal to a couple weeks ago.  When he shared this 10-14 days ago Albert was 8th in AL and 16th in all of baseball in first baseman WAR.  At the time Albert was a 1 WAR. Now he’s about a .7. 

[ten ocho recon scout]

If Albert was a dog in his condition, your neighbors would tell you to do the humane thing.

[floplag]

47 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Flop is victim of assuming the stats were pretty equal to a couple weeks ago.  When he shared this 10-14 days ago Albert was 8th in AL and 16th in all of baseball in first baseman WAR.  At the time Albert was a 1 WAR. Now he’s about a .7. 

Thank you thats exactly correct.   
I am still a bit perplexed though how different sites are using different formulas for WAR and the deviation its creating.   The stat has no meaning is not standardized 

[Barrett]

2 hours ago, Stradling said:

Flop is victim of assuming the stats were pretty equal to a couple weeks ago.  When he shared this 10-14 days ago Albert was 8th in AL and 16th in all of baseball in first baseman WAR.  At the time Albert was a 1 WAR. Now he’s about a .7. 

Didn't someone say he is at a 0 WAR? As someone else put it a 0 or .7 or 1 WAR is still a replacement level player. 

[yk9001]

After Pujols signed with the Angels, Colin Cowherd said this made the Angels "interesting".

[Stradling]

23 minutes ago, Barrett said:

Didn't someone say he is at a 0 WAR? As someone else put it a 0 or .7 or 1 WAR is still a replacement level player. 

I am assuming it is the difference between bWAR and fWAR.  But I don’t know.  When I looked yesterday at baseball reference it said a .7 WAR.

[Stradling]

It also could be possibly his WAR as a first baseman and his overall WAR this season, I don’t know @Barrett

[Barrett]

Just now, Stradling said:

It also could be possibly his WAR as a first baseman and his overall WAR this season, I don’t know @Barrett

Ya I don't know either. I don't get WAR it was @Angelsjunky who was saying the difference between them. But whether he was a 0 WAR or a 1 WAR he is still not good from a WAR standpoint. I just look at the actual numbers and go with that batting average slg and obp and by those I just don't get it. Wish there were a way the Angels could just eat the contract and find a better replacement. Whether thats with Thaiss? or free agency or a trade. It would go a long ways in helping this line up if they legitimately had a MOTO bat at 1st base. 

[Stradling]

5 minutes ago, Barrett said:

Ya I don't know either. I don't get WAR it was @Angelsjunky who was saying the difference between them. But whether he was a 0 WAR or a 1 WAR he is still not good from a WAR standpoint. I just look at the actual numbers and go with that batting average slg and obp and by those I just don't get it. Wish there were a way the Angels could just eat the contract and find a better replacement. Whether thats with Thaiss? or free agency or a trade. It would go a long ways in helping this line up if they legitimately had a MOTO bat at 1st base. 

I completely agree it isn’t good.  Flop and I don’t see eye to eye on a lot of things, but he is getting shit on in a thread where he simply went off of week old information.  Not a single person is saying Albert is worth the money.  Not a single person is saying he has been impressive.  That being said, a week ago when he originally brought it up, if you value WAR he was right in the middle of the pack for first baseman.  That was all my posts were trying to say.  

[yk9001]

16 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Not a single person is saying he has been impressive.  

Some dude here this week said his Angels numbers by themselves were HOF worthy.

[Lou]

1 minute ago, yk9001 said:

Some dude here this week said his Angels numbers by themselves were HOF worthy.

he's not even Angels HOF worthy

[Stradling]

18 minutes ago, yk9001 said:

Some dude here this week said his Angels numbers by themselves were HOF worthy.

Consider the source

[Angelsjunky]

There are actually three main versions of WAR: Baseball-Reference (rWAR), Fangraphs (fWAR) and Baseball Prospectus (WARP). All are different for Albert: 0.7, 0.0, 0.5. And as someone mentioned up-thread, the main difference is defensive metrics. 

Also, it should be understood that WAR--in whatever form--is not an exact science. But in all three cases, Albert is essentially a replacement player; at best, he's a "role player" stretched to be a starter because his name and contract. If he wasn't named Albert Pujols and being paid $27 million a year, he'd be on the bench or in AAA or stocking the shelves at Home Depot.

[Angelsjunky]

If you have the stomach for it, here's a description of the different flavors of WAR: 

https://www.fangraphs.com/library/war/differences-fwar-rwar/

[The Ghost of Bob Starr]

On 8/7/2018 at 12:24 PM, m0nkey said:

I am still waiting for him to get thrown out by a LEFT fielder at first base. 

Fixed 

[yk9001]

Pujols has gotten thrown out FROM left field.  By the SS.  It happened last year.

[Dick B Back]

10 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

There are actually three main versions of WAR: Baseball-Reference (rWAR), Fangraphs (fWAR) and Baseball Prospectus (WARP). All are different for Albert: 0.7, 0.0, 0.5. And as someone mentioned up-thread, the main difference is defensive metrics. 

Also, it should be understood that WAR--in whatever form--is not an exact science. But in all three cases, Albert is essentially a replacement player; at best, he's a "role player" stretched to be a starter because his name and contract. If he wasn't named Albert Pujols and being paid $27 million a year, he'd be on the bench or in AAA or stocking the shelves at Home Depot.

Or rooming with Blash... or partying with Hamilton mang.

[hangin n wangin]

1 hour ago, yk9001 said:

Pujols has gotten thrown out FROM left field.  By the SS.  It happened last year.

"One thing is to be out there and just stick around for the money. But to embarrass yourself, and not be able to compete -- dude, that's not me. -Pujols

If that isn't embarrassing, I don't know what is.

[bloodbrother]

The only options this team has regarding Pujols is to either DFA him(doubt this happens) or make him a bench bat going forward(also doubt this happens)

So I guess the next best thing is to just hope they keep adding good hitters via FA/trade that will hopefully push Pujols down further in the order.

[failos]

The shits has ruined Pujols