Twins acquire Santiago

[Oz27]

Dave Cameron at FanGraphs says the deal is weird but not a disaster. I don't really agree, but interesting take nevertheless.

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=227342

[jsnpritchett]

Just now, fan_since79 said:

Uh...Roger, let me check with Mike, then get back to you on that.

 

Ha.  But, yeah, he's awful.  I have to turn the station every time he interviews someone.  He uses the same cadence and tone during every interview, too.  I've never heard/seen another interviewer who simply refuses to ask follow-up questions or go off-script.  It's bizarre.

[eligrba4ever]

Ricky won't walk everybody. That's a plus.

[jsnpritchett]

1 minute ago, beatlesrule said:

Says the doctors looked at Meyers shoulder and it was fine.  Says he is physical and throws hard.  If he doesn't pan out as a SP next year, he could be used out of the bullpen.

So then why hasn't he pitched since May?

[fan_since79]

1 minute ago, beatlesrule said:

Says the doctors looked at Meyers shoulder and it was fine.  Says he is physical and throws hard. 

That describes 99% of ML pitchers.

 

[tomsred]

3 minutes ago, jsnpritchett said:

Yep, here's a quick summary:

 

But.........

[eligrba4ever]

Billy says light a candle for Richards and Trop.

[tomsred]

Just now, eligrba4ever said:

Billy says light a candle for Richards and Trop.

Then take a knife and slice those arms open, and stitch them back together, quickly.

[Jason]

Who knows? Maybe this all works out well.

[beatlesrule]

Don't shoot the messenger guys.

[Docwaukee]

Check out the hutchison for Liriano deal and the Santiago deal makes a bit more sense from a market perspective.  Obtaining guys that are major league ready and controlled is tough.    

[DB24]

4 minutes ago, eligrba4ever said:

Ricky won't walk everybody. That's a plus.

He'll just give up HR's to everybody instead.

[fan_since79]

1 minute ago, Angels N Skins said:

Who knows? Maybe this all works out well.

The rotation should be pretty decent by 2020.

 

[meat]

14 minutes ago, DB24 said:

Can someone post a summary?

Morongo Casino is still less than 90 minutes from wherever you are.

 

 

[Jason]

Just now, fan_since79 said:

The rotation should be pretty decent by 2020.

 

Sweet! My little girl should be old enough by then drive to the ballpark and be my designated driver.

[eligrba4ever]

The Times story mentioned Yunel Escobar was available, but suggested he carries clubhouse issues and nobody offered.

[ELEVEN]

2 hours ago, Dochalo said:

doing exactly what I had hoped they would not.  Using our assets to play for 2017.  this team is retARTEd

Claude, meet your new sign for 2017

[Inside Pitch]

28 minutes ago, Oz27 said:

Dave Cameron at FanGraphs says the deal is weird but not a disaster. I don't really agree, but interesting take nevertheless.

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=227342

It's not really a shocker that FG's opinion is what it is -- from a sabermetric POV the deal isn't as awful as someone looking at the raw numbers.  Nolasco's 1.5 fWAR this year is better than Santiago's 0.5 -- I doubt anyone would have believed that based on raw ERA numbers.   Anyway, based on what Eppler is reportedly to saying it's pretty clear they are banking on some of math to even out..   When you consider Nolasco had a BABIP of .315 and Santiago's was under .260 you can see the luck argument and if you take into consideration that the Angels have the best Defensive efficiency in MLB while the Twins are in the lower half -- you can see why the Angels are thinking a better defense will lead to better results.

It wouldnt be so hard to swallow if not for the Blanton disaster...   This feels like a familiar road.

 

[eaterfan]

18 minutes ago, totdprods said:

Total risk. Basically they just gave us a high risk, high upside side arm in return for a back-end starter who could be a little better than what we got. Would have preferred to have gotten something different for Santiago, but there must be something that's encouraging Billy about Meyer. 

Andrew Miller was another tall pitcher with a big arm and a flopped prospect with injury issues. Billy's just playing it risky. 

If he somehow pans out, Shoe, Skaggs, and Meyer is a good trio in the rotation, or maybe he becomes a big pen arm.

I just don't understand it even from a ceiling perspective. How high could this guy's ceiling really be? He's 26 and won't be in the majors until next year. He hasn't performed well in like 2 seasons. To give you an idea, Cowart is 24 and has performed pretty well the last two years. He's a former top 100 guy and first round pick too. 

[Inside Pitch]

5 minutes ago, eaterfan said:

I just don't understand it even from a ceiling perspective. How high could this guy's ceiling really be? He's 26 and won't be in the majors until next year. He hasn't performed well in like 2 seasons. To give you an idea, Cowart is 24 and has performed pretty well the last two years. He's a former top 100 guy and first round pick too. 

Tots is right though ...  they are banking on that ceiling

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/millean01.shtml   The Miller comp is about as good as it can get.

This is why Cameron is calling this a lottery ticket type move...

[eaterfan]

2 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Want to know what the Angels are thinking?

Here you go....  Here's your comp..   http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/millean01.shtml

This is why Cameron is calling this a lottery ticket type move...

I don't think that's a real fair comparison. Miller had made nearly 50 starts before his age 25 season. Meyer will have made 3 before his age 27 season. Miller wasn't good but his stuff was undeniable. It doesn't seem to be the case with Meyer.

[Inside Pitch]

9 minutes ago, eaterfan said:

I don't think that's a real fair comparison. Miller had made nearly 50 starts before his age 25 season. Meyer will have made 3 before his age 27 season. Miller wasn't good but his stuff was undeniable. It doesn't seem to be the case with Meyer.

Meyer's stuff has been the main reason people didn't punt on him when the results werent there -- not unlike Miller..    They are more similar than you think...  I don't think Meyers has ever hit triple digits like Miller had, but they were both high octane pitchers with extreme release points.. 

BTW, I don't know how I missed Tot's post... particularly since you quoted him...    But  I edited my post to acknowledge he had made the comp first...

 

[totdprods]

Such is the state of the org that we have to take a risk like this. If Meyer pans out its a huge win to have received a pitcher like that for virtually nothing. We don't really have any other way of adding potentially high-impact prospects unless we deal Trout, Simmons, Calhoun, maybe Shoe, or getting a Top 5 pick. And all those come with risk too. 

Santiago for Nolasco is basically a wash. We basically bought Meyer for a couple mil and accepted that our #4 might suck a bit more than the one we sent them. We weren't really planning on competing next year, remember? 

To me this shows they're intending on looking long term, which is something we all weren't real sure of going into this weekend.  

[bloodbrother]

2 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Meyer's stuff has been the main reason people didn't punt on him when the results werent there -- not unlike Miller..    They are more similar than you think...  I don't think Meyers has ever hit triple digits like Miller had, but they were both high octane lefties with extreme release points.. 

BTW, I don't know how I missed Tot's post... particularly since you quoted him...    But  I edited my post to acknowledge he had made the comp first...

 

Meyer is a RHP. His command issues are likely due to him being so tall(6'9). Common for big dudes like that to struggle with throwing strikes

[Inside Pitch]

1 minute ago, totdprods said:

Such is the state of the org that we have to take a risk like this. If Meyer pans out its a huge win to have received a pitcher like that for virtually nothing. We don't really have any other way of adding potentially high-impact prospects unless we deal Trout, Simmons, Calhoun, maybe Shoe, or getting a Top 5 pick. And all those come with risk too. 

Santiago for Nolasco is basically a wash. We basically bought Meyer for a couple mil and accepted that our #4 might suck a bit more than the one we sent them. We weren't really planning on competing next year, remember? 

To me this shows they're intending on looking long term, which is something we all weren't real sure of going into this weekend.  

Its possible Eppler is thinking outside the box and we are all reacting emotionally to the trade - but you have to admit, the Blanton debacle is a specter that even the saber inclined fans might struggle to let go of...   Different GM and different team I know -- but a painful memory.

But I do agree they are seemingly looking long term...