The Official 2019 Minor League Statline and Prospect Discussion Thread

[tdawg87]

3 minutes ago, stormngt said:

That's like saying I was. Borderline NBA player instead of just college player.

Or maybe a borderline pro since I had opportunity to try out in an overseas camp.

Well said.

[Angelsjunky]

43 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

That's entirely semantics. You guys are missing the damn point. Who gives a F*ck? Torii was a great player and we'd be lucky if Adell has the career he had.

I get your point but am feeling nitpicky. Torii wasn't a "great player." He was a good to very good player who had a long career. Hall of Very Good but a clear non-Hall of Famer.

Like Harold Baines.

[Second Base]

I think Adell is going to play 15 years and in his best collection of years, which will last 10 years, he's going to be a 4-5 win player. I'm optimistically projecting that Adell will be a 50-60 win player across his career.

So I feel when it's all said and done, Adell will be as good as the likes if Vlad Guerrero, Sammy Sosa, Gary Sheffield and Jonny Damon.

[Docwaukee]

Kyren Paris made his pro debut tonight.  2-5 so far with a double.  2rbi.  Playing SS and made an error.  

[ten ocho recon scout]

We have a new guy at work named K. Paris. Not very impressive so far. So i cant get excited about this guy.

[Second Base]

Alex Ramirez and Jose Bonilla are still looking pretty solid in the DSL.

[ten ocho recon scout]

I would agree that Torii isnt a "borderline" HOF guy, like AJ said.

But id also agree with TDawg that Torii was probably a lot better than people remember, and a lot moreso than people down the road will.

His bat wasnt as good for the big guys of his day. But he had a corner outfield bat, with phenom CF defense. He could run. He always seemed clutch with the bat.

Hed take a hit playing in a hitters park defense wise (maybe). But even the slight bump in offense may have seen his bat look even better.

TDawg is also right, he was black.

[Angelsjunky]

4 hours ago, Second Base said:

I think Adell is going to play 15 years and in his best collection of years, which will last 10 years, he's going to be a 4-5 win player. I'm optimistically projecting that Adell will be a 50-60 win player across his career.

So I feel when it's all said and done, Adell will be as good as the likes if Vlad Guerrero, Sammy Sosa, Gary Sheffield and Jonny Damon.

So about as good as Rainier Rivas will be?

[stormngt]

8 hours ago, Second Base said:

I think Adell is going to play 15 years and in his best collection of years, which will last 10 years, he's going to be a 4-5 win player. I'm optimistically projecting that Adell will be a 50-60 win player across his career.

So I feel when it's all said and done, Adell will be as good as the likes if Vlad Guerrero, Sammy Sosa, Gary Sheffield and Jonny Damon.

Are you saying Johnny Damon was on the same level of Vlad Guerrero?

[Second Base]

1 hour ago, stormngt said:

Are you saying Johnny Damon was on the same level of Vlad Guerrero?

According to wins above replacement.

[bloodbrother]

Adell promoted to Triple-A

 

[ten ocho recon scout]

9 minutes ago, bloodbrother said:

Adell promoted to Triple-A

 

I assume he'll get called up as soon as rosters expand.

But thanks for posting, looking forward to see how he does.

[Inside Pitch]

I like that they waited until after he showed signs of struggle and rebounded...    

[stormngt]

3 hours ago, Second Base said:

According to wins above replacement.

Just more proof that WAR is stupid.

[Second Base]

27 minutes ago, stormngt said:

Just more proof that WAR is stupid.

What is it good for? Absolutely nothin.

[Glen]

1 hour ago, bloodbrother said:

Adell promoted to Triple-A

 

 

[Docwaukee]

41 minutes ago, stormngt said:

Just more proof that WAR is stupid.

unless you know how it works.  then, like with any stat, you recognize it's strengths and weaknesses.  

[UndertheHalo]

On 7/30/2019 at 6:36 AM, Inside Pitch said:

Spare me the condescending bullshit -- I'm a harsher critic than most and I'm anything but wanting to see things be rosy..  I'm just not ignorant of the impact age to league has both developmentally and physically.  They can't all be Acunas and Sotos.    That's partially what the Angels have been doing, pushing guys up above the typical comfort zones and seeing which ones take to it -- for Rengifo and Adell -- they took off.  For Jones he's hit a wall. 

Guess what at 21 with all of 500+ at bats above A ball, he's still on the right side of the player development scale.  Maybe now he shouldn't be looked at as being on an accelerated path to MLB, but it doesn't mean he's a full blown bust, it means at worst he's on the normal ascent to MLB.   Fletcher was 23 and posted a .695 OPS in the same league, in the same park albeit .vs different competition.  Wil Wilson, this years number one pick got hurt, when he did there was talk in prospect circles that the Angels might just choose to hold him out until next year because rookie ball would be lesser competition than he had faced in his college conference...  I'm not trying to say all is well with Jones, I'm saying that while he's failed, he's also at an age where he's not fallen behind.   

It's funny that someone is painting me as trying to paint a rosy picture when I was the guy warning that his early success in high A was partially a result of his rapid ascent and a steady diet of fastballs.  Similarly, there are things in his batted ball profile this year that need to be taken into consideration -- his BABIP was sitting at .259 .vs a league average figure of .315.  He's also seen his K rate drop which is good but his walk rate took a hit.  There is also the reality that as bad as he's been, the average batting line for all hitters in Mobile this year sits at .233/.310/.334.  For whatever reasons offense has played down more than usual in Mobile.

2019 has been a lost season for him no doubt -- but I'm more interested in seeing how he responds to it than anything else.   Personally I'd move him back to the OF, but thats just me -- I think a future as a do everything UT guy that can get on base, run when he's on and has sneaky pop would be quite good for an Angels team that will be carrying a full time DH that may not be able to play everyday because he pitches.

Top 100 lists -- the ultimate fan's guide to prospect hype.    

Man, you took this way too personally.  I didn’t mean to suggest that you’re trying to paint a rosy picture.  I respect what you have to say a lot.  I just think that the progression of some of the more important players in the system has been disappointing.  The first thing I said a couple posts back was that top 100 lists don’t mean all that much.  I 100% believe that’s true.  But.  I think they are instructive for observing the quantity of quality players in the system.  Or at least the how well the quality players are developing.  You’re completely right to point out all the guys that are up with the Angels now and contributing.  That’s a great thing and definitely something we haven’t seen in a while.  But the pipeline has to keep flowing.  I just hope that it does.  I’ll say it again.  There are several players in the system that I have high hopes for, and hope to see at least a couple of them recognized by those who watch these things in the near future. 

 

Edited August 1, 2019 by UndertheHalo

[Docwaukee]

39 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

Man, you took this way too personally.  I didn’t mean to suggest that you’re trying to paint a rosy picture.  I respect what you have to say a lot.  I just think that the progression of some of the more important players in the system has been disappointing.  The first thing I said a couple posts back was that top 100 lists don’t mean all that much.  I 100% believe that’s true.  But.  I think they are instructive for observing the quantity of quality players in the system.  Or at least the how well the quality players are developing.  You’re completely right to point out all the guys that are up with the Angels now and contributing.  That’s a great thing and definitely something we haven’t seen in a while.  But the pipeline has to keep flowing.  I just hope that it does.  I’ll say it again.  There are several players in the system that I have high hopes for, and hope to see at least a couple of them recognized by those who watch these things in the near future. 

 

I think it also matters what you deem important from a progression standpoint.  The way the Angels promote is so aggressive, there are going to be a lot of guys that appear to be struggling from a numbers standpoint. The only guys that superficially are going to look like they're progressing are the truly elite type like Adell who can manage a 2 level jump and still crush at the age of 19.  Those types are so rare and destined for more.  The rest are going to move at a single level pace even if they end up being an all-star or good everyday player.  

Was I hoping for more from someone like Adams?  Yes, but in an unrealistic way.  I think we were all hoping he could be the next Adell type but he's league average and one of the youngest in the league.  That's progression in my mind.  I think it's the difference of progression vs. breakout.  

Jones is really the only one who's regressed this year and even that regression might not end up the catastrophe it seems.  

The other thing is that the focus has been on raw talent with upside.  Something that takes a long time to develop.  If Will Wilson puts up league avg numbers at A ball next year, I think I'll be disappointed.  

[rafibomb]

Gareth Morgan promoted to Double-A

[Second Base]

17 minutes ago, rafibomb said:

Gareth Morgan promoted to Double-A

Yes!!!!

Also, with Raider and Rainier traded, I've got Gareth at the back end of the Top 30.

[totdprods]

Even if Gareth proceeds to do something like .250/.275/.600 it will be pretty damn exciting.

What a weird talent he might be.

Edited August 1, 2019 by totdprods

[rafibomb]

 

Gareth batting third

[rafibomb]

Jo Adell leading off

 

 

[Angelsjunky]

7 hours ago, Second Base said:

According to wins above replacement.

Not really.

Vlad Guerrero: 54.6 fWAR in 2147 games

Damon: 44.5 fWAR in 2490 games

Hunter: 43.0 fWAR in 2372 games

I added Hunter because he and Damon are so close.

Anyhow, Vlad averaged 4.1 fWAR per 162 games, Damon and Hunter both 2.9. That's a significant difference. Vlad also had five seasons of 5+ WAR, whereas Hunter and Damon never reached that mark. Vlad was a much better hitter but a less well-rounded player. He had a great arm but was a limited defensive player, rather poor in the second half of his career. Hunter was an excellent outfielder until the last few years when he slowed down. Damon was ok but nothing special. Damon was a much better runner than either.

Anyhow, the numbers don't lie. Vlad was signficant better than either. Damon and Hunter were pretty comparable.