Angels discussing trade for Freese

[tdawg87]

Also, he'll make 15-16 starts outside of Angels stadium.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

Wasn't Freese a butcher at 3B?  

 

His fielding average was .957, placing him 15th among all MLB third basemen. He made 11 errors on 256 chances, starting 129 of the 132 games he played in. For comparison, Adrian Beltre's FA was .959.

[notherhalo]

Freese for Pujols!

[VariousCrap]

If it is between Haren and Arroyo...I'd go with Haren.

 

 

That said, NO to either of them.

 

Let the Dodgers have one and the Giants have the other.

[Inside Pitch]

His fielding average was .957, placing him 15th among all MLB third basemen. He made 11 errors on 256 chances, starting 129 of the 132 games he played in. For comparison, Adrian Beltre's FA was .959.

 

Have you looked at the defensive metrics last year?  Beltre always a great defensive player was actually below average.   The one year where comparing a player to Beltre doesn't really make a case for him.

 

FLD% doesnt tell us much other than he tends to catch the balls he gets to.

[ettin]

I hope Dipoto isn't stupid enough to deal Calhoun for Freese. I think it might be Bourjos who gets dealt

 

Bourjos would be just as stupid if not more so. We would have to get more back than just Freese for either one.

 

[Angelsjunky]

God, please don't trade Calhoun or Bourjos for Freese. Terrible move.

 

Shuck for Freese won't happen. Shuck and a grade C/C+ prospect? Maybe.

 

Watching Joe Kelly pitch is more impressive than his stat line - he's got nasty stuff.

[WallyWorld]

even discounting the fact that our GM obviously hasn't thought too highly of Haren for years now, from where I'm standing the guy looks like a shell of his former self.  He was always more of a command guy, and now even that seems to be gone.  Did you watch him in 2012?  He was throwing upper 80s and getting knocked around silly.  Now we're talking about 2 seasons later.  I really don't get the Haren fascination.  He was once a really good pitcher, but it's been years since that's been true.

[Hollyw00d]

He's yet to pitch a full season and he has a ton of upside. He is also under club control until 2019 and won't even be eligible for Arb. until 2016. He was also born in Anaheim so he'd probably love to pitch there.

If you are expecting more for Aybar I think you will be disappointed.

I completely disagree with you on aybar. The past four seasons he has 10.5 WAR, good for 5th in the AL during that span. And he had a crappy year, say he had an average 2013 he would be top 3. He's still in his prime and while he isn't the best SS in the AL, he is in the elite.

I think just settling on a guy like Kelly for him is seriously underplaying our hand

[ettin]

Apparently they want outfield depth.

 

This is what scares me most: "Freese has battled lower leg problems in the past, and last season he was limited by a back injury."

 

 

 http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/eye-on-baseball/24256860/report-cardinals-angels-talking-david-freese-trade 

 

Here is some discussion about players with back injuries: http://www.fangraphs.com/fantasy/mash-report-102413-cabrera-kemp-and-back-injuries/

 

Freese is on the list so he has a higher chance of under performing next season due to the back injury.

 

[Vegas Halo Fan]

The "marine layer" doesn't mean shit when you are serving up meatballs.

 

I have always found that they taste better in the ocean air.

[Chuck]

God, please don't trade Calhoun or Bourjos for Freese. Terrible move.

 

Shuck for Freese won't happen. Shuck and a grade C/C+ prospect? Maybe.

 

Watching Joe Kelly pitch is more impressive than his stat line - he's got nasty stuff.

I agree with you AJ re: Joe Kelly. Anyone who opposing him doesn't know shit.

 

I'm getting tired of fans getting boners over MPH and swings-and-misses.

[Hollyw00d]

I agree with you AJ re: Joe Kelly. Anyone who opposing him doesn't know shit.

I'm getting tired of fans getting boners over MPH and swings-and-misses.

meh.

stats tell the story of what actually happens on the field, not someone's opinion about how their pitches "look." sure his pitches look pretty but do they get batters out?

its like signing a guy who has a "great swing" but can't hit worth a damn in actual games.

[Angelsjunky]

I agree with you AJ re: Joe Kelly. Anyone who opposing him doesn't know shit.

 

I'm getting tired of fans getting boners over MPH and swings-and-misses.

 

Well as you know, Chuck, I like my stats. But they must be coupled with what we see on the field.

 

Not to mention that strikeout rates can change. Guess which pitcher had a 6.00 strikeout/9IP rate in his first full season? Justin Verlander.

 

Finally, Kelly regularly reaches the mid-90s on his fastball, so he's not lacking in MPH. Actually, he kind of reminded me of a better Garret Richards - another pitcher whose K rate is lower than his MPH would entail.

Edited November 22, 2013 by Angelsjunky

[Cdaniel]

So what gets a deal done for Freese and Kelly? Aybar, Bourjos plus ___, or is Aybar and PB enough?

[m0nkey]

But he wears glasses

[tdawg87]

sure his pitches look pretty but do they get batters out?

 

Yes, they do. So far he has a career 121 ERA+

 

Kelly is exactly the type of pitcher the Angels need.

[Scott34]

Admittedly was looking at the wrong stats in regards to K's earlier, but I still am opposed to dealing a ton for Kelly.

 

I don't like his mechanics whatsoever.  Looks like his shoulder is about to fall off every delivery.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'd send a Bourjos for him but probably not much more than that.

[Hollyw00d]

Yes, they do. So far he has a career 121 ERA+

Kelly is exactly the type of pitcher the Angels need.

career 1.93 K/bb ratio. career 3.12 BB\9 and that was much higher in the minors. Career 4.00 FIP. He would have sucked with the angels defense behind him this season. and his LOB% suggests that he may be getting lucky.

he is Jason Vargas. He is CJ Wilson without the strikeouts.

[Scott34]

career 1.93 K/bb ratio. career 3.12 BB\9 and that was much higher in the minors. Career 4.00 FIP. He would have sucked with the angels defense behind him this season. and his LOB% suggests that he may be getting lucky.

he is Jason Vargas. He is CJ Wilson without the strikeouts.

 

He certainly isn't that bad.

[tdawg87]

Those stats really suggest that he isn't making outs. You know who had a high FIP this year? Jered Weaver. Ricky Nolasco had a 3.34 FIP. That guy is the freaking MAN.

[jshep]

If the Angels send Bourjos or Calhoun, let alone one of them plus anything else, for David Freese, I'm okay with letting the Rally Monkey wrap up the offseason as GM.

[Hollyw00d]

Also, Dave Duncan isn't our pitching coach

[tdawg87]

Also, Dave Duncan isn't our pitching coach

 

But we have the next best thing! After, you know, 28 other coaches.

[Blarg]

Dave Duncan hasn't been a pitching coach for two years.