Feinsand: Angels are “very interested” in Blake Snell

[mmc]

https://www.mlb.com/news/blake-snell-rumors

[Buttercup]

I get the feeling Arte is going to go all in this winter. Didn’t work out well the first time but this could be like the Albert Pujols and CJ Wilson winter meetings. 

[Blarg]

They cannot afford both without sacrificing every other roster spot.  So you have a Cy Young quality pitcher with no bullpen support or defense and a DH with holes in the offense. Sounds like another 75 win season.

It's one or the other and I think Snell moves the Angels toward competitiveness more than the Unicorn. 

[Pancake Bear]

Chuck in shambles. 

[jsnpritchett]

6 minutes ago, Blarg said:

They cannot afford both without sacrificing every other roster spot.  So you have a Cy Young quality pitcher with no bullpen support or defense and a DH with holes in the offense. Sounds like another 75 win season.

 

Pretty much how I feel.  If you sign both Ohtani and Snell, at least for 2024, you're basically where you were in 2023, with Snell's pitching replicating Ohtani's pitching--but you're paying, what, probably $70M+ for the same production you paid $30M for in 2023. 

[Stradling]

13 minutes ago, Blarg said:

They cannot afford both without sacrificing every other roster spot.  So you have a Cy Young quality pitcher with no bullpen support or defense and a DH with holes in the offense. Sounds like another 75 win season.

It's one or the other and I think Snell moves the Angels toward competitiveness more than the Unicorn. 

They can afford it, he just has to be willing to pay the tax. 

 

[Hubs]

2 minutes ago, Blarg said:

They cannot afford both without sacrificing every other roster spot.  So you have a Cy Young quality pitcher with no bullpen support or defense and a DH with holes in the offense. Sounds like another 75 win season.

It's one or the other and I think Snell moves the Angels toward competitiveness more than the Unicorn. 

I disagree, they absolutely can afford both. 

[Pancake Bear]

Just now, Stradling said:

They can afford it, he just has to be willing to pay the tax. 

 

It really comes down to how much Arte wants to win vs how much he wants to just make money. Up till now, he hasn't been willing to go the distance in terms of what he'll spend. Last year, though, he at least went over the tax (not sure whether we ended up over or not), so it gives you hope that maybe he actually does want to win. 

[Stradling]

2 minutes ago, Pancake Bear said:

It really comes down to how much Arte wants to win vs how much he wants to just make money. Up till now, he hasn't been willing to go the distance in terms of what he'll spend. Last year, though, he at least went over the tax (not sure whether we ended up over or not), so it gives you hope that maybe he actually does want to win. 

It is a real concern this year for the first actual time since they signed the mega money TV contract.  With that money being uncertain, he very well could spend all that money this year and lose his ass financially if all of a sudden $100 million is no longer there in TV revenue.  

[Angel Oracle]

6 minutes ago, Hubs said:

I disagree, they absolutely can afford both. 

Only if they are willing to have a $275 million payroll so that other spots in need of upgrades aren’t ignored

Main issue is the worry of being burned YET again by another long money and years contract.

Snell at this point is a 5+ innings pitcher.  You still need a DOMINANT bullpen to consistently handle the other 4 innings 30+ times for Snell’s starts alone, and then adding in Sandoval’s lack of deeper into games pitching another 30+ times.

Snell wouldn’t be the smartest signing.

Edited November 29, 2023 by Angel Oracle

[Blarg]

13 minutes ago, Stradling said:

They can afford it, he just has to be willing to pay the tax. 

 

 

11 minutes ago, Hubs said:

I disagree, they absolutely can afford both. 

Look, you guys only see it as a money issue, it isn't.

When I bought my SLK there was a Ferrari Modena on the showroom floor next to it. When it came to the finance side the salesman was shocked at my credit rating, pointed to the Modena and said, you can afford that. My response was, yes, I can make the payment but I can't afford the $8k brake jobs, $4k in tires, $3,500 oil change and tuneup, and God forbid anything really goes down because an engine rebuild cost over $65k. 

Those two guys are affordable but you can't maintain them and keep the roster updated for eventual pay raises for all of the young talent surrounding them. So they are a Ferrari you can't take out of the garage but a couple times a month. 

And that's why that Modena was being sold as used with low mileage, the owner couldn't afford what he could buy. I signed the papers on my SLK and drove the hell out of it. And when it about wore out I traded it for a newer model. 

[jsnpritchett]

7 minutes ago, Stradling said:

They can afford it, he just has to be willing to pay the tax. 

 

 

6 minutes ago, Hubs said:

I disagree, they absolutely can afford both. 

But how realistic is it, really?  I guess we'll find out, but signing Snell and Ohtani puts you at roughly $145M+ for four players (Ohtani, Rendon, Trout, Snell) and another $40M for 5 additional guys (Anderson, Drury, Estevez, Stassi, and Fletcher).  So you're at $185M+ for 9 guys, one who of whom might not even be on your major league roster (Fletcher).  How do you reasonably upgrade and fill out the roster without going well over the threshhold?

[tdawg87]

1 minute ago, Blarg said:

 

Look, you guys only see it as a money issue, it isn't.

When I bought my SLK there was a Ferrari Modena on the showroom floor next to it. When it came to the finance side the salesman was shocked at my credit rating, pointed to the Modena and said, you can afford that. My response was, yes, I can make the payment but I can't afford the $8k brake jobs, $4k in tires, $3,500 oil change and tuneup, and God forbid anything really goes down because an engine rebuild cost over $65k. 

Those two guys are affordable but you can't maintain them and keep the roster updated for eventual pay raises for all of the young talent surrounding them. So they are a Ferrari you can't take out of the garage but a couple times a month. 

And that's why that Modena was being sold as used with low mileage, the owner couldn't afford what he could buy. I signed the papers on my SLK and drove the hell out of it. 

Ok boomer

[Stradling]

6 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

Only if they are willing to have a $275 million payroll so that other spots in need of upgrades aren’t ignored

Main issue is the worry of being burned YET again by another long money and years contract.

Snell at this point is a 5+ innings pitcher.  You still need a DOMINANT bullpen to consistently handle the other 4 innings 30+ times for Snell’s starts alone, and then adding in Sandoval’s lack of deeper into games pitching another 30+ times.

Snell wouldn’t be the smartest signing.

There are very few pitchers that actually pitch more than 180 quality innings. Last year Snell gave the Padres 180 dominant innings. 

[Stradling]

1 minute ago, jsnpritchett said:

 

But how realistic is it, really?  I guess we'll find out, but signing Snell and Ohtani puts you at roughly $145M+ for four players (Ohtani, Rendon, Trout, Snell) and another $40M for 5 additional guys (Anderson, Drury, Estevez, Stassi, and Fletcher).  So you're at $185M+ for 9 guys, one who of whom might not even be on your major league roster (Fletcher).  How do you reasonably upgrade and fill out the roster without going well over the threshhold?

You don’t. You go over the threshold. That’s what signing even Ohtani mandates. 

[Taylor]

Time for Arte to snell out the cash.

[Angels 1961]

2 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

Ok boomer

Someone told me just get new tires and fix rip in seat that's all you'll need. More rumors and I'm sure Snell is on many teams wish list. 

[Hubs]

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/los-angeles-angels//payroll

Spotrac has a $150M projection as the roster sits today. If you think the Angels get Snell for what Nola got or a bit more, that's $26M say, and Ohtani costs $45M That puts them at $221M. They wont have much left to upgrade other positions. 

[Taylor]

6 minutes ago, Blarg said:

 

Look, you guys only see it as a money issue, it isn't.

When I bought my SLK there was a Ferrari Modena on the showroom floor next to it. When it came to the finance side the salesman was shocked at my credit rating, pointed to the Modena and said, you can afford that. My response was, yes, I can make the payment but I can't afford the $8k brake jobs, $4k in tires, $3,500 oil change and tuneup, and God forbid anything really goes down because an engine rebuild cost over $65k. 

Those two guys are affordable but you can't maintain them and keep the roster updated for eventual pay raises for all of the young talent surrounding them. So they are a Ferrari you can't take out of the garage but a couple times a month. 

And that's why that Modena was being sold as used with low mileage, the owner couldn't afford what he could buy. I signed the papers on my SLK and drove the hell out of it. And when it about wore out I traded it for a newer model. 

You and dtwncbad love your car metaphors that have nothing to do with the situation being discussed.

[Blarg]

13 minutes ago, Stradling said:

You don’t. You go over the threshold. That’s what signing even Ohtani mandates. 

You can't stay over the limit. Not even the Dodgers or Yankees can. And it is stupid to run your payroll that way, over investment in athletes that obviously with Ohtani on his second elbow reconstruction, can have careers altering or ending injuries that destroy the teams ability to recover.

It's as stupid as buying a Ferrari Modena when you can't afford the engine rebuild and end up with a bus pass. 

[T.G.]

1 minute ago, Blarg said:

It's as stupid as buying a Ferrari Modena when you can't afford the engine rebuild and end up with a bus pass. 

Who buys a car that is going to need an engine rebuild?

[Angel Oracle]

9 minutes ago, Stradling said:

There are very few pitchers that actually pitch more than 180 quality innings. Last year Snell gave the Padres 180 dominant innings. 

That is true.  

However, from 2019-2022, he averaged just under 5 innings/start.

That history makes a big money, big years contract a big risk.

Edited November 29, 2023 by Angel Oracle

[Blarg]

3 minutes ago, Taylor said:

You and dtwncbad love your car metaphors that have nothing to do with the situation being discussed.

Just because you can't understand them doesn't mean the metaphor isn't accurate.  

[Pancake Bear]

19 minutes ago, Stradling said:

It is a real concern this year for the first actual time since they signed the mega money TV contract.  With that money being uncertain, he very well could spend all that money this year and lose his ass financially if all of a sudden $100 million is no longer there in TV revenue.  

Is it the full $100m, though? My understanding was they only get a certain amount of that and the rest goes to revenue sharing.

[Blarg]

4 minutes ago, T.G. said:

Who buys a car that is going to need an engine rebuild?

Ohtani had his elbow reconstructed twice.  Nearly every Japanes pitcher in the last 15 years has had to have elbow surgery within their first couple years. So I guess the Angels knew Ohtani was due for a rebuild before they bought him. The question is, do you pay more for a car that has had a history of rebuilds? Because that's what his asking price is now.