Pete Rose on Trout

[Blarg]

Rose was the player his team needed him to be.....a slap hitting hustling disruption.

 

Trout is a player that every team wants.....a young, power hitting, athletic 5 tool player.

 

Except his arm makes him a 4 tool player.

[Inside Pitch]

He wasn't compring Trout to Adam Dunn. He used Adam Dunn as a reference to the amount of strike outs Trout racked up last year. There is a huge difference.

 

Would Trout be a better hitter if 90 of his Ks had been rollers/popups to IFers?  

Edited February 13, 2015 by Inside Pitch

[Blarg]

That's doesn't mean he won't be a better player than DiMaggio, it means he has a different skill set, as did Pete Rose. I however think it takes more than one year of very high strike out totals to declare he is strike out prone.

 

How about Willy Mays? Trout is a third of the way to Mays strikeouts in 22 years in the majors. He will never catch him in home runs.

[Blarg]

Would Trout had been a better hitter if 90 of his Ks had been rollers/popups to IFers?  

 

All those can lead to a base on an error or moving a runner, so yes.

[Make Angels Great Again]

I was in Vegas for my bachelor party last Saturday. Was walking through the mall in mandalay bay and as i walked past a sporting goods store, there he was. Pete rose was doing a little thing there, signing autographs and taking pictures. They even had a sign out front advertising it that day so i knew it was him.

The funny thing is that there was just one person in there with him taking a picture, other than that the place was empty. I thought about going in and getting a picture but i thought "nah..."

[meat]

I was in Vegas for my bachelor party last Saturday. Was walking through the mall in mandalay bay and as i walked past a sporting goods store, there he was. Pete rose was doing a little thing there, signing autographs and taking pictures. They even had a sign out front advertising it that day so i knew it was him.

The funny thing is that there was just one person in there with him taking a picture, other than that the place was empty. I thought about going in and getting a picture but i thought "nah..."

I had the exact same experience maybe 4-5 years ago.  The only difference was there was no one in the shop, and I think it was Caesars?  

[Stradling]

How about Willy Mays? Trout is a third of the way to Mays strikeouts in 22 years in the majors. He will never catch him in home runs.

Wouldn't you be very happy if at the end of his career we can say Trout was an amazing player, maybe not a Willie Mays but certainly a first ballot HOFer?

[Blarg]

I would be very happy but I would not want someone to say that Tout was a good as Mays because they culled a bunch of stats that were never attributed to Mays career due to lack of accounting rather than accomplishments.

 

Trout started his career striking out over 130 times per season. That strips him of some elite status in my book simply because that is a failure on his part to make adjustments. Last season his adjustments weren't being more selective and making contact, his adjustment was to hit home runs to try and win the MVP with slugging percentage like Miggy did. He accomplished that goal and was a lesser threat at the plate doing so.

 

Adding nine more home runs while chalking up 50 more strikeouts and losing 50 points to his batting average and OBP and OPS is not a good bargain. I expect him to have improved on 2012-2013 not become more one dimensional.

[Blarg]

everything rose said is fine except for the implications that trout didn't deserve mvp

 

Again, I think his comment was directed as to how the MVP choice in 2014 was not equivalent to the previous seasons. Take the 2013 and 2012 seasons of Cabrerra in comparison and he blows the 2014 version of Trout out of the water. Trout's 2012-2013 campaign was better than 2014.

 

So what he is saying is the bar was so low that Trout underperforming with such a high strike out total is more indicative of how the league flopped.

[yk9001]

Nobody's buying a Pete Rose jersey for $300.

[Inside Pitch]

All those can lead to a base on an error or moving a runner, so yes.

 

And DPs...   Would love to hear someone explain how someone else committing an error makes Trout a better hitter.

Edited February 12, 2015 by Inside Pitch

[Inside Pitch]

Again, I think his comment was directed as to how the MVP choice in 2014 was not equivalent to the previous seasons. Take the 2013 and 2012 seasons of Cabrerra in comparison and he blows the 2014 version of Trout out of the water. Trout's 2012-2013 campaign was better than 2014.

 

So what he is saying is the bar was so low that Trout underperforming with such a high strike out total is more indicative of how the league flopped.

 

Or an indication of how the game is changing... 

[Blarg]

Shit. How about a Hunter jersey?

 

And DPs...   Would love to hear someone explain how someone else committing an error makes Trout a better player.

 

Nothing ventured... There is less of a chance of a double play with Trout at the plate so it is still not preferable to striking out since you are still replacing that out with a faster runner on base instead of on the bench.

 

Someone else hurrying a throw because they know Trout has speed is validation Trout is a better player trying to beat out that throw than sitting on the bench after whiffing. There is no possibility of a gain by striking out.

[NJHalo]

I was in Vegas for my bachelor party last Saturday. Was walking through the mall in mandalay bay and as i walked past a sporting goods store, there he was. Pete rose was doing a little thing there, signing autographs and taking pictures. They even had a sign out front advertising it that day so i knew it was him.

The funny thing is that there was just one person in there with him taking a picture, other than that the place was empty. I thought about going in and getting a picture but i thought "nah..."

Same here. I was there with my family a few years ago, and my daughter said, "Daddy, there is some baseball player over there signing autographs". She wanted to know if I was going to stop. When I saw who it was, I decided to go to Burger Bar instead.

[T.G.]

Pete Rose is trying to stay relevant... in a world where he isn't any more.

[Blarg]

yeah, more of a critique of the state of baseball right now.

 

it's true that very few players make a bunch of hitting adjustments nowadays.  hitting to all fields is a lost art in the SABR age and withh the advent of the overshift. push and pull hitters are SABRized to death, and manager use them in the lineup to match up specifically with the metrics of pitchers.  

 

i'm a huge rose fan, but he could have criticized the state of MLB without saying trout's name. 

 

I don't think a statement about how much Ryan Howard struck out would have much impact.

[ELEVEN]

In before TrollDaddy says something silly.

You're about 10 years late.

[ELEVEN]

All those can lead to a base on an error or moving a runner, so yes.

GIDP sez hi.

[TobiasFunke]

Some serious Trout D S'ing up in here

[eaterfan]

a strikeout can pretty much never advance a runner and can never induce an error. making contact is better than K'ing unless we're talking about some fluke where a guy hits into more DP's than he does advance runners or induce errors for a base hit (well, not scored as a base hit always if it's an error) over the course of 162 games.

Can't strike out on one pitch. Leads to a greater chance of pass ball or wild pitch to advance the runners.

[Blarg]

GIDP sez hi.

 

In 2,195 plate appearances Trout has hit into 23 double plays. That is a .01% chance of it happening when he comes to the plate as opposed to 22% chance of him striking out. I think I like the odds of him putting the ball in play more often than his ass on the bench.

[Blarg]

Can't strike out on one pitch. Leads to a greater chance of pass ball or wild pitch to advance the runners.

 

On the contrary.

 

[OregonLAA]

In 2,195 plate appearances Trout has hit into 23 double plays. That is a .01% chance of it happening when he comes to the plate as opposed to 22% chance of him striking out. I think I like the odds of him putting the ball in play more often than his ass on the bench.

So what you're saying is you would like him to hit into more double plays?

[yk9001]

In 2,195 plate appearances Trout has hit into 23 double plays. That is a .01% chance of it happening when he comes to the plate as opposed to 22% chance of him striking out. I think I like the odds of him putting the ball in play more often than his ass on the bench.

 

Bad math.  That is a 1.05% chance of hitting into a dp.  Not a .01% chance, as you wrote.

[tdawg87]

I think we all agree that Trout needs to cut down on the K's. If he cuts out say, 50 strikeouts last year he probably ends up with 10-15 more hits.