Manager / GM Candidates

[eaterfan]

I don't think it matters who is hired as long as Arte owns the team. He may have high payrolls, but doesn't spend on anything that isn't on an MLB field.

This team gets injured every year and falls off because they don't have a farm system. They don't have the depth to replace injured players the way other orgs do. Arte also lacks the patience and long term vision to build anything sustainable on the farm or in the organization. Every team gets injured, maybe the Angels are more unlucky some years, but not always. Last year the Dodgers lost so many players (and a lot of good ones) and still rolled because of their depth. 

Every year has been "go for it" since they signed Pujols. They were trying to maximize their window with Pujols and borrowing against the future when they should have been trying to maximize Trout's window. It's not going to change until Arte is gone. 

[stormngt]

16 hours ago, Angel Oracle said:

Was only with the Halos in 1998.

I thought Nevin was the catcher that dropped the ball after the strike out.  Who was that catcher?

[stormngt]

5 hours ago, Hubs said:

No. He was on the Angels only for 1998.

That was 2005.

 

Who was the back up catcher in 2005.  Santana struck out the batter to rnd the inning, but umpire ruled the ball hit the ground.  The WS player ran to first and inning continued.

[BTH]

5 minutes ago, stormngt said:

Who was the back up catcher in 2005.  Santana struck out the batter to rnd the inning, but umpire ruled the ball hit the ground.  The WS player ran to first and inning continued.

Josh Paul

[Hubs]

38 minutes ago, stormngt said:

Who was the back up catcher in 2005.  Santana struck out the batter to rnd the inning, but umpire ruled the ball hit the ground.  The WS player ran to first and inning continued.

Benji and Jose Molina did the vast majority of the Catching in 2005. But Josh Paul was the third string Catcher, and he's who you are thinking of. He was at the plate with Doug Eddings as the Umpire. The ball did not drop. AJ Pierzinsky was the White Sox Catcher who ran to 1st base anyway.

[Vladdy Issues]

On 8/15/2023 at 5:20 PM, Stradling said:

Look, you even putting me in a discussion of worst takes while you swallow Nevin inch by inch all day, every day is the most hypocritical take on the board and this board has Cali.  

Lol... what a way with words you have there Strandy Boy... we're there for you if you ever wanna talk

[Stradling]

9 minutes ago, Jimmy Z said:

Lol... what a way with words you have there Strandy Boy... we're there for you if you ever wanna talk

Thanks.  I’m good.  If you are super sensitive I can treat you with kid gloves.  

[Vladdy Issues]

Just now, Stradling said:

Thanks.  I’m good.  If you are super sensitive I can treat you with kid gloves.  

just make sure your hands aren't cold papi

[Stradling]

Just now, Jimmy Z said:

just make sure your hands aren't cold papi

I don’t know what that means.  

[Vladdy Issues]

1 minute ago, Stradling said:

I don’t know what that means.  

google it

[Ariamus]

On 8/15/2023 at 1:54 PM, Hubs said:

People seem to like Nevin on here for some reason, and take Minasian's side against Joe Maddon. But this team is headed for a full regime change. Most blame Arte, but this isn't all on the owner. Yeah, he may not hire well, but despite Perry's decent trades and some good signings, this team is not good. Injuries, yes, but this is not all on injuries.

I tried to be optimistic, all year long, but three straight second half collapses, (well last year was in end of May, but still a collapse)... three straight losing records and three straight seasons where the team doesn't look like its getting any better? Minasian is getting fired. Nevin will not be back.

Since Scioscia left, this team has been BAD. You can say the last four years of Scioscia weren't great, (he also dealt with a lot of pitching injuries). But the record certainly speaks for itself. 

2019 -- 72-90. 

2020 -- 26-34 (which is a 70-92 pace).

2021 -- 77-85.

2022 -- 73-89

2023 -- 59-61 (80 win pace, but I doubt they finish that high).

 

Scioscia's last 10 years 

2018 -- 80-82

2017 -- 80-82

2016 -- 74-88

2015 -- 85-77

2014 -- 98-64 (best record in MLB).

2013 -- 78-84

2012 -- 89-73

2011 -- 86-76

2010 -- 80-82

2009 -- 97-65

 

SO who is a good GM or Manager Candidate for next year and beyond?

I'm late to the thread so I'm not sure if this has been said already. I'm fairly certain it has... But here it comes anyway.

A change of GM and swapping the field manager without a change in ownership is just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. It doesn't mean shit because the ship will invariably sink... Each and every year.

[T-angel]

If Arte stays on as owner, he at least needs to move Carpino aside and hire a real baseball guy as President. Yes, Arte meddles and has been the cause of some catastrophic mistakes. But which owner doesn't to some degree. Eddie Debartolo with the 49ers had Jon McVay and Bill Walsh to check him. Arte needs to find that type of guy and make him President. When Friedman was with the Rays, Arte should have made him an offer with the keys to the castle, free reign, a blank check, and absolute veto power. But alas Arte didn't have the foresight to do that but he needs to now. 

I feel for him in some ways. In the late 2000's he was generally considered one of the better owners in the league. He lost out on Miguel Cabrera when the Marlins got greedy at the last moment. He lost out on Texeira and blamed it on Scott Boras. That caused him to hesitate on signing Adrian Beltre right away and eventually lost him to Texas. Then he got impatient. I always thought that the real reason Stoneman stepped down was because Arte wanted someone he could consummate the big trade or signing that would put the Angels over the top. Due to Stoneman's hoarding of prospects and the methodical and slow way he would contemplate every move that was probably why Arte turned to someone like Reagins who was terrible but a push over.  Then came that utterly stupid, knee-jerk Vernon Wells trade and the hole in the pitching pipeline because of the untimely Adenhart passing.

In reality, Stonemans emphasis on prospects and building from within was probably the right way to go and ultimately trading for Dan Haren and half a season of Greinke, were moves that were made to bridge the gap but cost the Angels in terms of prospects. This had repercussions in later years since the guys that were lost were 4 major leaguers (Joe Saunders, Patrick Corbin, Tyler Skaggs, and Jean Segura). To top this off, after the Angels championship season in 2002, they would go on to the playoffs and lose in excruciating ways to the White Sox and to the Red Sox multiple times. The last great chance for them to make the World Series in the past 20 years was in 2009 when they got ousted in the AL Championship round by the Yankees. I always wondered, if the Angels had only shelled out the money to keep Frankie as the closer in the offseason instead of signing Brian Fuentes if we would have won the first game of that series. That was a tone setting game because the Angels lost that one when A-rod homered off Fuentes to tie the game in the bottom of the 9th (or 10th?) with the Angels about to close it out 2-1. Maybe they would have lost anyways, but I would like to think with Frankie, we would have gotten past them. 

So I can see where Arte's impatience and the meddling has come from. I don't excuse it. But he hasn't always been known as a bad owner. I agree it may be time for him to sell. But if he is going to stay on, then he needs to try something different. He needs to hire the best President he can from one of the successful organizations (like the Rays, Dodgers) and give that person complete autonomy.

[BTH]

1 hour ago, T-angel said:

If Arte stays on as owner, he at least needs to move Carpino aside and hire a real baseball guy as President.

The problem is Arte will never do that because Carpino is his buddy from their billboard days.

[eaterfan]

17 hours ago, T-angel said:

If Arte stays on as owner, he at least needs to move Carpino aside and hire a real baseball guy as President. Yes, Arte meddles and has been the cause of some catastrophic mistakes. But which owner doesn't to some degree. Eddie Debartolo with the 49ers had Jon McVay and Bill Walsh to check him. Arte needs to find that type of guy and make him President. When Friedman was with the Rays, Arte should have made him an offer with the keys to the castle, free reign, a blank check, and absolute veto power. But alas Arte didn't have the foresight to do that but he needs to now. 

 

Even if Arte were willing to hire someone who could stand up to him, the meddling is only half the problem. The other part is that Arte is cheap and won't spend on anything that isn't on the MLB roster. 

[Second Base]

The last two GM's that Arte hired have been pretty damn good executives, and hey they've still lost. And managers aren't important, but whoever they've used in the dugout, has also continually lost. 

So if it isn't the manager, or the GM... Maybe it's the players. Well no, that can't be it, the Angels have continually brought in talented players to compete. 

Ok so who else could it be....

[BTH]

2 hours ago, Second Base said:

The last two GM's that Arte hired have been pretty damn good executives, and hey they've still lost.

Eppler is not a good exec.

[Hubs]

Bumping this, but I actually think Arte sells after the season. Watching this team self destruct, he's gonna be tired. 

[BTH]

On 8/15/2023 at 5:10 PM, Swordsman78 said:

Your takes on this are going to look awful in a few months.  But since you are posting with the emotions of a teen age girl, its bound to bite you in the butt eventually.   Pro tip....Just stop. 

mmhmm

On 8/15/2023 at 5:16 PM, BTH said:

Look in the mirror, pal.

We’ll revisit this in two months and see who is right.

If you’re right and Nevin is back for 2024, I’ll self-ban on here for a month.

 

[ten ocho recon scout]

On 8/18/2023 at 5:25 PM, Ariamus said:

A change of GM and swapping the field manager without a change in ownership is just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. It doesn't mean shit because the ship will invariably sink... Each and every year.

Not even just the owner. As long as the farm is empty, the FA market sucks, and Rendon and Trout miss most of the year while costing 80 million roughly, it's not going to make much difference who you bring in to make trades or fill out a lineup card.

[Stradling]

On 8/15/2023 at 5:18 PM, Swordsman78 said:

Please don't self ban, that would make Strad's takes the most awful on the board, and we can't have our mod in that situation.

Haha. 

[Stradling]

On 8/15/2023 at 3:21 PM, Stradling said:

Minasian will be back, but I would be very surprised if Nevin is brought back.  He was given a one year contract in what they thought was a transition year between owners.  Now that that isn’t the case, a new manager will be brought in, unless of course Arte sells.  I would not be at all surprised to see him sell the team regardless of whether or not he re-signs Ohtani.  

 

On 8/15/2023 at 3:38 PM, Swordsman78 said:

This quote will be rich.  #bookmarked.

Thank you for bookmarking me being correct. 

[Dtwncbad]

I didn’t love Weiss when he managed the Rockies, but to be fair I wasn’t really following that closely.

Anyway, he has managerial experience.  

And now he just spent five years as a bench coach for the Braves, a damn good organization.

I bet he is a real candidate for being a manager again somewhere in 2024.

 

 

[stormngt]

On 8/15/2023 at 10:58 AM, Angelsjunky said:

I'm reminded of stories about despotic kings who constantly change their generals and such, because they're not happy with outcomes that ultimately have more to do with their leadership than those under them.

So my only response: It doesn't matter, at least as long as Arte has significant input. Let the baseball people do baseball. I have criticisms of Perry Minasian, but I'd like to see what he can do if given time and freedom. Let him decide on the manager, and see if he can turn things in the right direction. 

Well stated

[EDinTUSTIN]

On 8/18/2023 at 10:02 AM, Hubs said:

No. He was on the Angels only for 1998.

That was 2005.

 

Nevin was a very good baseball player. He was good at third, and a very good hitter. He was not a superstar by any means, but he was productive. His best years were with the Padres. He did hit 41 home runs one season after the previous season hitting 31 home runs. Other than his years with San Diego where he played full seasons, the rest of his career he was injury prone, but while he played he was very productive.

[mmc]

How about Clayton McCollough?