Has Scioscia given up?

[JoJo26]

Bud Black...

[Guest]

Pujols fell apart and so did this team. What an epic mess.

Pujols said if he couldn't play well anymore he would retire.

Time to retire Pujols!

Pujols definition of "not playing at a high level" is likely very different than what fans have in mind.

Not only that but if Pujols attempted to leave money on the table, the MLBPA would plant the severed head of Pujols' favorite race horse on his mattress

[ABC]

This is a conversation I have had too many times on here, but why would you want to manage this group of players if you could opt out, almost be guaranteed to manage a stronger roster and get simliar guaranteed money? Sure maybe instead of 3 years and $18 million he would get 4 years and $20 million, so it is less guaranteed money per year.

 

Good point. Arte would have to start butting heads with Sosh for him to think about a change of scenery. 

[Stradling]

Lux, if a player retires then he retires. The players union would not give two shits about a player retiring in the middle of their contract. What the players union doesn't like is the idea of a player restructuring his contract and take less money. As far as retiring, they wouldn't interfere.

[gurn67]

Andrew Friedman did not become President of Baseball Operations of the Dodgers so that he could be forced to hire Mike Scioscia. Ain't gonna happen.

[HeavenlyHalos]

This is a conversation I have had too many times on here, but why would you want to manage this group of players if you could opt out, almost be guaranteed to manage a stronger roster and get simliar guaranteed money? Sure maybe instead of 3 years and $18 million he would get 4 years and $20 million, so it is less guaranteed money per year.

 

The perceived power he has within the organization would be the biggest reason. Granted, that level of authority is still speculative and fans making educated guesses. You do bring up a good point though, but are we so sure that he would get another managerial position right away? In particular, one with a better roster. What if all the rumors of his authority/stubbornness are true? What GM would want to risk his authority by bringing him in? And now I'm rolling with the speculation/educated guesses. My bad. The point being, its hard to say what is going to happen, but you haven't changed your stance that he would opt out, and I understand your reasoning for thinking that is a possibility.

[mp170.6]

It's crazy when you realize how 90% of the Angels' problems are the result of Moreno having too much money. 

 

There's a life lesson to be learned in all of this...

[mp170.6]

The perceived power he has within the organization would be the biggest reason. Granted, that level of authority is still speculative and fans making educated guesses. You do bring up a good point though, but are we so sure that he would get another managerial position right away? In particular, one with a better roster. What if all the rumors of his authority/stubbornness are true? What GM would want to risk his authority by bringing him in? And now I'm rolling with the speculation/educated guesses. My bad. The point being, its hard to say what is going to happen, but you haven't changed your stance that he would opt out, and I understand your reasoning for thinking that is a possibility.

 

Scioscia could have opted out YEARS ago simply by quitting.  If he was perceived by other MLB teams to be that great of a manager, another team would have been waiting to pay him more money. 

 

I think the joke is on us thinking he was so great to begin with.

[Stradling]

The perceived power he has within the organization would be the biggest reason. Granted, that level of authority is still speculative and fans making educated guesses. You do bring up a good point though, but are we so sure that he would get another managerial position right away? In particular, one with a better roster. What if all the rumors of his authority/stubbornness are true? What GM would want to risk his authority by bringing him in? And now I'm rolling with the speculation/educated guesses. My bad. The point being, its hard to say what is going to happen, but you haven't changed your stance that he would opt out, and I understand your reasoning for thinking that is a possibility.

To be honest I like the conversation, just not with the type of people on here that basically say he won't get another job because he sucks, it is like arguing Dipoto being a GM again with storm. But these guys are all competitive and have been all of their lives, so given a better chance to win would probably be more appealing than having power. If he has all the power people say he has, then he might want to wash his hands of this lousy roster he created or had a hand in creating.

[The God of Runs]

Scioscia could have opted out YEARS ago simply by quitting.  If he was perceived by other MLB teams to be that great of a manager, another team would have been waiting to pay him more money. 

 

I think the joke is on us thinking he was so great to begin with.

 

What made Scioscia great was Salmon, Eckstein, GA, Percival, Frankie Rodriguez, Erstad, Vlad, Shields, Weaver

[HeavenlyHalos]

To be honest I like the conversation, just not with the type of people on here that basically say he won't get another job because he sucks, it is like arguing Dipoto being a GM again with storm. But these guys are all competitive and have been all of their lives, so given a better chance to win would probably be more appealing than having power. If he has all the power people say he has, then he might want to wash his hands of this lousy roster he created or had a hand in creating.

 

Fair enough. I'm just not so sure he would get another managerial job with a team that has more talent on paper than the Angels currently have (meaning a team over .500 essentially). I have no idea how true these rumors are regarding Scioscia and his level of authority within the organization, but I would imagine other GM's would have some idea. I guess what I am ultimately getting at is that I would be shocked it he opted out.

[mp170.6]

To be honest I like the conversation, just not with the type of people on here that basically say he won't get another job because he sucks, it is like arguing Dipoto being a GM again with storm. But these guys are all competitive and have been all of their lives, so given a better chance to win would probably be more appealing than having power. If he has all the power people say he has, then he might want to wash his hands of this lousy roster he created or had a hand in creating.

 

I don't think Scioscia is completely inept.  He has been helped greatly by Moreno's willingness to spend $$$ on free agent talent. 

 

A relatively weak AL West has also helped greatly.  Heck, even Mike Trout has made Scioscia appear much better than reality in recent years. 

[ABC]

It's crazy when you realize how 90% of the Angels' problems are the result of Moreno having too much money. 

 

There's a life lesson to be learned in all of this...

 

Yeah, stop thinking loads of money is bad thing. He earned it, he gets to blow it. 

[Guest]

Fair enough. I'm just not so sure he would get another managerial job with a team that has more talent on paper than the Angels currently have (meaning a team over .500 essentially). I have no idea how true these rumors are regarding Scioscia and his level of authority within the organization, but I would imagine other GM's would have some idea. I guess what I am ultimately getting at is that I would be shocked it he opted out.

I would also be surprised to see Scioscia be willing to move out of the area. He actually has remained in Westlake Village where he lived while with the Dodgers rather than relocate to someplace without a 100 minute one way commute like Newport Beach .

I don't blame him, I hate relocating myself even though many of my peers believe I should move out of state nearly every other year to get slightly bigger pay increases.

[Stradling]

I don't think Scioscia is completely inept. He has been helped greatly by Moreno's willingness to spend $$$ on free agent talent.

A relatively weak AL West has also helped greatly. Heck, even Mike Trout has made Scioscia appear much better than reality in recent years.

So good players make managers look better than they are? So when we have bad players, it might actually make the manager look worse than he is.

[JoJo26]

9-2

15-3

11-5

Butcher first - Scioscia next. Kill 2 birds - Hire Bud Black

[JoJo26]

It's crazy when you realize how 90% of the Angels' problems are the result of Moreno having too much money.

There's a life lesson to be learned in all of this...

It's not "too much money" It's what he spends it on.

[mp170.6]

So good players make managers look better than they are? So when we have bad players, it might actually make the manager look worse than he is.

 

That is true. 

 

Unfortunately, we've had "bad" players selected by three GM's, many of whom tank from their career averages soon after joining the Angels.  The underachievement has been a normal phenomenon under Mike Scioscia for a really long time. 

[mp170.6]

It's not "too much money" It's what he spends it on.

 

FWIW, most of the great teams in recent memories have not been the big spenders. 

[Stradling]

That is true.

Unfortunately, we've had "bad" players selected by three GM's, many of whom tank from their career averages soon after joining the Angels. The underachievement has been a normal phenomenon under Mike Scioscia for a really long time.

Do you blame Scioscia for Albert, Josh, Blanton, Hanson?

[Inside Pitch]

I just want this team to move forward with their new GM and let him do whatever he's going to do..   Anything less than full authority will end up a complete failure.

[HeavenlyHalos]

Speaking of one of those former GMs, that is also the current GM, can you imagine had he made the Cabrera trade? I realize that the speculation is that the Marlins called it off, but I would imagine we would have won a WS or two if that trade went through. And had that happened, Scioscia most likely would be staying here until his contract expires. Then again.... the Tigers haven't won a WS with him so maybe not.

[Blarg]

Those of us who remember watching the Angels in August 1999 know what the players are doing.

 

Trying to get the GM fired and traded to St.Louis?

[mp170.6]

Do you blame Scioscia for Albert, Josh, Blanton, Hanson?

 

I don't look at it that way.  There are many more players over several seasons that have underachieved as Angels.  Look at the entire sample size and ask the same question -- don't just hand pick a few. 

 

Huston Street's comments yesterday echo what I've complained about for years -- absolutely no urgency.  This "one game at a time" nonsense is crap.  Same with "turn the page".  Some players I think need that urgency to play at their potential. 

[The Ghost of Bob Starr]

Well we know that Dipoto gave up.

What a shitty ****ing team.

My brother compared it to the Lakers, when they just sit around and wait for Kobe to do something.

Ha. The lakers have rings. We got lucky one night at the bar with a hottie in 2002. That's a dynastical franchise. We are perennial underachievers.