Poll: Jerry vs. Sosh

[The Ghost of Bob Starr]

Have at it:

[Chuck]

I want him to keep Dipoto, but if I were a betting man I'd say he'd keep Sosh. 

[The Ghost of Bob Starr]

I want him to keep Dipoto, but if I were a betting man I'd say he'd keep Sosh.

Way to straddle the fence Chuck!

[Angel Dog and Beer]

No choice for Steve Soliz?

[Jason]

I think Sosh stays. The crap that is in the lineup everyday is not Sosh's fault.

[Angel Oracle]

Sosh has been here 16 seasons. A fresh face is needed.

JeDi did rebuild the pitching depth.

But offense and defense emphasis are still lacking in this org.

Send both packing after the season. Their never being on the same page is tiresome after 3.5 seasons anyway.

Promote Scott Servais to GM, hire Cubs' bench coach Dave Martinez to manage, and throw big money to get Bud Black back as pitching coach.

Edited June 30, 2015 by Angel Oracle

[Reveille1984]

Our playstyle is as stale as a decade old loaf of bread.  The bunting, runnyball, shitty bullpen management, hit and runs, matchup obsessions, etc. have been old since 2009 and they're just as played out now. 

 

Sure our lineup is mediocre, but our philosophy under Sosh is mediocre independent of that.

[nando714]

Dipoto

Let the catorce walk if he opts out

[tomsred]

Our playstyle is as stale as a decade old loaf of bread. The bunting, runnyball, shitty bullpen management, hit and runs, matchup obsessions, etc. have been old since 2009 and they're just as played out now.

Sure our lineup is mediocre, but our philosophy under Sosh is mediocre independent of that.

Help me understand this. The Angels are 20th out of 30 teams in the majors at scoring runs. They are 17th in sacrifices, and 27th in stolen bases, and you want them to do these things less along with less hit and runs? Seems to me when you have an inept hitting team you should be doing them more. As far as match ups are concerned, every manager does that. Edited June 30, 2015 by tomsred

[Inside Pitch]

Our playstyle is as stale as a decade old loaf of bread.  The bunting, runnyball, shitty bullpen management, hit and runs, matchup obsessions, etc. have been old since 2009 and they're just as played out now. 

 

Sure our lineup is mediocre, but our philosophy under Sosh is mediocre independent of that.

 

You know what I find stale and boring?   Our CURRENT playstyle -- station to station baseball, waiting for someone to hit a HR.   Running, small ball, defense, pitching....  those were things we used to do really well and the Royals employed on their way to the WS.

[Tyler]

Team Scioscia for me. 

 

LF, DH, and 2B were all Dipoto decisions.

[Reveille1984]

That's why I said "independent of that" regarding our current lineup.  Stale is stale. 

 

Sacrifice bunts are a waste of an out, so yes we need to be doing them basically never with a team that can barely hit or get on base as it is.  I said nothing about stolen bases, but we're a slow, old team so I'm not sure why we would be stealing more often.  Who's going to steal more - Pujols, Cron, Freese, Calhoun, Navarro, Joyce, Iannetta?  And the few guys that are fast can't get on base enough for it to matter.  This also ties into hit and runs.  If you have a slow team and a lineup full of mediocre hitters that have mediocre discipline and don't walk, pitcher's aren't going to challenge them enough in the zone to make a hit and run successful.  You're basically setting up for a guy to flail at a pitch out of the zone and a guy to get thrown out by ten feet at second.  None of those things create runs, and as executives and front offices learn more about sabermetrics it is becoming more and more common knowledge. 

 

Obviously every team considers matchups, but it is a religion to Sosh.  I mean christ, how long did it take him to finally hit Calhoun against lefties?  Someone probably had to physically sit him down with a laptop and set his browser to the "splits" section on mlb.com. 

 

It is my opinion that we need a fresh and updated perspective, especially when the current one is so delineated from the front office that it is making news headlines.  It is also my opinion that managers, especially in the AL, don't really affect the outcome of games all that much.  But that doesn't mean we can't align our management and try to edge out more advantages where we can.  If others don't agree that is fine. 

[Chuck]

Way to straddle the fence Chuck!

 

I voted, so I'm not on the fence.

[Inside Pitch]

Help me understand this. The Angels are 20th out of 30 teams in the majors at scoring runs. They are 17th in sacrifices, and 27th in stolen bases, and you want them to do these things less along with less hit and runs? Seems to me when you have an inept hitting team you should be doing them more. As far as match ups are concerned, every manager does that.

 

People will just tell you they make too many outs on the bases....  while at the same time ignoring that the only team with a better extra base taken percentage in the AL are the KC Royals...    Take out all the Disar induced outs and the Angels might even be below the league average for outs on the bases.

 

Edit: FTR, I do agree that productive outs for the sake of productive outs is lame...  So if someone is arguing against that -- I'd agree with them.  A team should avoid making outs...

Edited June 30, 2015 by Inside Pitch

[Guest]

Team Scioscia for me. 

 

LF, DH, and 2B were all Dipoto decisions.

 

Jeppy for Joyce was a horrible decision, but Kendrick for Heaney was a good move. Trading Josh Hamilton to a division rival with nothing in return (except salary relief equivalent to the difference in tax rates between TX and CA) was all Arte.

 

 

 

That's why I said "independent of that" regarding our current lineup.  Stale is stale. 

 

Sacrifice bunts are a waste of an out, so yes we need to be doing them basically never with a team that can barely hit or get on base as it is.  I said nothing about stolen bases, but we're a slow, old team so I'm not sure why we would be stealing more often.  Who's going to steal more - Pujols, Cron, Freese, Calhoun, Navarro, Joyce, Iannetta?  And the few guys that are fast can't get on base enough for it to matter.  This also ties into hit and runs.  If you have a slow team and a lineup full of mediocre hitters that have mediocre discipline and don't walk, pitcher's aren't going to challenge them enough in the zone to make a hit and run successful.  You're basically setting up for a guy to flail at a pitch out of the zone and a guy to get thrown out by ten feet at second.  None of those things create runs, and as executives and front offices learn more about sabermetrics it is becoming more and more common knowledge. 

 

Obviously every team considers matchups, but it is a religion to Sosh.  I mean christ, how long did it take him to finally hit Calhoun against lefties?  Someone probably had to physically sit him down with a laptop and set his browser to the "splits" section on mlb.com. 

 

It is my opinion that we need a fresh and updated perspective, especially when the current one is so delineated from the front office that it is making news headlines.  It is also my opinion that managers, especially in the AL, don't really affect the outcome of games all that much.  But that doesn't mean we can't align our management and try to edge out more advantages where we can.  If others don't agree that is fine. 

 

 

The splits situation is so foolish I entertained thoughts that Scioscia is trolling Moreno in the hopes of being fired so he can sit at home collecting $6M a year. If Sosh voluntarily opts out he forfeits the money, or has to earn much less managing elsewhere.

 

As for stolen bases, the team would have about twice as many on the season if the lineup order were one of the following:

 

NotAybar -> Trout -> Calhoun -> Pujols

NotAybar -> Calhoun -> Pujols -> Trout

Edited June 30, 2015 by ScottLux

[gurn67]

Team Scioscia for me. 

 

LF, DH, and 2B were all Dipoto decisions.

If Arte hadn't gotten involved and gave Hamilton a contract no other team in baseball was going to come close to, I think there would have been the payroll flexibility to put better players in those 3 spots.

[Reveille1984]

You know what I find stale and boring?   Our CURRENT playstyle -- station to station baseball, waiting for someone to hit a HR.   Running, small ball, defense, pitching....  those were things we used to do really well and the Royals employed on their way to the WS.

 

They aren't mutually exclusive, and those aren't the deficinies that I'm addressing anyways.  Do you know why the Royals can play like that?  They are 1st in the league in team batting average, last in the league in strikeouts, the best team in the league defensively and they are also young and fast.  The only way to make that style work is when you're the best at everything required to make it work, and the Royals are.

[shellback]

SOS since long before dp got here. minus the owners screwups, dp has done a good job with the pitching. needs on the field and in the dugout culture change and has for a long time.

[Angel Oracle]

More SBs, less productive outs (except for run scoring sac flies), and less DiSar windmilling...por favor!

Edited June 30, 2015 by Angel Oracle

[nando714]

Team Scioscia for me.

LF, DH, and 2B were all Dipoto decisions.

-Josh hamilton relapsing causing Joyce to being a everyday left fielder is JD's fault

- Cron not showing up after a solid spring is JD's fault. He was supposed to platoon with Joyce at DH

-2b I agree with. We haven't missed howie

[Angelsjunky]

Wait, its Dipoto's fault that Josh Hamilton relapsed? I don't get it.

 

Anyhow, I've got to go with Dipoto. This franchise needs a new approach on the field.

 

But given that Dipoto just got extended and Scioscia has, what, a few more years?, then I'm guessing that unless both go to Arte and say "its him or me," then they'll both be here through next year.

 

Let's not forget that the team won 98 games last year and is only a few games out of first place. They're not a dominant team by any means but they're hardly in the tank.

[Mark68]

Sosh has gotta go. I'm tired of contact play/baserunning errors/Butcher/general in-game mismanagement/SciosciaFace.

[Inside Pitch]

They aren't mutually exclusive, and those aren't the deficinies that I'm addressing anyways.  Do you know why the Royals can play like that?  They are 1st in the league in team batting average, last in the league in strikeouts, the best team in the league defensively and they are also young and fast.  The only way to make that style work is when you're the best at everything required to make it work, and the Royals are.

 

I understood the point you were trying to make, I also feel you're choosing to ignore the reality that there is nothing exciting about station to station baseball or waiting for a HR....      But since you mentioned it -- have you looked at the Astros?  They are young, they can play defense -- they are tied with the Angels for second in the AL in extra bases taken... behind the Royals....  You say the Royals can play that style because they are young and fast .... because they hit for a high average and don't strike out???  right?  Well, the Astros are younger and judging by their SB totals -- faster....  but guess what -- their team batting average is lower than ours and lookie there, they lead all of MLB in strikeouts..    THE style isn't the issue...  The Angels execution or ability on the otherhand IS.  BTW, historically speaking -- teams started running more when averages and power dropped....  You have it backwards.

 

The Angels aren't fast, and they shouldn't be trying to steal bases -- but they should still be trying to force the action and take the fight to the other team, but they may want to consider getting a non idiot to coach 3B given the knuckleheads on the team.

Edited June 30, 2015 by Inside Pitch

[Inside Pitch]

Wait, its Dipoto's fault that Josh Hamilton relapsed? I don't get it.

 

Anyhow, I've got to go with Dipoto. This franchise needs a new approach on the field.

 

But given that Dipoto just got extended and Scioscia has, what, a few more years?, then I'm guessing that unless both go to Arte and say "its him or me," then they'll both be here through next year.

 

Let's not forget that the team won 98 games last year and is only a few games out of first place. They're not a dominant team by any means but they're hardly in the tank.

 

 

Preach it dude....  They all need to put on their big boy pants and move forward.

[Puget Sound Angel]

John Madden once said if you stay in a coaching job more than 10 years, you start to burn out and players turn you out. It can work longer in  college if you win ALL the time (Coach K at Duke). Look at the 80's Lakers who after five titles in ten years, the players quit listening to Pat Riley.

 

That said, I think Sosh has some incriminating pictures of Arte, so he won't be the one he fires.