Angels sign Jose Quintana (1 year, $8 million)

[T.G.]

2 minutes ago, Stradling said:

This should be fun. 

[T.G.]

5 minutes ago, Stradling said:

This should be fun. 

[rafibomb]

17 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

The walks are the issue, and it's not something he's had problems with in the past.  The rest of his peripherals have been solid but yesterday was a legit bad start all the way around.

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/jose-quintana/11423/game-log?position=P&season=

He needs to get the walks under control or all the naysayers will end up being right, albeit they will have had the reasons all wrong.

 

8.78 BB/9 this season as opposed to 2.70 and 2.42 the years before. Pretty crazy how he just lost his control out of nowhere. I am still fairly confident he turns it around. With someone like Teheran the writing was on the wall that he would implode. I can't say the same for Quintana.

Edited April 28, 2021 by rafibomb

[Inside Pitch]

13 minutes ago, AngelsFaninGA said:

I guess call me a devotee then because I see 6 runs scored by the opposing team and a loss. Baseball seems to have developed an affinity for bending reality when they don't like it and coming up with all these "what should have been" stats. 

Nothing wrong with that, but spare us any talk about the team being dumb, and behind the times.  The data you are seemingly dismissing as fanciful excuses are the very things that teams like the Dodgers have been running with and believing in for years.   Trusting the process has never been a strength of Angel fans so, I can't say I'm surprised. 

Yesterday was a legitimately bad start, he wasn't a victim of lucky hits or questionable fielding, he was getting torqued and wasn't fooling anyone.  More importantly he's been hurting himself all year with his control issues, so he gets to wear that and the predictive data dings him for that too.   But ERA tells us absolutely nothing other than X many runs scored in X many innings and nothing about why the numbers are what they are.

[Angelsjunky]

11 hours ago, Φαήλος said:

Agreed

Yeah, I was wrong, it seems.

[Inside Pitch]

4 hours ago, Jason said:

Lol. This thread is not aging well

Four starts.

[Jeff Fletcher]

3 hours ago, Capital_Dave said:

@Jeff Fletcher do you think Quintana might hit the IL with a "phantom injury" sometime soon to help him sort out some of his issues on the back fields?  I was a fan of the Quintana signing at first, but something is just not right...

They said last night he’s fine. 

[totdprods]

Meanwhile, JA Happ coming into today's game with a 1.59 ERA and WHIP of 0.88. 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Edited April 28, 2021 by totdprods

[Inside Pitch]

52 minutes ago, rafibomb said:

8.78 BB/9 this season as opposed to 2.70 and 2.42 the years before. Pretty crazy how he just lost his control out of nowhere. I am still fairly confident he turns it around. With someone like Teheran the writing was on the wall that he would implode. I can't say the same for Quintana.

Yeah, I have no idea what to make of his issues with command all of a sudden -- if that's the new him then by all means put a fork in him.   

But your greater point is where I am.  It's not a question of whether or not he's done well, it's a question of whether or not anyone should expect things to change.  There is plenty of data to suggest he will improve, that the early struggles aren't indicative of an erosion of skill (other than command).  Teheran showed up with those concerns in place and a track record of eroding skills.

[Inside Pitch]

10 minutes ago, totdprods said:

Meanwhile, JA Happ coming into today's game with a 1.59 ERA and WHIP of 0.88. 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

No doubt that .159 BaBIP in front of that awful MIN defensive IF is totally sustainable....    Career low average velo, near career low GB%, career low K/9, BB/9 is the worst it's been since 2013 -- his success has been almost 100% due to his "success" keeping FBs in the park -- HR/9 0.53.    Meanwhile, Kenta Maeda has a 6.56 ERA a .372 BaBip and a HR/9 of 2.70 ...  baseball is effing weird sometimes.

Four starts!

[tdawg87]

How much more do we give him before we pull the plug? 4 starts isn't enough, but if we give him 2 months and he isn't turning shit around, we're in really bad shape.

Can't get any consistency with this dude taking the mound once a week. At some point we're gonna need to rattle off 7-8 wins to catch up with Oakland.

[Inside Pitch]

9 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

How much more do we give him before we pull the plug? 4 starts isn't enough, but if we give him 2 months and he isn't turning shit around, we're in really bad shape.

Can't get any consistency with this dude taking the mound once a week. At some point we're gonna need to rattle off 7-8 wins to catch up with Oakland.

10 starts max -- but if the control issues continue much longer you gotta consider skipping a start and sending him to SP rehab.   The Quintana issues are magnified by Canning's pure suckage.   They both can't be leaving early every start.

[failos]

Just now, Inside Pitch said:

10 starts max -- but if the control issues continue much longer you gotta consider skipping a start and sending him to SP rehab.

He needs to go to SP jail 

[Inside Pitch]

1 minute ago, Φαήλος said:

He needs to go to SP jail 

LOL, if they can fix the control issues -- I'm on board with sending his convict ass away to jail.

[Stradling]

Racist

[rafibomb]

Times like this I really wished the minor league season had started on time. I would have loved to see how someone like Detmers would be doing.

[totdprods]

17 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

No doubt that .159 BaBIP in front of that awful MIN defensive IF is totally sustainable....    Career low average velo, near career low GB%, career low K/9, BB/9 is the worst it's been since 2013 -- his success has been almost 100% due to his "success" keeping FBs in the park -- HR/9 0.53.    Meanwhile, Kenta Maeda has a 6.56 ERA a .372 BaBip and a HR/9 of 2.70 ...  baseball is effing weird sometimes.

Four starts!

Happ's success is as likely to continue as Quintana's struggles. 

I really think the Dunedin rainout, Minnesota postponements, and even the six-man rotation have thrown some guys off a bit. There was a lot of time there where everyone was off-schedule for a couple weeks. 

 

[failos]

5 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Racist

AW has a “racist” reaction for that!

[Stradling]

8 minutes ago, rafibomb said:

Times like this I really wished the minor league season had started on time. I would have loved to see how someone like Detmers would be doing.

Totally agree. I have a feeling we will see him soon for someone.  

[Jason]

30 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Yeah, I have no idea what to make of his issues with command all of a sudden -- if that's the new him then by all means put a fork in him.   

But your greater point is where I am.  It's not a question of whether or not he's done well, it's a question of whether or not anyone should expect things to change.  There is plenty of data to suggest he will improve, that the early struggles aren't indicative of an erosion of skill (other than command).  Teheran showed up with those concerns in place and a track record of eroding skills.

You follow this kind of stuff closely so I'll take your word for it. Has he had starts to seasons like this before that leads you to believe he can turn it around?

[T.G.]

I'm going to laugh my arse off when Detmers comes up, struggles a bit and this forum goes Jo Adell on him.

[tdawg87]

Just now, True Grich said:

I'm going to laugh my arse off when Detmers comes up, struggles a bit and this forum goes Jo Adell on him.

There's so many options here.

[Stradling]

3 minutes ago, True Grich said:

I'm going to laugh my arse off when Detmers comes up, struggles a bit and this forum goes Jo Adell on him.

Claude would be proud. 

[T.G.]

3 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Claude would be proud. 

Dude. You know this happens all the time.  This forum will clamor for someone to come up and the moment they struggle, the forum turns on him like he has Covid. That has nothing to do with Clod.  I know you miss him, but sheesh.

AND, I'm not laughing at the player who struggles, I'm laughing at the knee jerk reactions.

Edited April 28, 2021 by True Grich

[Inside Pitch]

3 minutes ago, Jason said:

You follow this kind of stuff closely so I'll take your word for it. Has he had starts to seasons like this before that leads you to believe he can turn it around?

Kinda...  The start of 2015 -- his first four starts he went 22 innings allowing 17 runs, ended the season with a 3.36 ERA..   Looking at other seasons he's had similar bad spurts..  in 21014 which may have been his finest year he had two runs of 3 starts each where he got lit up.  From June 8-19 he gave up 12 runs in 16 innings then  Aug 13-26 he gave up 14 runs in 17.2 innings.   In 2016 he had a four game stretch where he gave up 18 runs in 23 innings.   He opened 2017 with three bad starts too...  17 IP 13 runs.

Looking at his career numbers there is this...

I	Split	W	L	W-L%	ERA	G	GS	GF	CG	SHO	SV	IP	H	R	ER	HR	BB	IBB	SO	HBP	BK	WP	BF	WHIP	SO9	SO/W
	April/March	14	12	.538	4.51	40	39	0	0	0	0	219.1	225	121	110	25	77	1	212	4	0	18	940	1.377	8.7	2.75
	May	12	22	.353	3.53	42	41	1	0	0	0	252.1	223	105	99	19	82	3	213	5	1	8	1043	1.209	7.6	2.60
	June	8	14	.364	3.72	44	43	1	0	0	0	261.0	272	118	108	30	79	5	204	2	2	9	1103	1.345	7.0	2.58
	July	18	5	.783	3.13	40	40	0	1	1	0	253.1	224	92	88	25	62	3	227	7	1	7	1019	1.129	8.1	3.66
	August	17	13	.567	3.94	47	45	0	0	0	0	276.2	281	130	121	29	75	7	247	11	0	7	1172	1.287	8.0	3.29
	Sept/Oct	14	13	.519	3.96	45	43	0	1	1	0	245.2	263	118	108	28	60	2	226	8	1	10	1038	1.315	8.3	3.77

So it seems bad starts are kind of the norm for him relative to the rest of the season.   But the walks are a new issue ...  If that doesnt get corrected it's gonna be a shit show.