Cops are great

[arch stanton]

I still can't fathom why there are no non-lethal steps taken in between commanding someone to stop and put their hands up and firing lead into their chest.

[Blarg]

That would be easier to accept if police actually showed public remorse for their mistakes. 

 

No, not some boilerplate statement issued by the PIO or the union president.  I'd like to see the officers actually involved in unjustified shootings (and other screw ups) stand in front of a camera and tell their story, apologizing when the situation calls for it. 

 

I guess most police are too cowardly to apologize, even when they retire and have nothing to lose by speaking up.  The way some officers seem to spend years rationalizing their wrong behavior is disgraceful as well.  I get really tired of the current and former police officers in my circle of family and friends talking about the "****ing nigger" who almost got one of them fired.  This defendant was completely exonerated but the attacks on him and his skin color continue years later.  It's truly abominable what passes as professionalism in law enforcement these days. 

 

First off you indict yourself by saying unjust shootings when the above mentioned story outlined a case that would be considered justified if any of the escalation possibilities happened. Every word they say can be used against them in a civil case. Why in hell would they open their mouth ever about an incident when a lawyer is waiting to jump on them with a lawsuit? If it were you, do you think you would say anything and then let the chips fall where they may? You may be dumb enough in the moment to make a statement and then sped the next couple of years in court trying to distance yourself from it and the news media.

 

These aren't professional athletes that get to cry on camera and America forgives them for playing punch out with their girlfriends in an elevator and only get a two game suspension. These guys lose their earnings, future careers, life savings and families because of how the media and lawyers threat them when they are in the above mentioned scenario and had to make a decision that they would rather would have been glazed or jelly filled instead of tazed or bullet filled.

 

Yeah, some cops **** up and some cops don't but get ****ed up by the media all the same. Making an on camera statement doesn't change that.

[mp170.6]

First off you indict yourself by saying unjust shootings when the above mentioned story outlined a case that would be considered justified if any of the escalation possibilities happened. Every word they say can be used against them in a civil case. Why in hell would they open their mouth ever about an incident when a lawyer is waiting to jump on them with a lawsuit? If it were you, do you think you would say anything and then let the chips fall where they may? You may be dumb enough in the moment to make a statement and then sped the next couple of years in court trying to distance yourself from it and the news media.

 

These aren't professional athletes that get to cry on camera and America forgives them for playing punch out with their girlfriends in an elevator and only get a two game suspension. These guys lose their earnings, future careers, life savings and families because of how the media and lawyers threat them when they are in the above mentioned scenario and had to make a decision that they would rather would have been glazed or jelly filled instead of tazed or bullet filled.

 

Yeah, some cops **** up and some cops don't but get ****ed up by the media all the same. Making an on camera statement doesn't change that.

 

This is the excuse they like to hide behind, which is why I wrote "even when they retire and have nothing to lose by speaking up".

 

Why say anything?  Well, do police officers have a conscience?  I get the whole thing about possibly losing your job, but if you've erred and taken somebody's life away without a good reason, the least you could do is man up and apologize.  At that point, worrying about monetary penalties to yourself is extremely selfish and might be the least of your problems.

 

On a much lesser scale, police could apologize for smaller mistakes when nobody was injured and there's no risk of any lawsuit.  You're originally from Fullerton, right Eric?  I was at the train station when Kelly Thomas was being beaten into a coma back in 2011 and caught the tail end of the altercation.  Afterwards, members of the FPD swarmed the train station and neighboring businesses looking for people who had cell phone video in an attempt to seize their phones without a warrant.  There were threats, profanity, intimidation, you name it, directed at innocent bystanders, even senior citizens.  I didn't file a complaint but I know some people who did.  They received no apology or acknowledgment from the command staff, and certainly no apology from the officers themselves. 

 

Police wonder why the public dislikes them so much and that's a perfect reason why. 

[Don]

On a much lesser scale, police could apologize for smaller mistakes when nobody was injured and there's no risk of any lawsuit. You're originally from Fullerton, right Eric? I was at the train station when Kelly Thomas was being beaten into a coma back in 2011 and caught the tail end of the altercation. Afterwards, members of the FPD swarmed the train station and neighboring businesses looking for people who had cell phone video in an attempt to seize their phones without a warrant. There were threats, profanity, intimidation, you name it, directed at innocent bystanders, even senior citizens. I didn't file a complaint but I know some people who did. They received no apology or acknowledgment from the command staff, and certainly no apology from the officers themselves.

Police wonder why the public dislikes them so much and that's a perfect reason why.

Murdering someone with their fists doesn't help their public perception much either.

Going back to Poozy's original point, I don't doubt that stories get twisted to fit a pre-determined narrative all the time. I think that's why it's important to get to the facts of any given situation to come to a solid understanding of what happened. That's why I hope more departments begin using the uniform-mounted Go Pros. It offers more protection to the public and to individual officers. It certainly would have helped clear up what happened in Ferguson, MO, which I really have no clue about regarding who was in the right or the wrong. The cop might lose his job or worse over a clean shoot, and he also might get away with murder. And to me it is extremely unproductive that this story is and will continue to be about race rather than about properly documenting interactions between police and civilians. The same thing happened in the Trayvon Martin case. It became about a white guy (who was actually Cuban) shooting a black teenager when it really should've been about why anyone ever thought Zimmerman was smart enough to carry a gun in public or participate in a neighborhood watch group.

Edited August 13, 2014 by Don

[yk9001]

Another teen shot by LAPD.

 

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-lapd-explains-officer-shooting-20140813-story.html

[jshep]

Dear LAPD,

 

So there's a very real chance you've already ****ed up here, but do us all a favor: Look at what the police in Ferguson are doing in the wake of their similar incident.

 

After you do that, do the EXACT OPPOSITE of how they're handling it. Please and thank you.

Edited August 13, 2014 by jshep

[Blarg]

This is the excuse they like to hide behind, which is why I wrote "even when they retire and have nothing to lose by speaking up".

 

Why say anything?  Well, do police officers have a conscience? 

 

This is not about excuse making. It is about policy to shut up and have the department handle the press releases, no good comes from an officer answering to the medias and apparently your demand for an apology. You wouldn't buy it and the media is certainly going to exploit it.

 

Yes, police have a conscience and many end up with their entire life ****ed up because some asshole took their problem to the extent it cost them their life and in doing so also the officers. You have some delusion that these guys walk away and not have nightmares, marital problems, family and friend problems and just go on with their next shift. Honestly any explanation or apology would still be wasted on you because you can't see it from the other side.

[mp170.6]

This is not about excuse making. It is about policy to shut up and have the department handle the press releases, no good comes from an officer answering to the medias and apparently your demand for an apology. You wouldn't buy it and the media is certainly going to exploit it.

 

Yes, police have a conscience and many end up with their entire life ****ed up because some asshole took their problem to the extent it cost them their life and in doing so also the officers. You have some delusion that these guys walk away and not have nightmares, marital problems, family and friend problems and just go on with their next shift. Honestly any explanation or apology would still be wasted on you because you can't see it from the other side.

 

Again, that's why I suggested speaking up once they retire if/when apologizing sooner poses too big of a problem.  I didn't say they should speak up immediately afterwards or handle the media on their own.   You're also confusing what I said and applying it to a justified use of force.  I have empathy for police when the circumstances truly call for them to open fire.  I realize they have to live with that decision forever and it brings them (and maybe their families too) lots of grief and sadness.

 

What I'm talking about is when police unquestionably take things too far out of rage, paranoia, incompetence, mistaken identity, whatever.  Police are public servants and they owe their employer -- the public -- an explanation when they screw up so badly.  The shoot first and ask questions later mentality has to stop.

[Blarg]

What Damn good would a twenty year late apology do? You are completely unrealistic.

[Don]

Dear LAPD,

 

So there's a very real chance you've already ****ed up here, but do us all a favor: Look at what the police in Ferguson are doing in the wake of their similar incident.

 

After you do that, do the EXACT OPPOSITE of how they're handling it. Please and thank you.

They're really digging themselves a hole in Ferguson tonight. Firing tear gas at people running AWAY from them, arresting reporters for no good reason, and drawing down on pretty much anyone walking the streets. It's almost a clinic in how to permanently destroy a relationship with a community.

[LBHalos17]

That would be easier to accept if police actually showed public remorse for their mistakes. 

 

No, not some boilerplate statement issued by the PIO or the union president.  I'd like to see the officers actually involved in unjustified shootings (and other screw ups) stand in front of a camera and tell their story, apologizing when the situation calls for it. 

 

I guess most police are too cowardly to apologize, even when they retire and have nothing to lose by speaking up.  The way some officers seem to spend years rationalizing their wrong behavior is disgraceful as well.  I get really tired of the current and former police officers in my circle of family and friends talking about the "****ing nigger" who almost got one of them fired.  This defendant was completely exonerated but the attacks on him and his skin color continue years later.  It's truly abominable what passes as professionalism in My Family these days. 

Fixed.  I lump you in with them for your blanket-statements about all Police Officers being cowards.  You're a media-lemming; there's lots of apologies being made out there, but those aren't media-inflammatory enough for you to seek-out.

[LBHalos17]

I still can't fathom why there are no non-lethal steps taken in between commanding someone to stop and put their hands up and firing lead into their chest.

Did you read the part about how quickly these incidents happen?  Google the "21-foot rule" on knives (it's been proven that someone with a knife will close the distance, before you have a chance to react if your mindset isn't right/prepared).

[LBHalos17]

First off you indict yourself by saying unjust shootings when the above mentioned story outlined a case that would be considered justified if any of the escalation possibilities happened. Every word they say can be used against them in a civil case. Why in hell would they open their mouth ever about an incident when a lawyer is waiting to jump on them with a lawsuit? If it were you, do you think you would say anything and then let the chips fall where they may? You may be dumb enough in the moment to make a statement and then sped the next couple of years in court trying to distance yourself from it and the news media.

 

These aren't professional athletes that get to cry on camera and America forgives them for playing punch out with their girlfriends in an elevator and only get a two game suspension. These guys lose their earnings, future careers, life savings and families because of how the media and lawyers threat them when they are in the above mentioned scenario and had to make a decision that they would rather would have been glazed or jelly filled instead of tazed or bullet filled.

 

Yeah, some cops **** up and some cops don't but get ****ed up by the media all the same. Making an on camera statement doesn't change that.

Exactly.  Officers are not allowed to make ANY statements to media/public/representing the Department without approval.  That's why the Chiefs take the podium when necessary instead of the involved Officers.  It used to be that way in order to protect the Officers from retribution from non-law-abiding/apology-accepting folks too (Recently, the Courts decided it is necessary to name Officers involved in shootings.  But that is another issue entirely).

[LBHalos17]

Murdering someone with their fists doesn't help their public perception much either.

Going back to Poozy's original point, I don't doubt that stories get twisted to fit a pre-determined narrative all the time. I think that's why it's important to get to the facts of any given situation to come to a solid understanding of what happened. That's why I hope more departments begin using the uniform-mounted Go Pros. It offers more protection to the public and to individual officers. It certainly would have helped clear up what happened in Ferguson, MO, which I really have no clue about regarding who was in the right or the wrong. The cop might lose his job or worse over a clean shoot, and he also might get away with murder. And to me it is extremely unproductive that this story is and will continue to be about race rather than about properly documenting interactions between police and civilians. The same thing happened in the Trayvon Martin case. It became about a white guy (who was actually Cuban) shooting a black teenager when it really should've been about why anyone ever thought Zimmerman was smart enough to carry a gun in public or participate in a neighborhood watch group.

Long Beach will soon begin testing body-cams.  Of course, most Officers are concerned about the cams but it's mostly due to colorful language.  I expect it will clean-up that language-issue, along with most behavior from problem-Officers.

[LBHalos17]

Dear LAPD,

 

So there's a very real chance you've already ****ed up here, but do us all a favor: Look at what the police in Ferguson are doing in the wake of their similar incident.

 

After you do that, do the EXACT OPPOSITE of how they're handling it. Please and thank you.

That's what I've always said.. Get out in front of the issue, and be forthcoming with information as it comes to light.  Departments are still bogged-down in old-school thinking of waiting until the investigation is finalized; that thinking is what leads to the rioting/etc.

[LBHalos17]

They're really digging themselves a hole in Ferguson tonight. Firing tear gas at people running AWAY from them, arresting reporters for no good reason, and drawing down on pretty much anyone walking the streets. It's almost a clinic in how to permanently destroy a relationship with a community.

Yep; they obviously haven't sent any of their Managers out to visit and learn from the big-boys (LAPD) mistakes.  LAPD has made these same mistakes, but are slowly learning from them and implementing a more open conversation with the community.

 

It's looking dire in Ferguson..

[mp170.6]

What Damn good would a twenty year late apology do? You are completely unrealistic.

 

It would show the public that police officers are human too, and carry with them the mistakes or lapses in judgment earlier in life. 

[mp170.6]

Fixed.  I lump you in with them for your blanket-statements about all Police Officers being cowards.  You're a media-lemming; there's lots of apologies being made out there, but those aren't media-inflammatory enough for you to seek-out.

 

First off, I've said this before but I think it bears repeating again.  I don't hate or dislike you, LBHalos17.  You honestly seem like a reasonable guy and it's commendable that you're humble enough to discuss this at all.  Thank you for that.  Really, I mean it.

 

I have a challenge for you.  There's a good way to shut me up and restore some of the faith I've lost in law enforcement.  The next time you're rude or lacking professionalism toward a member of the public (hey, it happens to all of us) go back to the person and apologize for what you did. 

 

Have your partner film the apology and upload the video to YouTube.  Post the link here and you've got $100 in meals and/or Angels tickets from me. 

[arch stanton]

Did you read the part about how quickly these incidents happen?  Google the "21-foot rule" on knives (it's been proven that someone with a knife will close the distance, before you have a chance to react if your mindset isn't right/prepared).

I understand things happen quickly. It just seems to me that zero effort goes into finding ways other than bullets to subdue suspects. What should be a last resort seems to be resorted to fairly often.

[TobiasFunke]

First off, I've said this before but I think it bears repeating again.  I don't hate or dislike you, LBHalos17.  You honestly seem like a reasonable guy and it's commendable that you're humble enough to discuss this at all.  Thank you for that.  Really, I mean it.

 

I have a challenge for you.  There's a good way to shut me up and restore some of the faith I've lost in law enforcement.  The next time you're rude or lacking professionalism toward a member of the public (hey, it happens to all of us) go back to the person and apologize for what you did. 

 

Have your partner film the apology and upload the video to YouTube.  Post the link here and you've got $100 in meals and/or Angels tickets from me. 

 

Let's be honest here, nothing that LB or any cop does will shut you up so just continue with your Fuk Da Polize mentality

[Adam]

Maybe the cops in Ferguson should have refrained from hassling a couple of guys walking down the street. 

[yk9001]

More bad apples.  Jesus Christ, this is the worst f*cking apple crop ever.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/in-ferguson-washington-post-reporter-wesley-lowery-gives-account-of-his-arrest/2014/08/13/0fe25c0e-2359-11e4-86ca-6f03cbd15c1a_story.html

[mtangelsfan]

More bad apples.  Jesus Christ, this is the worst f*cking apple crop ever.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/in-ferguson-washington-post-reporter-wesley-lowery-gives-account-of-his-arrest/2014/08/13/0fe25c0e-2359-11e4-86ca-6f03cbd15c1a_story.html

 

Police state

[Stradling]

First off, I've said this before but I think it bears repeating again. I don't hate or dislike you, LBHalos17. You honestly seem like a reasonable guy and it's commendable that you're humble enough to discuss this at all. Thank you for that. Really, I mean it.

I have a challenge for you. There's a good way to shut me up and restore some of the faith I've lost in law enforcement. The next time you're rude or lacking professionalism toward a member of the public (hey, it happens to all of us) go back to the person and apologize for what you did.

Have your partner film the apology and upload the video to YouTube. Post the link here and you've got $100 in meals and/or Angels tickets from me.

Quite possibly the stupidest thing I have ever read on here.

[yk9001]

Apparently the cop that did the shooting has visible wounds.

Not relevant to your media at mcdonalds story, but if that's the case, that's quite a wrinkle.

 

 

Please be more specific with 'visible wounds' because I am not buying it if the police are selling it.

 

Then again, he could have concocted his own 'visible wounds' in the FOUR FREAKING HOURS  it took between the time they shot the kid, and he was scraped off the sidewalk.