One Writer Predicts Scioscia Wont Last The Season

[mtangelsfan]

1 hour ago, Throwman91 said:

Do you think I care about trivial respect on a digital forum? I am here to share my opinion and would rather have freedom of expression than fear of differing opinions because my 'buddies' couldn't handle it.  You are trapped and can't get out, I am free to do as I please and express whatever I want as long as I don't curse or disparage others.

Huh?  Are you posting while medicated?

[mtangelsfan]

1 hour ago, Throwman91 said:

I and a few others have our backs against the wall because we think Scioscia should be held to a higher standard.  He should be, he has been responsible for arguably over-managing somewhat unstoppable teams from attaining their goals. (WS rings')  I think his punishment should be a release from managerial duties, he can lull around in the front office all he wants but I think a new manager would do this franchise well.

Maybe your back is against the wall because you are incorrect.  Regardless, anyone can post their opinions here, they won't be censored.  Just understand that not every opinion will be agreed to or with.

[JarsOfClay]

4 hours ago, Inside Pitch said:

This is supposed to be satire right?  A play on reality and meant to make people laugh and not really to be considered an actual real opinion -- right?  Please say it is..

The Angels farm system that Bill Stoneman inherited was ranked 30th by BBA -- Baseball Prospectus wrote that the best thing that could be said about the system at the time was that it couldn't be ranked 31st.   BBA in speaking about the problems in the system pointed out it was the only farm system in MLB with only ONE player in his teenage years -- and that no other system had had that few since the advent of the draft.  They referred to the system as being almost "incestuous" thats verbatim -- not my being cute with words.  They claimed that many of the guys in the system were there solely as favors to people in the organization -- things were so monumentally awful that despite the MLB team having the talent it did, the organization was ranked dead last overall..   

Pre-Scioscia:  the angels farm produced Glaus, Salmon, Anderson, Molina, Edmonds, Percival, Erstad, Washburn, After Scioscia:  the angels added Krod, Lackey, Shields, Weaver, Morales, Kendrick.Saunders, Napoli.

Name another organization that successful in producing so much talent in a 10 year period?

You can spout this BS about baseball america ranks, and maybe the truly naive might fall for that shit, but I've been an angel fan too long.  Nice try though.

 

[Blarg]

5 hours ago, Throwman91 said:

Agreed, welcome my brother

You were meant for each other. 

[Tank]

2 hours ago, Throwman91 said:

I and a few others have our backs against the wall because we think Scioscia should be held to a higher standard.  He should be, he has been responsible for arguably over-managing somewhat unstoppable teams from attaining their goals. (WS rings') 

here's there thing you and the other haters do that really destroys your own argument: you claim he lucked into winning the WS by inheriting a ton of talent and had madden guiding him, and then go off the rails about him not being able to be more successful with the team of the last five years (a team that arguably hasn't had a lot of talent outside of trout). so which is it, he's a totally lucky boob or he's the destroyer of all things good?

[Blarg]

2 hours ago, ANAHEIMBOB said:

I would like to see Scioscia get to the World Series as manager without Joe Maddon holding his hand. 

Oh for fucks sake Maddon held Collins hand all the way through the train wreck of 97-99. 

[Tank]

2 hours ago, Throwman91 said:

You lack critical thinking skill, you should brush up before embarrassing yourself, read a book or something

not sure if this is directed at me specifically, so i'll ask what book i (or others) should be reading that get me/us up to speed?

[Tank]

5 hours ago, Throwman91 said:

K-Rod, Lackey, Spezio, Eckstein, and Adam Kennedy went full retard in the playoffs, they were nobodies before 2002 and became somebodies in the matter of a few playoff games.  That's inheriting a winning product if I've ever seen one.  

 

[Blarg]

6 minutes ago, Tank said:

not sure if this is directed at me specifically, so i'll ask what book i (or others) should be reading that get me/us up to speed?

[Tank]

3 hours ago, Dochalo said:

Tank - I think you need to bust out the big gun in describing this thread.  

something like this?

[Troll Daddy]

Scioscia had to endure Reagins and Dipoto ... give the guy a break for god sake. 

[eligrba]

5 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

Scioscia had to endure Reagins and Dipoto ... give the guy a break for god sake. 

We all endured Reagins and Dipoto.  Scioscia gets no break from me.

[Inside Pitch]

27 minutes ago, JarsOfClay said:

Pre-Scioscia:  the angels farm produced Glaus, Salmon, Anderson, Molina, Edmonds, Percival, Erstad, Washburn, After Scioscia:  the angels added Krod, Lackey, Shields, Weaver, Morales, Kendrick.Saunders, Napoli.

Name another organization that successful in producing so much talent in a 10 year period?

You can spout this BS about baseball america ranks, and maybe the truly naive might fall for that shit, but I've been an angel fan too long.  Nice try though.

My bad, you weren't being satirical at all, you're just ignorant as to what a farm system is or the word inherited means  

You made a claim -- the claim being that he "inherited the best farm system in baseball."   Now, to prove your point, you have listed 16 players.   Of those 16 players, 5 were actually in the farm when MS took over, another 5 weren't even in professional baseball and one of them never played a single game for MS -- (Edmonds).  Of those that were actually in the system, one had been released by Bavasi (Molina), only to be brought back by Stoneman and two were RPs.   Only one of those 5 ever made an appearance on a top 100 list..  K-rod, who was 17 at the time and had pitched all of 56 innings in his career (short season ball). 

Pleasure talking baseball with you.   I'll try harder in the future.

 

 

[Inside Pitch]

3 hours ago, ANAHEIMBOB said:

If the Angels win the World Series this year,  I  would  give Scioscia  a 5 year extension. But an Angel player will have a hangnail, that will give Scioscia fans an excuse for  the Angels not playing up to expectations.

Why 5 years?  Just my opinion, but I wouldn't give anyone but a GM a five year deal.. and even then I'd rather go 3 years and two option seasons.   Maybe a farm director too since their work actually takes time to show it's worth.   If I were running a MLB team I don't think I'd ever go more than three years on a contract with a manager..  Seems kind of weird you'd be willing to go 5 years on a guy you pretty clearly hate...   

[Angel Oracle]

1 hour ago, JarsOfClay said:

Pre-Scioscia:  the angels farm produced Glaus, Salmon, Anderson, Molina, Edmonds, Percival, Erstad, Washburn, After Scioscia:  the angels added Krod, Lackey, Shields, Weaver, Morales, Kendrick.Saunders, Napoli.

Name another organization that successful in producing so much talent in a 10 year period?

You can spout this BS about baseball america ranks, and maybe the truly naive might fall for that shit, but I've been an angel fan too long.  Nice try though.

 

One thing though, notice how many pitchers are on the pre-Scioscia list vs. the after Scioscia arrived list, significantly more on the after arrival list.  

Pitching absolutely reeked in this org by 1999, and was turned around in the 2000s. 

[Mark68]

5 hours ago, Inside Pitch said:

This is supposed to be satire right?  A play on reality and meant to make people laugh and not really to be considered an actual real opinion -- right?  Please say it is..

The Angels farm system that Bill Stoneman inherited was ranked 30th by BBA -- Baseball Prospectus wrote that the best thing that could be said about the system at the time was that it couldn't be ranked 31st.   BBA in speaking about the problems in the system pointed out it was the only farm system in MLB with only ONE player in his teenage years -- and that no other system had had that few since the advent of the draft.  They referred to the system as being almost "incestuous" thats verbatim -- not my being cute with words.  They claimed that many of the guys in the system were there solely as favors to people in the organization -- things were so monumentally awful that despite the MLB team having the talent it did, the organization was ranked dead last overall..   

Either some of you were too young to remember or you were still Dodger fans -- but prior to Bill Stoneman and MS getting here the Angels were a rudderless ship completely devoid of any semblance of a plan or organizational belief system..   That's the team that MS took over....    A team so awful that when the Angels didn't sign Steve freaking Trachsel the local press acted like they passed on RJ or something.  The dude had posted an ERA near 6.00 and lost 18 games the previous year and he was seen as a major get and a missed opportunity...

There is definitely a new axis of stupid coming about.   Guess we have Ohtani to thank for the renewed interest and everything that comes with it.

Thanks, Ohtani!

[Inside Pitch]

9 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

One thing though, notice how many pitchers are on the pre-Scioscia list vs. the after Scioscia arrived list, significantly more on the after arrival list.  

Pitching absolutely reeked in this org by 1999, and was turned around in the 2000s. 

Some of that had to do with the crazy number of arms the Angels blew out in the minors.  They were taking guys coming out of college and having them throw 175+ innings their first year of pro ball..  Even more after they sent them to winter ball to "get more innings in".  They were brutal, particularly in AA.

[Angel Oracle]

1 minute ago, Inside Pitch said:

Some of that had to do with the crazy number of arms the Angels blew out in the minors.  They were taking guys coming out of college and having them throw 175+ innings their first year of pro ball..  Even more after they sent them to winter ball to "get more innings in".  They were brutal, particularly in AA.

Yep, the Nolan Ryan strategy, and notice how it worked (or didn't work) for the Rangers.    Billy Martin's 1980 A'th staff strategy certainly won't be cloned here either.

[mtangelsfan]

12 minutes ago, ANAHEIMBOB said:

Ryan must be doing  something right,  the Rangers went to two World Series.  They should have won at least one of them . Then Ryan went to Huston,  they win a World Series.  I'm not giving him all the credit,  but I'm sure he helped. 

[Homebrewer]

Excellent Thread...would read again.

5 stars to the OP.

[Jeff Fletcher]

6 hours ago, ANAHEIMBOB said:

I would like to see Scioscia get to the World Series as manager without Joe Maddon holding his hand. 

Well now the Angels have Eric Hinske on their staff. Joe Maddon never won a World Series without Hinske. 

[JustATroutFan]

I think MS did a good job last season, considering all the injuries the Angels had and the amount of players that were underperforming (especially Pujols). But if he doesn't get the Angels to the postseason this year, he will be fired. 

[stormngt]

3 hours ago, JustATroutFan said:

I think MS did a good job last season, considering all the injuries the Angels had and the amount of players that were underperforming (especially Pujols). But if he doesn't get the Angels to the postseason this year, he will be fired. 

Your not fired if your contract runs out......but that's semantics 

[Blarg]

On ‎1‎/‎4‎/‎2018 at 4:27 PM, ANAHEIMBOB said:

Scioscia  has had twelve season's without Maddon to make it back to the World Series,  if you give Joe Maddon twelve more year's. I'll put my money on him, he wins another one.  

Little known facts, to you, Maddon had six seasons as a manager in the Angels farm system, he had a 279–339. He managed in the minors from 1981 to 1986, each team having a losing record. 

[Blarg]

Another little known fact. The Angels never had three winning seasons in a row before Mike Scioscia became manager. In fact they rattled off 6 in a row, four of which was after Maddon left.