Gameday Thread: Angels @ A's (5/13/22 6:40 start): Silseth makes his debut, Ward back in the starting lineup

[Blarg]

[HanfordGuy]

Happy birthday Bobby!

[Angelsfan1984]

5 minutes ago, HeavenlyHalos said:

So we did trade Noe Ramirez for him and "a player to be named later or cash." I cannot for the life of me find out who the player is or if it ended up being cash. I know the Reds were looking mostly just to shed his salary but good God that is an amazing trade for us.

The player to be named later will be trout in 2037. Reds playing the long game

[Angelsjunky]

13 minutes ago, Lou said:

I don't even remember who we gave up for him. 

His name is Robert Paulson.

[Lou]

Just now, Angelsjunky said:

His name is Robert Paulson.

Bitch tits?

[Erstad Grit]

32 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

His name is Robert Paulson.

The cartoon voice actor?

[Duren, Duren]

One of the best weeks ever for a pair of Angel rookie starting pitchers? 

15 innings, no runs, 2 hits, 2 wins. No hitter followed by an MLB scoreless debut. 

Not necessarily an indication of anything even short term, but signs of serious raw potential making it's way onto the roster. And wait till some of those twenty drafted pitchers rise or fail within the system. Survival of the  fittest may produce just a couple of gems, but the future on the mound should be intriguing.

 

[Redondo]

Young quality pitching coming up through our farm

This is what we all have been wanting and waiting for

[Redondo]

Why trade for a pitcher at the deadline and waste our farm when the young guys are stepping it up?

This feels like the A's, Braves and Rays young pitchers

[Warfarin]

1 hour ago, Redondo said:

Why trade for a pitcher at the deadline and waste our farm when the young guys are stepping it up?

This feels like the A's, Braves and Rays young pitchers

Sometime in 2023:  Ohtani, Sandoval, Silseth, Detmers, Bachman, Bush.  Depth options include Canning, Diaz, Junk, Daniel, Kerry, Suarez (although he'll be out of options, so probably not a depth option).

A lot of good, young depth emerging.  I am guessing they'll probably sign a FA SP, though, to complement that depth.  Regardless, it appears we have a LOT of good, young talent, which is great to say after so many years of being frustrated over not having a lot of homegrown pitching talent.

[stormngt]

10 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

Yeah, I know - but I'm primarily looking at wRC+. He's still at 120ish, which is solid in a Garret Anderson sort of way, but not elite (150ish+).

Combine a front line pitcher with a Garret Anderson offense and you have a great player!

[Angels 1961]

This was a good move by Minasian. Have Silseth first start against Oakland. One of worst hitting teams in baseball. I really like the pace of Silseth. Another good outing by Diaz and maybe halos will not need to add a starter. 

[Angels 1961]

With off day on Thursday curious to see how pitching lines up next week.

[tdawg87]

49 minutes ago, stormngt said:

Combine a front line pitcher with a Garret Anderson offense and you have a great player!

I agree.

I think we were spoiled last year. Ohtani is going to have more years like that but I think he's going to settle around those numbers, on average.

I think he's been hurt a bit by the dead ball as well.

[eligrba]

25 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

This was a good move by Minasian. Have Silseth first start against Oakland. One of worst hitting teams in baseball. I really like the pace of Silseth. Another good outing by Diaz and maybe halos will not need to add a starter. 

I agree.  This is underrated in how Minasian managed Silseth's debut.  One of my complaints about Eppler was that he had to throw very inexperienced and talented pitchers into games because of his incompetence.  This suggests that Minasian and his team actually have a developmental plan that makes sense.

Also, lets not ignore the absolute amazing defensive positioning throughout the game.  It was refreshing to see the shifts actually work for the Angels, like they do against the Angels.

[stormngt]

5 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

I agree.

I think we were spoiled last year. Ohtani is going to have more years like that but I think he's going to settle around those numbers, on average.

I think he's been hurt a bit by the dead ball as well.

With exceptionally of Trout the deadball has hurt everyone.

I do think he forgot how to hit and just focused on HRs

[Warfarin]

24 minutes ago, eligrba said:

I agree.  This is underrated in how Minasian managed Silseth's debut.  One of my complaints about Eppler was that he had to throw very inexperienced and talented pitchers into games because of his incompetence.  This suggests that Minasian and his team actually have a developmental plan that makes sense.

Also, lets not ignore the absolute amazing defensive positioning throughout the game.  It was refreshing to see the shifts actually work for the Angels, like they do against the Angels.

Yes, I too have been impressed by how Minasian has handled a lot of things behind the scenes like this.  It was also probably helpful to have him debut in front of, what, 2000 or so fans?  He's probably used to pitching in front of more people in AA, haha.

[Inside Pitch]

2 hours ago, Warfarin said:

Sometime in 2023:  Ohtani, Sandoval, Silseth, Detmers, Bachman, Bush.  Depth options include Canning, Diaz, Junk, Daniel, Kerry, Suarez (although he'll be out of options, so probably not a depth option).

I was hoping to see Junk pitch now that they have gone to this deader ball.  I've believed him to be potentially HR prone, but otherwise the dude looked like a decent innings eating type SP option.  Unfortunately for him that AA squad may out talent him to the bigs.

[Angelsjunky]

2 hours ago, stormngt said:

Combine a front line pitcher with a Garret Anderson offense and you have a great player!

Yes, of course - I acknowledged that. But is it wrong to hope that he's a 150 wRC+ hitter and not a 120 wrC+?

[stormngt]

2 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

Yes, of course - I acknowledged that. But is it wrong to hope that he's a 150 wRC+ hitter and not a 120 wrC+?

Be honest I do not know wrC+ nor minus so its hard for me to understand.

I was referring to your comment that his offense is kind of like Anderson "good not elite".

I have argued that Ohtani really hasn't proved to he am elite hitter but an awfully good one.  It's one of the things that concerns me when extending him.  His value is that he is a plus hitter and an elite pitcher.  He has been consistent in hitter during his five years.  However he has only shown elite pitching for a year plus.

Should we really expect that Ohtani can be both for the next 7+ years?

[AngelsLakersFan]

47 minutes ago, stormngt said:

Should we really expect that Ohtani can be both for the next 7+ years?

No.

[stormngt]

19 minutes ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

No.

Agreed.  That's my concern with extending Ohtani with his current market value.

[AngelsLakersFan]

5 minutes ago, stormngt said:

Agreed.  That's my concern with extending Ohtani with his current market value.

I do think he's established a higher level of performance on both sides of the ball, but by no means does that guarantee that he maintains that going forward. His value as an offensive player is really independent from his value as a pitcher. If he is a 120 wRC+ DH what value is that really bringing to the table? His lack of positional flexibility alone probably cancels out the bat. If the team pays him as a top of the rotation pitcher, with a higher than normal risk of injury, he will likely be fairly compensated. Of course someone else is probably going to be willing to spend crazy money on the idea of Ohtani, rather than the actual performance value.

[WicketMaiden]

35 minutes ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

I do think he's established a higher level of performance on both sides of the ball, but by no means does that guarantee that he maintains that going forward. His value as an offensive player is really independent from his value as a pitcher. If he is a 120 wRC+ DH what value is that really bringing to the table? His lack of positional flexibility alone probably cancels out the bat. If the team pays him as a top of the rotation pitcher, with a higher than normal risk of injury, he will likely be fairly compensated. Of course someone else is probably going to be willing to spend crazy money on the idea of Ohtani, rather than the actual performance value.

The added difficulty in assessing a fair contract for both sides is the profile and additional revenue Ohtani brings to the team, because of the additional interest his story creates and his own personal fanbase.

Even if he fails, he is box office, but if he succeeds, his story and whichever franchise he represents gets global headline news exposure for years to come. Hard to put a figure on that, but if I was Ohtani's agent I'd do my damnedest to try.

[AngelsLakersFan]

2 minutes ago, WicketMaiden said:

The added difficulty in assessing a fair contract for both sides is the profile and additional revenue Ohtani brings to the team, because of the additional interest his story creates and his own personal fanbase.

Even if he fails, he is box office, but if he succeeds, his story and whichever franchise he represents gets global headline news exposure for years to come. Hard to put a figure on that, but if I was Ohtani's agent I'd do my damnedest to try.

For sure. It's hard to quantify, as most of that added revenue goes to MLB itself and not the Angels. There is a brand recognition value bump for the team, but again tough to put a number on it. Additionally, how much is Arte willing to raise payroll for these 'hard to quantify' benefits?