QUERY of Angelswin.com posters: Are we buyers or sellers at Deadline time - explain.

[disarcina]

Hey FOLKS -- we're getting to trade deadline time. Halos have had a mediocre first half (although we have certainly seen worse over our time here) and how have reached .500 - or hovering near or just above it lately.

Are we Sellers (and what do we have to sell ? Sandoval?) or Buyers ?(the Halos and every other team in MLB needs pitching - rotation and pen help - such deadline deal help - even rentals - will be EXPENSIVE).

Do we have a realistic shot of catching Oakland and Houston - perhaps making the playoffs as one of the expanded also ran Wild Card teams -- is a one game playoff worth mortgaging the Halos future and giving up what few top pitching prospect help we may have coming up?

Or - do we sell what little we have - pitchers like Sandoval (who could fetch some value , I would think); maybe Cobb -- I don't know -- I don't think we have much to sell other than those guys. We're not dealing Ontani  (no trade clause anyway) Trout (franchise player), Rendon (big contract) 

I wouldn't trade Ward -who seems to be coming on well at the plate and from watching him just looks more comfortable at the plate. 

What does everyone think ?  And, really, if the front office is NOT going to lay out some payroll commitment more than one year (need more like three year deal) to invest in some starting pitching for 2022 - does it matter much of what we do anyway?

[Taylor]

This should be a pole.

[eligrba]

14 minutes ago, Taylor said:

This should be a pole.

[Chuck]

How we do in the next 4-5 series will determine if we're buyers or sellers IMO.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

Hey, who are you calling a query?

[Angelsjunky]

There are 19 games until the ASB (July 12-15), which I think will answer this question. 1 vs DET, 2 vs SFG, 3 vs TB, 4 vs NYY, 3 vs BAL, 3 vs. BOS, 3 vs SEA. So mostly good teams. And then after the ASB, they've got another 15 games before the deadline. So 34 games before the deadline, total. A lot can happen.

[Docwaukee]

I've got nothing to add other than I saw AJ posted and wanted to make sure he didn't write anything complementary about the team.  

[tdawg87]

4 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

There are 19 games until the ASB (July 12-15), which I think will answer this question. 1 vs DET, 2 vs SFG, 3 vs TB, 4 vs NYY, 3 vs BAL, 3 vs. BOS, 3 vs SEA.

I think just looking at that schedule answers the question.

[WicketMaiden]

I think we should be sellers, regardless of what we do between now and the deadline. The franchise needs a change of strategy and just stumbling along around .500 hoping a hot streak puts us in contention for a wildcard hasn't worked. This team is good at beating poor pitching and fails against the best pitching staffs, and it is pitching that wins championships. 

The bullpen is full of holes. We just don't have the arms to lock down a tight post-season series game after game. Our starters are very unpredictable and very pitch inefficient, so they are likely to be handing over to the pen early as we've seen all season. This is not a recipe to win in the post-season no matter how many runs we score.

We've got a lot of contracts ending, and a lot of minor leaguers we need to assess before next year (Thaiss, Adell, Marsh, Rengifo, Detmers), so I like this strategy: trade all of the one year deals at this deadline, acquire the best prospects available regardless of position, and then use those prospects to trade for the pitching we need to open a genuine window of contention in the off-season, while using the rest of this season to give the AAA guys an extended look. 

This year is fun, but miracles aside it's done as far as being competitive goes, so I'd like to see the Angels do something tangible for next year and 2023 rather than more of the same.

[tdawg87]

I mean we all know what's going to happen; the Angels will play just well enough to not be "sellers" but just poorly enough to not be buyers.

We'll trade Raisel Iglesias for a 27 year old reliever in AA, and Bundy for cash considerations. 

[Revad]

7 hours ago, failos said:

Lol I’m not posting my pic here.

 

7 hours ago, cals said:

That’s not a real stripper cause a real stripper would have a man around with a drill and a stud finder.  That’s probably an accountant’s wife.

Well she’s trying, imagine dating when you’re in your sixties.

[Angels 1961]

Angels can be both. I trade if you can Bundy, Heaney, Quintana, Jose Iglesias, R Iglesias, Suzuki, Lagares, Watson, Claudio plus others in pen. I see if Cobb wants to sign an extension of 2 years if not I trade him also. Angels have in house players to replace these players. I like to get Rengifo in lineup everyday so trading Jose Iglesias let's that happen. If adding any in trade I hope it's not a rental. Trading some of starters Angels be adding Barria, Suarez and maybe Detmers. 

[UndertheHalo]

It’s got to be both selling and buying.  They can’t start a multi year rebuild.  They’ve have to try and position themselves to be better next year.  Anyway, we’ll see how the next month or so goes. 

[Second Base]

The Angels are going to win a lot of games between now and the deadline.  But Oakland and Houston will too. Despite getting Trout back and being a few games over .500, they won't be serious buyers. 

Minasian will attempt to be opportunistic and see if he can swing a deal that helps now and in the future.  Sort of like when Reagins traded for Dan Haren. 

[Duren, Duren]

Too early to tell which way they'll go. If they get through this pre-deadline period over .500 and in the wild card conversation I can't see Minasian being a seller. A trader for some immediate pitching help? Yes. But nothing big that costs younger assets.

I think that the team playing better during Trout's absence is a positive for team morale, and a bit of a confidence builder going forward. To intentionally tank the rest of the season by selling useful players essentially is giving up on a season that has been a modest upgrade on recent years. And won't help fan enthusiasm either. 

That said, they do need short and long term pitching help. Bundy's contract is up and it seems he is stuck in another downward spiral. The bullpen is in shambles mostly. Russian roulette every game with most of them.

Minasian is in the first third of his first year. He hasn't begun to shape the team for the long term. But he can't give up on this year unless the team really regresses before the deadline. The fans deserve a modest positive season if possible. Otherwise Ohtani's possible MVP run will also get lost in the negativity around the team.

[ukyah]

5 hours ago, WicketMaiden said:

I think we should be sellers, regardless of what we do between now and the deadline. The franchise needs a change of strategy and just stumbling along around .500 hoping a hot streak puts us in contention for a wildcard hasn't worked. This team is good at beating poor pitching and fails against the best pitching staffs, and it is pitching that wins championships. 

The bullpen is full of holes. We just don't have the arms to lock down a tight post-season series game after game. Our starters are very unpredictable and very pitch inefficient, so they are likely to be handing over to the pen early as we've seen all season. This is not a recipe to win in the post-season no matter how many runs we score.

We've got a lot of contracts ending, and a lot of minor leaguers we need to assess before next year (Thaiss, Adell, Marsh, Rengifo, Detmers), so I like this strategy: trade all of the one year deals at this deadline, acquire the best prospects available regardless of position, and then use those prospects to trade for the pitching we need to open a genuine window of contention in the off-season, while using the rest of this season to give the AAA guys an extended look. 

This year is fun, but miracles aside it's done as far as being competitive goes, so I'd like to see the Angels do something tangible for next year and 2023 rather than more of the same.

i understand your point, but i've got a question for you and everybody else.

what do you think that says to trout, and how does he feel about that? imagine the team is playing the best it has in years, can kind of go either way, and right about the time he's ready to come back and make a push for the playoffs the team sells off a bunch of the young guys that it has developed.

this is the major reason i was so upset with this offseason. if they had just invested in more quality pitching, then we could be at a point where a few key additions could make the team really interesting. the way the staff is built now though, there are just way too many holes to fill. also, what could have been acquired in the offseason for the value of their contracts will now require prospects to acquire and that sets back the angels even more profoundly. i just felt like this offseason was so shortsighted, and they backed themselves into a corner strategically.

[Tank]

If they’re over .500, they’ll be buyers. If they’re under .500, sellers.

@cals

[WicketMaiden]

2 hours ago, ukyah said:

i understand your point, but i've got a question for you and everybody else.

what do you think that says to trout, and how does he feel about that? imagine the team is playing the best it has in years, can kind of go either way, and right about the time he's ready to come back and make a push for the playoffs the team sells off a bunch of the young guys that it has developed.

this is the major reason i was so upset with this offseason. if they had just invested in more quality pitching, then we could be at a point where a few key additions could make the team really interesting. the way the staff is built now though, there are just way too many holes to fill. also, what could have been acquired in the offseason for the value of their contracts will now require prospects to acquire and that sets back the angels even more profoundly. i just felt like this offseason was so shortsighted, and they backed themselves into a corner strategically.

I didn't say that at all. I said sell off all the one year guys that would be gone next year anyway. Raisel, Heaney, Cobb etc. Trout isn't an idiot, he can see this team won't go deep in the play-offs with the pitching it has just like the rest of us can.

[ukyah]

5 hours ago, WicketMaiden said:

I didn't say that at all. I said sell off all the one year guys that would be gone next year anyway. Raisel, Heaney, Cobb etc. Trout isn't an idiot, he can see this team won't go deep in the play-offs with the pitching it has just like the rest of us can.

i didn't say you did. i was posing a question to the group.

but you don't get anything for those guys. the team just saves some money. if you want improvement, then you sell off the guys that may actually net you prospect returns: stassi, walsh, ward, fletcher, sandoval.

you sell those guys you get some interesting prospects, but that's where my question lies.

[Stradling]

I think they should look to trade the Bundy’s, one of Cobb or Heaney, and both Iglesias.  

[ukyah]

35 minutes ago, Stradling said:

I think they should look to trade the Bundy’s, one of Cobb or Heaney, and both Iglesias.  

 

i would trade raisiel even if the angels were 10 games over .500, he's been busto for the angels. who cares what you get for him, just get rid of his salary and be done with him. he's clearly not the answer at closer. honestly, how many two strike runs has that guy giving up this year? i feel like every time i see it, it's two strikes.

trading bundy, cobb, iglesias (ss), and the like really don't amount to any changes. they're just not on the team anymore. maybe if minasian is really savvy he can score a couple rp's that might have some potential in the bullpen next year, but what else is he likely to get, other than salary relief.

if the angels are sellers, then they have to sell off the parts that matter because they're clearly not signing the pitching that matters otherwise they would have done it at some point in the last few years. nobody seems to want to answer that question though.

[Stradling]

I could give two shits about salary relief.  I want guys traded to see if we can get another Sandoval type or even the package we got for Goodwin. As for Raisel in save situations he’s been great. We haven’t lost a game this year when leading after 8.  I’d trade him because he will get us the most in return of the pending free agents.  

[mmc]

Sell off all rentals, buy anyone who you feel as though can help us in 2022 and beyond.  We are not making the playoffs this year, 6.5 GB is too much for this team to come back from.  Trade any of our expiring players or relievers and go out and make deals for controllable starters and another catcher if we can.

[arch stanton]

There's a huge variable that's yet to play out. Need to know what the sticky ban does to staffs around the league to find out how valuable our available pitchers can be and whether long term effects of it make the current staff any more viable for a decent post season run

[totdprods]

Too early still...a lot can happen the next couple weeks. I hope they buy and sell but hard to gauge who could be involved in either of those scenarios right now. There aren't any real clear-cut sells we could do without dinging our own chances who would bring back anything of value. Raisel and Jose are probably the closest. 

Buying market looks tough too. Lots of interested teams but not many impact pieces clearly available yet, at least that would fit our needs.