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IGNORED

Has Scioscia given up?


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People can blame Arte or Scoscia or Dipoto or whatever... but there the thing, how did the organization end up with so many holes AND no farm to fill it ?

Its great that we have this wonderful young pitching staff and all, but seriously, how the Hades did we end up with virtually no position player prospects?
 

Is there literally sanything on the farm that hasnt already had a cup of coffee that we can expects in the next few years at his point?  

You think its bad now, how do you think this gets fixed?

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People can blame Arte or Scoscia or Dipoto or whatever... but there the thing, how did the organization end up with so many holes AND no farm to fill it ?

Its great that we have this wonderful young pitching staff and all, but seriously, how the Hades did we end up with virtually no position player prospects?

 

Is there literally sanything on the farm that hasnt already had a cup of coffee that we can expects in the next few years at his point?  

You think its bad now, how do you think this gets fixed?

This is the year that 1st round picks like Cron, Cowart, Conger, Grichuck should be leading the way. How's that working out?

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Stradling wrote
"I wish we had Maddon as well. Though with this group the performance would be only a slight improvement if any, just not a ton of talent offensively."

You may or may not know or remember that Joe Maddon was the "computer geek" of the coaching staff when he was here. He started using all the defensive and hitting metrics when they were still something relatively new.
Had he been made manager with a voice in the trades and acquisitions, it is very possible that NONE OF THE PUKES with big salaries and low production would be here in the f'n first place!!!

Anointing Scioscia "King For Life" was a major F-UP, THE #1 MAJOR F-UP... and this org has paid, and will continue to pay for that major F-UP.
It is the #1 reason that the org is where it's at today.
I've been saying this openly from the time I came to this board, and was saying it on other boards before I got here.

Edited by Homebrewer
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Trading Grichuk to the Cards is a start to answering your question

 

that and more, but the point is that its a top down problem.  bad signings, bad trades, bad evaluations of minor league talent, too many "cant misss" guys that missed.... its a menagerie or errors on all possible levels as an organization.  Add to that a manager thats already looking passed managing and its a bad combination. 

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"Nice to see you back on the warpath, Homebrewer. You were so quiet when the Angels won the division last year.

With the same manager."

Nice to see you back worrying about what I (and other posters) think.

I suggest (again) that you might try having an opinion of your own, rather than policing and attacking everyone else's

Edited by Homebrewer
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"Nice to see you back on the warpath, Homebrewer. You were so quiet when the Angels won the division last year.

With the same manager."

Nice to see you back worrying about what I (and other posters) think.

I suggest (again) that you might try having an opinion of your own, rather than policing and attacking everyone else's

 

I have an opinion of my own but don't disappear when the team is playing well or poorly. Pretty much around 24/7 all year round. You and a few others that we would have thought their accounts went idle suddenly are jumping in on threads after a long hiatus. I guess the subject matter now suits your liking.

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Stradling wrote

"I wish we had Maddon as well. Though with this group the performance would be only a slight improvement if any, just not a ton of talent offensively."

You may or may not know or remember that Joe Maddon was the "computer geek" of the coaching staff when he was here. He started using all the defensive and hitting metrics when they were still something relatively new.

Had he been made manager with a voice in the trades and acquisitions, it is very possible that NONE OF THE PUKES with big salaries and low production would be here in the f'n first place!!!

Anointing Scioscia "King For Life" was a major F-UP, THE #1 MAJOR F-UP... and this org has paid, and will continue to pay for that major F-UP.

It is the #1 reason that the org is where it's at today.

I've been saying this openly from the time I came to this board, and was saying it on other boards before I got here.

Oh I get that Maddon was one of the first to institute computers into game planning. But don't ignore the fact that he is a quirky manager that manages with feel. I think it was Longoria, but it could have been someone else that was in a horendous slump, and he batted him leadoff to get him more at bats and to tell him he still had faith in him. He has done other things as well where he had a hunch. Like anything else sometimes the work, other times they won't, no different than any other manager using his gut or using statistics.

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I don't think Scioscia has given up on anything, I doubt it is in his makeup. But I do believe a combination of an imbalanced team and ineffective strategies will prevent the Angels from making a serious push for a Wild Card or Divisional lead. I hope I am wrong but the past series against division leaders resulting in being swept on a couple occasions says the team is not equipped for post season play.  

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If the GM here actually had the reins, that might be possible. As it stands, no experienced GM would come here.

This little nugget from mlbtraderumors.com:

 

"As others have noted, the Angels‘ GM opening is a tough sell to prospective candidates because Arte Moreno is more involved than the average owner, and Mike Scioscia has more power than the average manager. One rival general manager described the Angels’ GM role to Rosenthal as such: “You take all of the beatings (from Moreno) and you’ve got no power (due to Scioscia).” Jerry Dipoto resigned from his post this summer due to reported clashes with Scioscia."

 

Taken with a grain of salt, obviously, but I think it highlights what any potential GM candidate would look at in terms of the Angels' GM opening.  Angels may be seeking an experienced GM to fill their vacancy but often GMs want to place their stamp on their tenor by hiring their own people, including manager or player personel.  So the choices are:

 

1 -  Stay in-house and promote the current asst GM

2 - Go after someone much like Jerry, 1st time GM who is likelier to take the job with Scioscia at the reign with an understanding of his power and input

3 - Hire a seasoned GM and allow him/her to remake the franchise in their vision.

 

I'd say 2 is the least likeliest scenario and I think it will be a choice of 1 or 3.  Either Arte continues to ride out the rough times and hope it improves or takes the franchise in a different direction

Edited by mulwin444
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This little nugget from mlbtraderumors.com:

"As others have noted, the Angels‘ GM opening is a tough sell to prospective candidates because Arte Moreno is more involved than the average owner, and Mike Scioscia has more power than the average manager. One rival general manager described the Angels’ GM role to Rosenthal as such: “You take all of the beatings (from Moreno) and you’ve got no power (due to Scioscia).” Jerry Dipoto resigned from his post this summer due to reported clashes with Scioscia."

Taken with a grain of salt, obviously, but I think it highlights what any potential GM candidate would look at in terms of the Angels' GM opening. Angels may be seeking an experienced GM to fill their vacancy but often GMs want to place their stamp on their tenor by hiring their own people, including manager or player personel. So the choices are:

1 - Stay in-house and promote the current asst GM

2 - Go after someone much like Jerry, 1st time GM who is likelier to take the job with Scioscia at the reign with an understanding of his power and input

3 - Hire a seasoned GM and allow him/her to remake the franchise in their vision.

I'd say 2 is the least likeliest scenario and I think it will be a choice of 1 or 3. Either Arte continues to ride out the rough times and hope it improves or takes the franchise in a different direction

Exactly why yes man Reagins and diaper dandy Dipoto were the perfect fits at the time of their hirings. Andrew Friedman who was an already established and experienced baseball executive wasn't going to play the Arte / Scioscia shuffleboard game.

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Exactly why yes man Reagins and diaper dandy Dipoto were the perfect fits at the time of their hirings. Andrew Friedman who was an already established and experienced baseball executive wasn't going to play the Arte / Scioscia shuffleboard game.

Or Friedman wasn't ready to leave Tampa yet.

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Or Friedman wasn't ready to leave Tampa yet.

Andrew Friedman was already serving as the Rays VP of Baseball Operations / GM at the time he was interviewed by the Angels. There's no way he would've accepted a lessor role as the Angels GM and answer to Scioscia. Dipoto was the inexperienced guy that saw an opportunity to advance. Friedman who is much younger than Dipoto now has an even better position today as the President of Baseball Operations for the Dodgers. He should've been handed the entire President of Baseball Operations job by Arte in 2012. I think we would've had a much different team today.

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well, not sure if Scioscia has 'given up' but the team's play is sure lackluster and has been for at least two weeks.

 

at this point, face the music -- even if the Halos make the playoffs (the Division title is looking less and less likely) and sneak in as one of the Wild Card teams. I'm just not seeing a long run playoff team here.

 

the Halos rotation -- which has done well pretty much all season and has exceeded expectations -- has seen the glass slipper fall off and it's not even midnight.

 

this weekend I am going to see two real playoff teams that play REAL baseball, a rare commodity these days --- St. Louis Cardinals at SF Giants -- AT&T Park.

 

Giants are out of a playoff spot right now but I think they are going to catch and pass the Dogs to win the NL West.

 

The Angels?? May be third in the AL West and watching the post-season games from the couch like the rest of us.

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