The five reasons why Mike Trout will be an Angel for life.

[fan_since79]

Just now, Stradling said:

That's fine with me. 

The end times are surely near if you're sick of Scioscia.

 

[Stradling]

Just now, fan_since79 said:

The end times are surely near if you're sick of Scioscia.

 

I've been indifferent about him for awhile.  I defend him against what I deem dumb things people say.  

[Make Angels Great Again]

20 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

Flopfag

This is a hilarious typo.

[Troll Daddy]

9 minutes ago, Make Angels Great Again said:

This is a hilarious typo.

Corrected ... damn spellcheck 

[Docwaukee]

1 hour ago, ettin said:

I'm not sure there were that many people who thought he'd spend this last off-season tbh (2016-2017). However in the previous off-season (2015-2016) I and others did think they would spend on a big free agent and yes you are correct they did not for probably a variety of reasons. Moreno did indicate that they would for the right guy but that never materialized.

Arte doesn't even have to open up his checkbook. As long as he maintains current spending levels the Angels will have a lot of AAV space. If he allows Eppler to go up to the CBT threshold they will have even more. If Arte actually gets crazy he will allow him to exceed it (but I'll believe that when I see it).

I seriously doubt Pujols will hit 3rd or 4th after this season. They will very likely discuss moving him down in the order to 5th or 6th moving forward but we'll believe that when we see it too. Albert knows he's not performing and the Angels will have a different lineup in 2018 which means a hard discussion is coming soon if Pujols doesn't show some life here in the 2nd half.

I agree that Arte will continue to spend right up to the threshold.  I don't think we are 'waiting' on the farm (that's for Flop) as much as it's just imperative that we don't ignore it.  By the time 2019 and 20 roll around, there will be actual players ready to contribute at the major league level.  In the mean time, we can spend a little cash and rub our rabbits foot of good health.  The roster that includes our DL has talent.  It's not a wasteland.  It just seems that way offensively because Calhoun, Cron and Valbuena are having off years.  To have them doing what they are relative to what they should be is actually quite a big deal.  Certainly making Albert's cliff dive and Escobar's appropriate decline that much more impactful.  

The more I think about it, the more I see us bringing in Moustakas.  Power bat.  LHed.  Solid D.  3bman.  From socal.  Still in his prime.  I hope 5/90 gets it done.  Then I think we'll stop gap LF and make a trade for a 2bman.    I really hope we stay away from high priced pitched as those available are passed their prime.  

[VariousCrap]

8 hours ago, CALZONE said:

 4) We've been saying that for years. The farm won't correct itself in two years when Trout will be entering his contract year. We don't even have an Ace pitcher in place or well established closer. How good will Calhoun and Pujols be in 3 years? Oh and Scioscia will be gone so Albert won't be as comfortable as he normally is. 

 

You continually say the Angels suck and this and that.  However, do you seriously believe if the Angels had a healthy starting rotation this season, they wouldn't be in it this year?  

If the Angels rotation this year was a healthy Richards, Heaney, Skaggs, Trop and Shoemaker, this team would be much closer to the Astros and would probably be in the Wild Card lead right now.

This team does not suck, they have just had way too many injuries.  The Dodgers have the best record in baseball but if they had lost their entire starting rotation for pretty much the entire season, they would be doing better than the Angels have, but they wouldn't be in first place.

[VariousCrap]

1 hour ago, Stradling said:

If Albert bats 3rd or 4th next year and is playing like this then shame on Eppler and Arte.  It means either they didn't improve the roster or they didn't tell Sosh to cut the shit and move him down.  

 

They should be telling Sosh that this season.  Simmons should be hitting behind Trout.

[VariousCrap]

19 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

 The more I think about it, the more I see us bringing in Moustakas.  Power bat.  LHed.  Solid D.  3bman.  From socal.  Still in his prime.  I hope 5/90 gets it done.  Then I think we'll stop gap LF and make a trade for a 2bman.    I really hope we stay away from high priced pitched as those available are passed their prime.  

 

I wouldn't mind the Angels signing Maybin for LF as long as it is only for 2 or 3 years.

[Make Angels Great Again]

 

15 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

I agree that Arte will continue to spend right up to the threshold.  I don't think we are 'waiting' on the farm (that's for Flop) as much as it's just imperative that we don't ignore it.  By the time 2019 and 20 roll around, there will be actual players ready to contribute at the major league level.  In the mean time, we can spend a little cash and rub our rabbits foot of good health.  The roster that includes our DL has talent.  It's not a wasteland.  It just seems that way offensively because Calhoun, Cron and Valbuena are having off years.  To have them doing what they are relative to what they should be is actually quite a big deal.  Certainly making Albert's cliff dive and Escobar's appropriate decline that much more impactful.  

The more I think about it, the more I see us bringing in Moustakas.  Power bat.  LHed.  Solid D.  3bman.  From socal.  Still in his prime.  I hope 5/90 gets it done.  Then I think we'll stop gap LF and make a trade for a 2bman.    I really hope we stay away from high priced pitched as those available are passed their prime.  

 

Maybe we could do what the Marlins did in 2011 or whatever and go on a spending binge and sign Moustakas, JD Martinez, and Lance Lynn.

A guy can dream, right?

[VariousCrap]

Back to original point of the thread.

I think the Angels, Dodgers, Yankees and maybe a couple other teams will all make Trout similar $$$ offers.

It will come down to which team gives him a shot at a WS and comfort.  Obviously, the Angels will have the edge in comfort due to his being with the organization his entire career, but the shot at a WS is still up in the air.  That said, if the Angels can finally get healthy with their starting rotation, add a couple key offensive hitters to the line-up over the next couple seasons, the Angels will be a playoff team again.

[Stradling]

26 minutes ago, heRo said:

Maybe the right question to start with is SHOULD he be an Angel for life. Given the many many holes in this team, and the monster contract it will take to keep him, and Arte's clear refusal to go over the salary cap, where would that leave us?   If he really wants to stay maybe we can get him for the right price:  but otherwise it's putting too many eggs in one basket IMO.

A few things that are pretty clear at this point:

1)  Albert isn't going anywhere no matter how much some wish he would.

2)  Mike will get the largest contract in history, if he wants it.

3)  Rarely do these giant long term contracts work out well.  Trout is young enough though that I like his odds better than a Pujols or Cabrera,but it's still a huge risk. 30% or so of the entire team salary on ONE player?  Not so sure about that.

4)  Our pitching needs some serious help and I think relying on Richards etal. to come back and save the day is a bit optimistic at this point.  If we really want to compete we need to set aside at least 60MM a year to get an ace, a #2 or 3 starter, and some bullpen pieces.  Add that to the 40MM or more that Trout will get, plus 30MM for Pujols, and you're talking 130MM right there before we even address some of our other "issues".  That doesn't add up.  Yeah Pujols comes off at some point but then you need a legit DH to protect Trout.

5) If we're serious about signing Trout long term forget about getting a Moustakas or the like.  Just ain't in the budget.

6)  Trout wants to win a championship, and if Arte doesn't open the checkbook soon and show him that he's serious about building a winner, I think all of this will be a moot point. Either negotiate and get him to sign something soon, or trade him soon and get max return.  

Discuss.

Hero, he will not be 30% of our entire salary.  He isn't getting $60 million a season, I doubt he will get $45 million a season.  The payroll threshold will probably be around $200 million in 2021, so 30% would be $60 million.  If he gets $45 million that is 22% if he goes up to the threshold.  I am guessing something like 8 years $350 million is about what it will take.  With possible bonuses similar to Alberts contract for 500 home runs, assuming he is on the verge of obtaining that, or 3000 hits.  Maybe some for MVP or World Series MVP.  That type of stuff.  

Signing guys like Moustakas to a 5 year deal won't hurt the Angels ability to resign Trout.  If Arte wants to keep Trout he would be more than happy to go over the tax for a year or two in order to secure Trout, and I believe the time table for our newest batch of minor leaguers is right around 2020 and 21.  That gives you talent on the cheap.  

[Bob Trop]

The way the roster looks today the position players worth keeping with Trout are Simmons and Maldonado. The top position players in the system are at the lower levels of the minors. There is no power hitting first basemen, no sure thing at second or third. In 2020-21 Trout can be flanked by Adell and Jones. The only saviors will be healthy starters among Heaney, Skaggs, Tropeano and who ever is brought up from the minors. 

It is way too hard to predict with any certainty where #27 will wind up. The prudent thing may be to check out trade possibilities in a couple years if the Angels are still floundering.

Edited July 28, 2017 by Bob Trop
Spelling

[floplag]

2 hours ago, Make Angels Great Again said:

This is a hilarious typo.

the things people come out of the woodwork for... 

[stormngt]

2 hours ago, Stradling said:

I've been indifferent about him for awhile.  I defend him against what I deem dumb things people say.  

If i am not mistaken you advocated firing Scioscia over Dipoto.  

I have been the biggest Scioscia supporter on this board and i am accepting the idea that change is coming.  I would like to see him manage on year past his contract so he can get twenty years with one team.  Outside of that i can see him gone after his contract.

Although i do have to remind you guys be careful what you ask for!  There was a lot of criticism of Stoneman.  He left and we got Reagins.  There was celevrations when Reagins left and we get Dipoto.  Its too early to rate Eppler 

We might get rid of Scioscia only to get the second coming of Terry Collins.

[Stradling]

2 minutes ago, stormngt said:

If i am not mistaken you advocated firing Scioscia over Dipoto.  

I have been the biggest Scioscia supporter on this board and i am accepting the idea that change is coming.  I would like to see him manage on year past his contract so he can get twenty years with one team.  Outside of that i can see him gone after his contract.

Although i do have to remind you guys be careful what you ask for!  There was a lot of criticism of Stoneman.  He left and we got Reagins.  There was celevrations when Reagins left and we get Dipoto.  Its too early to rate Eppler 

We might get rid of Scioscia only to get the second coming of Terry Collins.

Yep I did advocate firing him over Dipoto, I was wrong.  I also now know it was more of a Dipoto issue than a Scioscia issue.  Also it took me awhile to see what Dipoto was and wasn't.  I'm considered a Scioscia Apologist no different than you. 

[nate]

Nice @Dochalo

I am not quite as optimistic about #2 and #1 but I do think that as long as the Angels want him and will pay him, which it would be ludicrous if they didn't, he will be here.  I would love for him to be locked up for another 10+ soon, maybe this off season.

[stormngt]

5 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Yep I did advocate firing him over Dipoto, I was wrong.  I also now know it was more of a Dipoto issue than a Scioscia issue.  Also it took me awhile to see what Dipoto was and wasn't.  I'm considered a Scioscia Apologist no different than you. 

Funny thing is at the time i said Arte should fire both Dipoto and Scioscia if they couldnt get along.  In hindsight it was more Dipito as you said.

[Troll Daddy]

I'm ok with Scioscia ... the Angels would be hard pressed to find a better in game manager. No manager makes the right decision every time without use of a crystal ball.

 

[ten ocho recon scout]

On 7/28/2017 at 6:14 AM, CALZONE said:

First of all Albert Pujols is not Trout's dad so please don't go there. Trout has an agent that clearly said that they were comfortable with the years in his current contract because it leaves his options open. I'm not saying that he won't sign an extension, I'm saying that he has put himself in a position with his performance and his current contract to do whatever he wants to do. Play wherever he wants to play. Live wherever he wants to live. He could even choose to be the next Barry Sanders (similar situation) and retire young, healthy and wealthy. Who knows what his fiancées thoughts are and how that will impact his decision. He's earned the right to make those decisions and he's mature enough to evaluate his own legacy. 

Trout and his agent also asked the angels for a far longer contract than it eventually turned into.

The Dodgers, IMO, are the team to worry about, and for whatever reason people dont mention them. (Its always phillies or yankees). The reason i say that is the whole "hes an east coast guy" is kind of BS. California grew on him and his family quick. That doesnt mean much if anything. But he is very happy living where he is now. Thats why i have a bad feeling about the dodgers.

As far as your comment that some other team will be willing to outbid arte, dont buy it at all. Mike may eventually leave for another team, for lots of money, but it wont be because moreno didnt match the bid. If anything id bet moreno offers more than anyone else. Trout is worth more to us than any other team. 

 

[Docwaukee]

On 7/28/2017 at 10:11 AM, Chuckster70 said:

Hi @Dochalo, I really agree with your 5 points on why Trout will end up being a lifer Angel. 

This was too good not to share with a broader audience so I posted it on our Blog which reaches our social media platforms as well.

http://thesportsdaily.com/angels-win/five-reasons-why-mike-trout-will-be-an-angel-for-life/

Thanks Chuck.  I missed this until I saw it on the homepage.  

[Lou]

3 hours ago, heRo said:

The Angels were terrible in his only playoff appearance and he was worse than most.  One hit the entire series.  That's part of the reason I'm not all in on him like most here are.

lol @ judging Trout on a 3-game series in 2014 

 

[jsnpritchett]

#6: Fergus Chan will do play-by-play on every Trout plate appearance.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

On 7/28/2017 at 6:10 AM, California Cajun said:

Arte has been sandbagging the last few years until a couple of contracts gone sour expire.  He has to exercise better judgment, respect the chain of command, and let the baseball people make the baseball decisions.  If he doesn't trust his baseball people, he has to go out and get some he does.

Back in the years when I followed the Braves more closely, Ted Turner made the mistake of paying a lot of money to players who he liked personally, hoping that it would motivate them to increase their performance. It didn't work. It wasn't until he hired astute baseball people and began listening to them that they became the organization that won 14 consecutive division titles.

[California Cajun]

12 hours ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

Back in the years when I followed the Braves more closely, Ted Turner made the mistake of paying a lot of money to players who he liked personally, hoping that it would motivate them to increase their performance. It didn't work. It wasn't until he hired astute baseball people and began listening to them that they became the organization that won 14 consecutive division titles.

Honestly, I think Ted Turner has a short attention span and loses interest in things fairly quickly.  I've wondered if Arte is less interested in the Angels than he used to be.  Will he write the check that makes Trout a Halo for life, or does he hope to sell by then?

[Angels#1Fan]

23 hours ago, heRo said:

Really?  The Angels were terrible in his only playoff appearance and he was worse than most.  One hit the entire series.  That's part of the reason I'm not all in on him like most here are.  Will he do better the next time he sees the post season, of course he will.  But does he have the killer instinct and leadership skills you need if you drop a 3-400 million dollar contract?

Go back to your Detroit board troll.