Twins acquire Santiago

[Troll Daddy]

Except this trade wasn't about rebuilding at all.  So we're good to go, I guess.

[totdprods]

Right, he's a risk, but he is high upside. What I'm saying is even if he translates into a good pen arm, those still have really good trade value right now. 

Eppler's had a knack for guys like this so far. 

[Troll Daddy]

Eppler hasn't made a bad trade yet ... I think

[bloodbrother]

Ok I'm finally over this trade(don't like it). Meyer is the big piece here obviously. I'm not really convinced he'll be able to stick as a starter and I don't like that he's kinda oldish for a prospect, but I do believe he can turn into a pretty great reliever for this team. I assume they'll try to have him start at first but his fastball/slider combination is pretty great and could make for a very nice pairing with Bedrosian in the 8th/9th innings going forward

[Oz27]

14 minutes ago, ettin said:

Perhaps as they will have the September waiver period to do so. I really think Eppler's goal was very specific and that was to find a trade partner that would give up a starter with a very specific control period and contract length that would send them a good prospect as well. The Twins clearly ended up being the right fit for his goal.

So yes I agree ALF that they may flip him for another prospect or two that they desire and that is fine because the Angels had a tactical goal with this trade and they executed on the one they found to be best. I see the logic in what they did. Everything relies now on Meyer being something as long as he is not a complete failure.

They did execute that goal, you're right. It just seems like the wrong goal to have. There are better ways to acquire arms to eat innings than underselling a valuable asset.

[Kevin]

The Angels are a Major League Baseball organization, correct?

[Second Base]

Word from Minnesota roving scout says Meyer's days as a starter are done in their eyes.  He said, "I can't fathom anyone using him as a starter at this point."

[Second Base]

Also, for those curious, here's my take - http://monkeywithahalo.com/uncategorized/angels-trade-santiago-busenitz-to-twins.html

Here's a small tidbit.

Summary

The trade deadline is a seller’s market, always has been and always will be.  The Angels, for the first time in a long time, found themselves in position to sell at the deadline.  Santiago figured to be a lukewarm commodity, but one that would generate at least a solid return.  Adding in a very high upside reliever like Busenitz should’ve netted the Angels a very noteworthy package.  Instead, they received Ricky Nolasco, who is by most measures, a worse pitcher than Hector Santiago and an injured former top prospect Alex Meyer.  Without a doubt, this move (at least for now) can only be characterized as a total disaster on Eppler’s part.  He failed to get anything worthwhile for a commodity with actual value.  And what’s worse, he failed to save the Angels any money moving forward, which hurts because by most accounts, the Angels are up against the Luxury Tax threshold and that’s a solid line that Arte Moreno has proven time and a again, VERY reluctant to cross.

What was Eppler thinking?

There’s still the possibility that this move can turn out to be a win for the Angels.  While Nolasco is almost certainly a step backward, he’s born and raised So-Cal.  He lives in Southern California during the offseason and has expressed interest multiple times of returning home to pitch.  The only time Nolasco actually pitch in his native land was with the Dodgers two years ago and he produced a 3.56 ERA across 87 innings (75 K’s).  There’s the possibility that Nolasco does manage to pitch up to his ability being back in Southern California.  If it works out right, he could hover around a 4.00 ERA which is closer to where his FIP (Fielding Independent Pitching, a metric that attempts to calculate where a pitches ERA should be at if errors were not part of the equation) is at this season.  On top of that, Nolasco tends to eat  a lot innings, and the Angels need that.  Their bullpen is spent and the other starters in the rotation haven't been able to go 6+ innings.  There’s also Alex Meyer to consider.  Meyer was dominant in his three outings in AAA this season and was still performing at a high level and was highly regarded as recently as 2014.  If Meyer’s injuries are of no concern, then it’s quite possible the Angels got a true front of the rotation candidate and could come away with a major victory here. 

[ettin]

49 minutes ago, Oz27 said:

They did execute that goal, you're right. It just seems like the wrong goal to have. There are better ways to acquire arms to eat innings than underselling a valuable asset.

Well that is the big question isn't it? (what is the team's goal)

This was clearly a move to compete in 2017. There are other moves that might have made more sense for 2018 as well. If you wanted the prospect package that is really for 2019 and beyond.

[stormngt]

1 hour ago, totdprods said:

Miller and Meyer aren't perfect comps, but close as I could come up with. He's young enough he shouldn't be written off. 

And there's always chance he winds up being effective in the pen, like Miller, and we see what he's worth now. 

If Santiago wasn't getting prospects offered back that were impact bats or top-of-the-rotation arms, then we wouldn't have been adding much to the system except for quantity. We needed someone with some upside who can step in this year.

Just curious.  How old was Shoemaker in 2013?

[The God of Runs]

I'm in the minority here as I like the trade.  I mean, in the end, we're talking about Hector Santiago.  And there have been a number of times that I wouldn't have minded him getting DFAed. IMHO, he is what he is. However, I do expect him to throw a few shutouts against us. 

[gotbeer]

Trade still sucks.  You got a 33 year old that can't get anyone out.  You have to go back to 2013 to when he was any semblance of an average pitcher.  So I figure him to be a Lincecum like player next year.  Meyers also sucks.  Shoulder injury + Angels = done.  More than likely, he will be moved to the pen.  But the 1.30 career minor league WHIP means the control isn't there. 

In the end, I think this was part of a purge.  Eppler is getting rid of everything Dipoto.  I would not be surprised if he trades Skaggs, if he clears waivers, and gets a haul if he continues to pitch well.

[CanadianHalo]

16 minutes ago, ettin said:

Well that is the big question isn't it? (what is the team's goal)

This was clearly a move to compete in 2017. There are other moves that might have made more sense for 2018 as well. If you wanted the prospect package that is really for 2019 and beyond.

The whole competing in 2017 is what makes this trade terrible. We still don't have a LF'er or a 2B for next season. The FA classes at both those positions suck. Combine that with Arte's wallet being on lockdown and I have no idea how in the world this moron plans on 1) being able to compete in 2017 and 2) properly filling those spots

 

[Troll Daddy]

Nolasco gives this trade a built-in fail safe.

If for whatever reason Meyers is a bust ... we really didn't lose much by trading or not trading Santiago. It's a coin toss as to who pitches better in 2017. Angels defense may be the tie breaker for Nolasco.

In essence we traded Busenitz for Meyers.

[tomsred]

4 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

Nolasco gives this trade a built-in fail safe.

If for whatever reason Meyers is a bust ... we really didn't lose much by trading or not trading Santiago. It's a coin toss as to who pitches better in 2017. Angels defense may be the tie breaker for Nolasco.

Yeah, that an interesting way of looking at it.  Pitchers are going to be really hard to get for awhile.  Hopefully we don't suffer any more UCL injuries.

[Oz27]

27 minutes ago, ettin said:

Well that is the big question isn't it? (what is the team's goal)

This was clearly a move to compete in 2017. There are other moves that might have made more sense for 2018 as well. If you wanted the prospect package that is really for 2019 and beyond.

Ever since Eppler took over it's been hard to work out. The Simmons trade suggested we were going hard in 'win now' mode, then we did nothing else. Now we give up a valuable asset for a rotation-filler and someone most likely to make it as a reliever, while holding onto Escobar. I guess we're going at it for 2017? If so that's stupid, but I guess that's where we're at.

[ELEVEN]

1 minute ago, Oz27 said:

Ever since Eppler took over it's been hard to work out. The Simmons trade suggested we were going hard in 'win now' mode, then we did nothing else. Now we give up a valuable asset for a rotation-filler and someone most likely to make it as a reliever, while holding onto Escobar. I guess we're going at it for 2017? If so that's stupid, but I guess that's where we're at.

Yes, we are at stupid.

[Troll Daddy]

I thinks that's what Eppler has been saying all along. 

The team is competing now ... looking forward to seeing some new additions in 2017. 

[CanadianHalo]

4 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

I thinks that's what Eppler has been saying all along. 

The team is competing now ... looking forward to seeing some new additions in 2017. 

Like who?

[NrM]

[NrM]

5 hours ago, CanadianHalo said:

A trade so bad that not even Stradling can put his usual homer spin on it.

I think we've officially hit rock bottom boys

/lock thread

[Oz27]

2 minutes ago, Mr Meeseeks said:

But he's a "quitter".

[NrM]

3 minutes ago, Oz27 said:

But he's a "quitter".

Who knew a GM wouldn't like being micromanaged and controlled by the owner and manager?

what an asshole

[Oz27]

1 minute ago, Mr Meeseeks said:

Who knew the GM didn't like being told what to do by the owner and manager?

Yeah. But he "quit".

Dipoto is overrated by many here. He did a decent job here but also had some significant shortcomings. Nevertheless, he was so much better than the guy he replaced and the guy who replaced him.

[NrM]

4 minutes ago, Oz27 said:

Yeah. But he "quit".

Dipoto is overrated by many here. He did a decent job here but also had some significant shortcomings. Nevertheless, he was so much better than the guy he replaced and the guy who replaced him.

At least Jerry treated the fans and media with respect and dignity. You can't even say that about Billy Eppler.