Now what? What moves would you like to see them make.

[bruin5]

With all the other moves I believe we can work around SS for part of the year with Fletcher and Soto. I think Neto will be a viable option after spending a few weeks at AAA. I also think Rengifo is a viable starter at 2B. I’ve always been a fan of his. We could even make do with Squid if he only hits RH. My priority is Shohei. 

[Tank]

On 11/24/2022 at 3:44 PM, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

So are going to carry 5 OFers, or is Moniac going to be it, with Adell in AAA?

I’ll tell you once our plans have come together. 

[tdawg87]

1 minute ago, Tank said:

I’ll tell you once our plans have come together. 

The Å Team

[Tank]

6 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

The Å Team

[aznhockeyguy]

A position that I think Perry might address is Catcher.  Stassi looked awful and there's a few catchers in free agency that won't break the bank but would improve the team like Omar Narvaez who seems like a great bounce back candidate because his BABIP was pretty bad, and Tucker Barnhart, who'll be cheaper than Narvaez and the Angels can use to set up a platoon situation with Stassi.  Both of these catchers will hopefully be better than Suzuki was. 

[Pancake Bear]

46 minutes ago, aznhockeyguy said:

A position that I think Perry might address is Catcher.  Stassi looked awful and there's a few catchers in free agency that won't break the bank but would improve the team like Omar Narvaez who seems like a great bounce back candidate because his BABIP was pretty bad, and Tucker Barnhart, who'll be cheaper than Narvaez and the Angels can use to set up a platoon situation with Stassi.  Both of these catchers will hopefully be better than Suzuki was. 

Stassi was worth 2.9 fWAR in 2021. And not too far off in 2020 when accounting for the shortened season. I don't know why he fell off so dramatically in 2022, but his defense was still good. In any case, catcher is typically one position teams are willing to let the offense slide a bit if you're good enough in the rest of your game. The simple reality is that while fans really only look at offense for catchers, teams actually care about the rest of what the catcher does. Jeff Mathis played 17 seasons with a career wRC+ of 45. Why? Pitchers loved him.

I don't expect the Angels to dump Stassi. But if they do, it won't be because of his hitting, it'll be because they think he's a bad catcher.

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

4 hours ago, tdawg87 said:

The Å Team

I pity the poor fool: Mr. T

[Warfarin]

4 hours ago, aznhockeyguy said:

A position that I think Perry might address is Catcher.  Stassi looked awful and there's a few catchers in free agency that won't break the bank but would improve the team like Omar Narvaez who seems like a great bounce back candidate because his BABIP was pretty bad, and Tucker Barnhart, who'll be cheaper than Narvaez and the Angels can use to set up a platoon situation with Stassi.  Both of these catchers will hopefully be better than Suzuki was. 

Yeah, my guess is we will sign a backup catcher - not someone to replace Stassi.  I think Thaiss probably will be deemed not strong enough defensively to take over that role, and if he makes the team, it'll be moreso as a third string catcher / utility player, although I have my doubts that he'll be here once the season starts.  Urshela will be the 3B/1B backup, and if we do get a backup C, Thaiss probably doesn't have a role to play on this team.

[Angel Oracle]

Soto may well be the extra MIF.   

We saw a glimpse of the offense, granted on the lucky side (.500 BABIP).

Defense is fine.

Who knows, maybe Minasian isn’t looking for another SS, but instead taking a similar approach that he is to the bullpen, lots of pieces and let things sort out.  Currently, they have Fletcher, Squid, and Soto.   Squid does need to up OPS by 80-100 points to be a valid #2 SS,

Weird stat: Squid’s oWAR in 2022 was +0.3, despite the low OPS.

Now, that could change if someone like Rosario or Anderson becomes available.   A guy who fits what the Halos are focused on for a solid  2023 starting SS.  Solid enough offense and defense, under contract for just 1 season, and wouldn’t require a key prospect (top 5) going back in exchange.

Edited November 26, 2022 by Angel Oracle

[Warfarin]

1 hour ago, Angel Oracle said:

Soto may well be the extra MIF.   

We saw a glimpse of the offense, granted on the lucky side (.500 BABIP).

Defense is fine.

Who knows, maybe Minasian isn’t looking for another SS, but instead taking a similar approach that he is to the bullpen, lots of pieces and let things sort out.  Currently, they have Fletcher, Squid, and Soto.   Squid does need to up OPS by 80-100 points to be a valid #2 SS,

Weird stat: Squid’s oWAR in 2022 was +0.3, despite the low OPS.

Now, that could change if someone like Rosario or Anderson becomes available.   A guy who fits what the Halos are focused on for a solid  2023 starting SS.  Solid enough offense and defense, under contract for just 1 season, and wouldn’t require a key prospect (top 5) going back in exchange.

Right.  SS isn't necessarily a position that they have to "force fit" and be in a position where they drastically overpay because they have no options.  LF was a position like that - they had to upgrade, because they simply couldn't enter the season with a Moniak/Adell platoon as the best option.

They do have SS options, and they do have fairly promising depth on the horizon (Soto, Neto).  They have Fletcher, Rengifo, Velazquez.  Again, this is not really a great position, but it is an acceptable one, if they choose to spend money in other areas instead.

All that said, I would bet on them acquiring a SS before the offseason ends.  While it isn't a must, it would make a significant difference, and asides from the bullpen (which can be more easily addressed), it is the position that is most in need of an upgrade at this point.

[Angelsfan1984]

How about someone like Vasquez to platoon with stassi? Not sure what his expected aav would be, but could be a nice addition. 

[Stradling]

17 minutes ago, Angelsfan1984 said:

How about someone like Vasquez to platoon with stassi? Not sure what his expected aav would be, but could be a nice addition. 

I’d like that. 

[BTH]

2 hours ago, Angel Oracle said:

Now, that could change if someone like Rosario or Anderson becomes available.   A guy who fits what the Halos are focused on for a solid  2023 starting SS.  Solid enough offense and defense, under contract for just 1 season, and wouldn’t require a key prospect (top 5) going back in exchange.

Anderson’s definitely requiring a top 5 prospect in return.

Possibly the same for Rosario, considering the Angels farm isn’t that great.

[BTH]

1 hour ago, Warfarin said:

All that said, I would bet on them acquiring a SS before the offseason ends.  While it isn't a must, it would make a significant difference, and asides from the bullpen (which can be more easily addressed), it is the position that is most in need of an upgrade at this point.

I wouldn’t, mainly because there aren’t a lot of clear SS options available.

I could see them settling for a 2B instead of a SS or even just going with what they have now.

[BTH]

8 hours ago, aznhockeyguy said:

A position that I think Perry might address is Catcher.  Stassi looked awful and there's a few catchers in free agency that won't break the bank but would improve the team like Omar Narvaez who seems like a great bounce back candidate because his BABIP was pretty bad, and Tucker Barnhart, who'll be cheaper than Narvaez and the Angels can use to set up a platoon situation with Stassi.  Both of these catchers will hopefully be better than Suzuki was. 

They aren’t gonna add someone like Narváez, who’ll want starting catcher money and playing time.

34 minutes ago, Angelsfan1984 said:

How about someone like Vasquez to platoon with stassi? Not sure what his expected aav would be, but could be a nice addition. 

Same with Vazquéz.

Maybe they sign someone on a 1-year deal, but I don’t think they can sign someone to a multi-year deal with Stassi locked up and O’Hoppe being close.

[Stradling]

4 minutes ago, Trendon said:

I wouldn’t, mainly because there aren’t a lot of clear SS options available.

I could see them settling for a 2B instead of a SS or even just going with what they have now.

I’d give up Bush/Bachman and Quero in a package for Anderson. 

[AngelStew43]

12 hours ago, Angels 1961 said:

I do not think Angel's will sign any of top 4 SS. They need to save money to try and extend Ohtani. It will be thru a trade like Renfroe or Urshala or a lower free agent like Andrus. Minasian has done very well in 2 trades so far and hopefully he can bring in a SS in same matter. Off season is just starting let's hope Perry can work a way to improve MI depth.

This is the reason I think that we should sign one of the top 4 SS.  If Ohtani does leave, and we don't have one of them, we will be scrambling to replace what Ohtani provides on offense.  

If we have one of the SS, on the other hand, then all we'd have to do is to acquire a player that plays another position, (think 1B), where the offense has been lacking.  And, at that point we'd have at least part of the 30 plus million dollars that Ohtani left on the books upon his departure.  

On the off chance that we trade Ohtani, this discussion would be pointless, because we would acquire several players/prospects to fill multiple holes in our roster. 

[AngelStew43]

7 hours ago, Pancake Bear said:

Stassi was worth 2.9 fWAR in 2021. And not too far off in 2020 when accounting for the shortened season. I don't know why he fell off so dramatically in 2022, but his defense was still good. In any case, catcher is typically one position teams are willing to let the offense slide a bit if you're good enough in the rest of your game. The simple reality is that while fans really only look at offense for catchers, teams actually care about the rest of what the catcher does. Jeff Mathis played 17 seasons with a career wRC+ of 45. Why? Pitchers loved him.

I don't expect the Angels to dump Stassi. But if they do, it won't be because of his hitting, it'll be because they think he's a bad catcher.

I don't think we'd be acquiring another C until/unless we have a deal worked out for Stassi.  O'Hoppe showed well in a small sample size, possibly enough to be half of a catching platoon.

Same goes for SS.  If we pay for one of the big four SS, then we either keep Fletcher as a utility player, or deal him to one of the teams that loses out on one of the big four, or one of the other teams that are looking for middle infield help, like the Cubs, Twins, if they lose Correa, Pirates, etc. 

 

[BTH]

12 minutes ago, Stradling said:

I’d give up Bush/Bachman and Quero in a package for Anderson. 

I would too.

I was just responding to AO, who said that he wouldn’t require a top 5 prospect.

[BTH]

11 minutes ago, AngelStew43 said:

This is the reason I think that we should sign one of the top 4 SS.  If Ohtani does leave, and we don't have one of them, we will be scrambling to replace what Ohtani provides on offense.  

If we have one of the SS, on the other hand, then all we'd have to do is to acquire a player that plays another position, (think 1B), where the offense has been lacking.  And, at that point we'd have at least part of the 30 plus million dollars that Ohtani left on the books upon his departure.  

On the off chance that we trade Ohtani, this discussion would be pointless, because we would acquire several players/prospects to fill multiple holes in our roster. 

You’d still have to replace Ohtani’s pitching production, which I’d argue is way more valuable and difficult to replace than his hitting production.

[Angel Oracle]

44 minutes ago, Trendon said:

Anderson’s definitely requiring a top 5 prospect in return.

Possibly the same for Rosario, considering the Angels farm isn’t that great.

Concur definitely on Anderson.   Went back and saw that for the 3 full seasons prior to 2022, his WAR averaged close to 5.0.   Was injured for part of 2022, but still put up close to 2.0 WAR while playing just a little over half of the season.   Probably should stay clear of him, as other options exist that wouldn’t potentially cost TWO top 10 prospects which is too much for getting just 1 year control (2 if exercising team option).

Bush/Bachman and Quero is too much to give up for 1-2 seasons of Anderson, especially a prospect with the promise of Quero.   While farm is improved, can’t be making that kind of rental acquisition.

I’d hold on to Quero and see how O’Hoppe does the next couple of seasons.   Catchers don’t grow on trees.

Rosario would likely cost at least a 6-10 prospect.   If you could only need to package 1-2 other medium prospects with that, I’d do that.   

Otherwise, go with the quantity strategy for 2023, as Neto should be ready in a year.

Edited November 26, 2022 by Angel Oracle

[BTH]

1 minute ago, Angel Oracle said:

Concur definitely on Anderson. 

Rosario would likely cost at least a 6-10 prospect.   If you could only need to package 1-2 other medium prospects with that, I’d do that.   
 

Otherwise, go with the quantity strategy for 2023, as Neto should be ready in a year.

Anderson also has a club option for 2024, which increases his value even more.

It’s tough to match-up with Cleveland on a deal because their farm system is so good.

[angelsnationtalk]

28 minutes ago, Stradling said:

I’d give up Bush/Bachman and Quero in a package for Anderson. 

I'd love to have Anderson, but I really love Quero. Although, there's never a guarantee with prospects so if that's what it takes.

It'd probably take an overwhelming package to get Anderson.

[Warfarin]

1 hour ago, Trendon said:

Anderson also has a club option for 2024, which increases his value even more.

It’s tough to match-up with Cleveland on a deal because their farm system is so good.

While true, the Guardians would likely happily accept any trade in which they feel they have gained value, even if it is in a position in which they are already fairly set.  If we gave them a good SP prospect, I doubt they would decline, despite already having a lot of pitching prospects.

All that said, I acknowledge they are historically difficult to trade with.  Per BTV, a "fair" trade would be Bush for Rosario straight-up, or a Bachman-led package that involves other lesser parts.  I would be open to discussing a trade that involved a pitching prospect, but I would NOT trade Quero.  His value will only shoot up over time, and I think good catching prospects are not plentiful, so I'd hold onto him.  I value him in the same bucket as Neto/O'Hoppe, in that I feel they aren't tradeable at this point.  Any other prospect, IMO, I would consider tradeable.

[TempeAngel]

2 hours ago, Trendon said:

Anderson also has a club option for 2024, which increases his value even more.

Are the White Sox shopping Tim Anderson? They exercised his option this month and they have a roster that is set to compete.

He would be a great addition, only concern is the injuries the past three years.