The Official 2016-2017 Anaheim Ducks Thread

[Gavin]

6 hours ago, HaloCory22 said:

I'm with Nate about Manson. You don't need the big hitting dmen as much anymore. I can provide MANY instances where his idiotic play cost us. He's way too concerned with laying out the big hit than playing the puck. That was exposed extremely in the Edmonton series. I really hope he's not in our long term plans. However, for 800K for next season.... I'll tolerate it. I've never been a Manson fan but I think Nate just passed me up hah. I didn't think he was the worst. Almost everyone had bad defensive games but Manson's really stood out with some timely errors. The Ducks and fans have a hard on for him. He's not going to be let go in the draft. If anything, he'll be traded. Again, I'd probably stick it out at least one more season with him. Extend then trade.

So let me ask you and @nate this: do you think Manson was worse than Theo defensively? 

While I'm not a huge proponent of advanced stats in hockey, Manson has consistently improved his partner's corsi numbers (whether that be Lindholm or Fowler).

Also, physical defensemen who can skate are still very important in the NHL. You mentioned Edmonton, they have big, skilled guys (Draisatl for one) who can knock off smaller defensemen like Vats, Theo, and Montour. 

[nate]

That is all fine, except Manson isn't that player.  Go back and watch how many goals went in while he was standing in the middle of nowhere getting skated past.  He was caught flat footed more than any other Ducks Dman this year, including Bieksa.

Manson is at best a 6th defensemen, unfortunately with Bieksa and Stoner, the Ducks have three #6 dmen.

[gotbeer]

1 hour ago, nate said:

That is all fine, except Manson isn't that player.  Go back and watch how many goals went in while he was standing in the middle of nowhere getting skated past.  He was caught flat footed more than any other Ducks Dman this year, including Bieksa.

Manson is at best a 6th defensemen, unfortunately with Bieksa and Stoner, the Ducks have three #6 dmen.

Unfortunately, I can think of a few times where Montour was standing around watching the play while the other team scored in the playoffs.  One especially where he had a tub of popcorn in his hand.  Fowler and Vatanen also.  At least Vatanen had some excuse of being a step slow. 

We really need a balance on D.  The biggest issue is, if you have speed on O, you don't need too much speed on D.  Ducks have a little bit of speed on O, but looking at the teams we played in the postseason, we really got exposed on how slow our O was, and how fast their D caught up to us.

[gotbeer]

NHL Rumors: A Quick Trade Market Summary and Alex Ovechkin

Murray needs to be fired if this happens.

Quote

Vegas Golden Knights – They don’t have a lot to offer at the moment. What if they were able to select Jakob Silfverberg, or acquired the rights and signed someone like Joe Thornton or Patrick Marleau with the purpose of trading them.

 

[HaloCory22]

16 hours ago, Gavin said:

So let me ask you and @nate this: do you think Manson was worse than Theo defensively? 

While I'm not a huge proponent of advanced stats in hockey, Manson has consistently improved his partner's corsi numbers (whether that be Lindholm or Fowler).

Also, physical defensemen who can skate are still very important in the NHL. You mentioned Edmonton, they have big, skilled guys (Draisatl for one) who can knock off smaller defensemen like Vats, Theo, and Montour. 

Theo brings more to the table overall two ways than Manson does. Manson was better defensively in the playoffs but you can't deny Theo's offensive capabilities. Theo is also 4 years younger. Which is why I'll take him over Manson any day of the week as a guy to build with. Nate makes a good point about Manson's awareness. Many times he's been caught flat footed or standing right in front of the net only for a winger to drop in behind him for an easy opportunity. I'm not trying to completely discredit his value. I just feel like his best value is as a trade chip.

[Gavin]

While I agree that Manson made some pretty bad plays in the playoffs, the stats (even in the playoffs) show that Manson was clearly the better defender. 

http://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/ANA/2017.html#stats_adv_rs::7

Theo definitely has age on his side, but he's never been regarded as even decent in his own end. In fact, he fell to the bottom half of the 1st round to the Ducks because he was considered a liability in his own zone. The Ducks need defensemen who are defense first defensemen to play with their plethora of offensive defensemen. Let's take a look at the Predators for example: Josi, Ellis, and Subban may be getting a ton of the "credit"/love, but the defenseman who was probably they key to beating the Ducks is Subban's D-pairing partner, Ekholm. He allows Subban to roam and be more aggressive on the rush. Mason, who has only been in the league for two seasons, can effectively develop into a player like Ekholm.

P.S. Manson is nowhere near as bad as Bieksa. Look at the link I referenced above; you'll see how much worse Bieksa was compared to Manson. Not a fan of advanced stats? Think about how much better Fowler was this year compared to last year when he was paired with Bieksa. The dude is too slow and old to be an effective defenseman.

[gotbeer]

2 hours ago, Gavin said:

While I agree that Manson made some pretty bad plays in the playoffs, the stats (even in the playoffs) show that Manson was clearly the better defender. 

http://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/ANA/2017.html#stats_adv_rs::7

Theo definitely has age on his side, but he's never been regarded as even decent in his own end. In fact, he fell to the bottom half of the 1st round to the Ducks because he was considered a liability in his own zone. The Ducks need defensemen who are defense first defensemen to play with their plethora of offensive defensemen. Let's take a look at the Predators for example: Josi, Ellis, and Subban may be getting a ton of the "credit"/love, but the defenseman who was probably they key to beating the Ducks is Subban's D-pairing partner, Ekholm. He allows Subban to roam and be more aggressive on the rush. Mason, who has only been in the league for two seasons, can effectively develop into a player like Ekholm.

P.S. Manson is nowhere near as bad as Bieksa. Look at the link I referenced above; you'll see how much worse Bieksa was compared to Manson. Not a fan of advanced stats? Think about how much better Fowler was this year compared to last year when he was paired with Bieksa. The dude is too slow and old to be an effective defenseman.

How dare you bring stats to a knife fight.

[gotbeer]

NHL Rumors: Stars, Lightning, Kings and Drouin

Quote

Multiple sources that are close to the Lightning are saying that they are in talks with the Los Angeles Kings and others about forward Jonathan Drouin.

Trade talks with Kings involve defenseman Jake Muzzin, with other pieces being discussed.

The Kings are looking for a top-six winger and could be willing to trade one of Muzzin or Alec Martinez.

The Anahiem Ducks (Sami Vatanen) and Minnesota Wild (Jonas Brodin) have been linked to Drouin.

 

[Thomas]

On 6/5/2017 at 11:46 AM, HaloCory22 said:

He's way too concerned with laying out the big hit than playing the puck.

I've literally used him as video testimony with my sons about falling in love with hitting (which almost any bantam will do since they've been waiting to be able to since mites). His gaffes in this regard are that good of a learning tool.

[gotbeer]

Sussing out potential trade destinations for Sami Vatanen

I don't think the Rangers or the Sabres have what we need.  And the Stars and Coyotes are probably the fallback options.  The Leafs and the Lightning though.  And I don't think it will be Manson going to the Leafs.  For the same reasons they listed as to why the Leafs want him, the Ducks need the cap space also. 

[UndertheHalo]

Yea i saw the same thing several places on Vatanen.  I think most of us always expected he'd be the guy to go.  It just makes sense.  I don't see Manson not being a Duck next year.  

If we trade Vatanen to the leafs tho.  It better not be for fucking JVR. 

[gotbeer]

Just a recap of some important dates coming up

Quote

The 30 NHL Clubs must submit their Protection List by 5:00 P.M. ET on Saturday, June 17, 2017. The Las Vegas team must submit their Expansion Draft Selections by 5:00 P.M. ET on June 20 and the announcement of their selections will be released on made on June 21. 

June 23 is the draft.

[HaloCory22]

Vatanen for Drouin. Get it done. It's been 3 years in the making.

[UndertheHalo]

1 hour ago, HaloCory22 said:

Vatanen for Drouin. Get it done. It's been 3 years in the making.

I'd love this but I find it hard to believe Tampa Bay won't figure out some way to keep this guy.  If we could get him though.... man it would be fantastic.  

If its the Leafs I'll be satisfied with any of Michael Nylander, Mitch Marner, or Nazem Kadri.

Would also be thrilled with Matt Duchene or happy with Taylor Hall. 

Edited June 8, 2017 by UndertheHalo

[gotbeer]

I'm bored.  So going with a long winded 4 team Would you, and would they?

Vatanen to Dallas for pick #3 and Ritchie

Pick #3 and expansion draft Despres to Magnetos for Pick #6

Pick #6 and one of Theodore or Montour to Lightning for Drouin

Dallas trade is pretty self explanitory, I think they are exposing Ritchie to the expansion draft anyways, so it's a plus for them.  Magnetos would move up 3 spots.  With Vatanen off the board for the Ducks it really doesn't leave much for them to pick at on our team.  So they move up 3, if Despres recovers from his concussions, it's a big plus for them.  If not, they just LTIR when the season starts.  Drouin is a RFA.  Lightning need a dman but are against the cap.  Both Theodore and Montour have 1 year till RFA. 

For the Ducks.  We lose Vatanen, Despres, and Theodore/Montour for Ritchie and Drouin.  We'd clear about $9 million off the books.  Of course adding them with Ritchie who is probably going to be about $1 million, and Drouin.  Maybe like a Tifoli deal 3 year/$4.6 million hit? 

Lines:

• Rakell/Getzlaff/Drouin
• Silf/Kessler/Cogs
• Ritchie/Thompson?/Ritchie
• Shaw/Vermette/Kase

Mix and match.  If Eaves comes back then move Drouin in place of Cogs.  Thompson is a FA, but I can't see him being much. 

Defense:

• Fowler/Manson
• Lindholm/Bieska
• Theodore Montour/Stoner

Still have Larsson Megna and Welinski. 

[OCAngelsNotLAA]

8 hours ago, gotbeer said:

I'm bored.  So going with a long winded 4 team Would you, and would they?

Vatanen to Dallas for pick #3 and Ritchie

Pick #3 and expansion draft Despres to Magnetos for Pick #6

Pick #6 and one of Theodore or Montour to Lightning for Drouin

Dallas trade is pretty self explanitory, I think they are exposing Ritchie to the expansion draft anyways, so it's a plus for them.  Magnetos would move up 3 spots.  With Vatanen off the board for the Ducks it really doesn't leave much for them to pick at on our team.  So they move up 3, if Despres recovers from his concussions, it's a big plus for them.  If not, they just LTIR when the season starts.  Drouin is a RFA.  Lightning need a dman but are against the cap.  Both Theodore and Montour have 1 year till RFA. 

For the Ducks.  We lose Vatanen, Despres, and Theodore/Montour for Ritchie and Drouin.  We'd clear about $9 million off the books.  Of course adding them with Ritchie who is probably going to be about $1 million, and Drouin.  Maybe like a Tifoli deal 3 year/$4.6 million hit? 

Lines:

• Rakell/Getzlaff/Drouin
• Silf/Kessler/Cogs
• Ritchie/Thompson?/Ritchie
• Shaw/Vermette/Kase

Mix and match.  If Eaves comes back then move Drouin in place of Cogs.  Thompson is a FA, but I can't see him being much. 

Defense:

• Fowler/Manson
• Lindholm/Bieska
• Theodore Montour/Stoner

Still have Larsson Megna and Welinski. 

And Perry gets relegated to the bench all season?

[gotbeer]

54 minutes ago, OCAngelsNotLAA said:

And Perry gets relegated to the bench all season?

Lol. Forgot about him. Sure! 

[tennischmp]

Wish my favorite team played with with the hunger and fire the Pens played with in a pivotal game 5 vs the Preds

[Brandon]

first time this series that they have looked the better team. 

[tennischmp]

Sometimes that's all that is needed, the Ducks weren't exactly dominating the first 4 games either but still were tied at 2 going into game 5 and laid a goose egg

[mrwicked]

16 hours ago, tennischmp said:

Wish my favorite team played with with the hunger and fire the Pens played with in a pivotal game 5 vs the Preds

we looked great in game 6.

wish we got this version of rinne and not pekka 'cy young' rinne. 

[tennischmp]

20 hours ago, mrwicked said:

we looked great in game 6.

wish we got this version of rinne and not pekka 'cy young' rinne. 

Sometimes its up to the opposing team to make the goaltender look back

[nate]

If the Ducks trade Montour then they have seriously morphed into one of the worst run teams in the league.

[Gavin]

I don't agree with you on much when it comes to the Ducks, but I agree with you on that. There is absolutely no reason for the Ducks to trade an expansion draft exempt defenseman. 

I still think Vatanen is the one to go. Personally, I can't wait for this expansion draft shit to be over with. 

[gotbeer]

6 hours ago, Gavin said:

I don't agree with you on much when it comes to the Ducks, but I agree with you on that. There is absolutely no reason for the Ducks to trade an expansion draft exempt defenseman. 

I still think Vatanen is the one to go. Personally, I can't wait for this expansion draft shit to be over with. 

Depends on who you trade him for.  If it's a for a top young offensive player (Drouin), you have to do it.  If it's for someone's overpriced top veteran, then you probably won't, but have to really think about it (Duchene).  Teams aren't going to trade difference makers for nothing.