Rumor Central: Angels preferred destination for Mike Moustakas?

[ettin]

I am going to go out on a limb here and say that if we actually do sign Moustakas he will not stay at 3B for very long and will be moved over to 1B in the near future.

[Inside Pitch]

4 hours ago, Erstad Grit said:

He was still one of top hr hitters.  If the balls were juiced, they were juiced for everyone not just moose.

The point isn't that Hrs were up for everyone, the point is there is a reason why they were up and the hrs are the only reason some people believe he's anything special.  

20, 12, 15, 22, - 38.

The 38 HRs happened...  but it's hard to believe it's a new level of performance and minus that hes a mediocre bat.   Those ugly rates are just as real as the 38 hrs but they aren't the anomaly.... The HRs are. 

 

 

[Jason]

On 11/16/2017 at 10:52 AM, Chuckster70 said:

Seems like the board is split on this guy, but I'm in the pro-Moustakas camp, especially if we bump our OBP with signing Carlos Santana and say a trade for Cesar Hernandez.

Pretty sick lineup and a bunch of power. 

2B Hernandez

1B Santana

CF Trout

LF Upton

3B Moustakas

DH Pujols

RF Calhoun

SS Simmons

C  Maldonado

Lol at Pujols hitting 6th

[Inside Pitch]

12 hours ago, oater said:

Jeff Malinoff was also the national cross-checker through 2016.  So:

Jones was drafted when Jerry D. was GM, Ric Wilson was scouting director and Jeff Malinoff was national cross-checker.

Marsh was drafted when Eppler was GM, Wilson was scouting director and Malinoff was national cross-checker.

Canning was drafted when Eppler was GM, Swanson was scouting director and Jason Smith was the national cross-checker.

Of course Canning hasn't pitched an inning of professional ball and dropped in the draft due to medical concerns.  He may end up being a great player, but IMO it is far too early to pronounce the "new regime" as being vastly better than Ric Wilson and Jeff Malinoff.  

This is fair. 

I think a more accurate statement to be made is that the current focus is better for us than the previous one.   It remains to be seen whether the issue was poor scouting or a bad draft strategy...   I dont believe the scouts or Ric Wilson were bad, I think they were looking at the wrong things and chasing different types of players as a result.

 

[Erstad Grit]

9 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

The point isn't that Hrs were up for everyone, the point is there is a reason why they were up and the hrs are the only reason some people believe he's anything special.  

20, 12, 15, 22, - 38.

The 38 HRs happened...  but it's hard to believe it's a new level of performance and minus that hes a mediocre bat.   Those ugly rates are just as real as the 38 hrs but they aren't the anomaly.... The HRs are. 

 

 

Then why do you think his hrs increased at a higher rate than other players?  

[Inside Pitch]

3 hours ago, vladdy#27 said:

Actually now that you bring up Turner that might be a good comp for Moustakas. Turner was a free agent last year and had a hard time finding a deal and ended up signing for less than what was projected. While Turner is 3 years older he is a better player.

Turner signed for 4 years 64M

There doesn’t appear to be much of a market for Moustakas meaning his value is going to come down. I’d be surprised if he got more than Turner. 

I've said it before..... I'm decidedly against Moustakas at what I think the asking price will be, but until we have any real indication what he wants or what the market will bring my stance is admittedly premature.   The dude is a decent bet to outperform guys who will be signed for less...   I think he's a risk, I think there are warts there ... but if they can get him for 3/40 plus an option he likely delivers on it.   

[Hubs]

FYI, we can add three free agent bats in the 10-15M range, plus a reliever or two and a low cost starter in the Chavez mold and still be close to the luxury tax line. Without trading Cron or Valbuena, which would likely happen if they added bats at 1st and 3rd.

The lack of any high end money committed to the starting staff really helps the bottom line.

 

[Hubs]

Just now, Inside Pitch said:

I've said it before..... I'm decided against Moustakas at what I think the asking price will be, but until we have any real indication what he wants or what the market will bring my stance is admittedly premature.   The dude is a decent bet to outperform guys who will be signed for less...   I think he's a risk, I think there are warts there but if they can get him for 3/40 plus an option he likely delivers on it.   

If they can get him for 3/40? I'd be happy with 5 or 6 at that AAV. He's just 29, he's going to get a five year deal. Hopefully that keeps the AAV down.

 

[Hubs]

Player Trout	Position CF	2018 34,083,333	AAV 24000000
Pujols	DH	27,000,000	24000000
Upton	LF	16,000,000	21200000
Simmons	SS	11,000,000	8250000
Calhoun	RF	8,500,000	8660000
Valbuena	1B	8,000,000	7500000
			0
Richards	SP	7,000,000	7,000,000
Shoemaker	SP	4,400,000	4,400,000
Maldonado	C	2,800,000	2,800,000
Ramirez	SP/RP	2,600,000	2,600,000
Cron	1B	2,800,000	2,800,000
Parker	CL	1,700,000	1,700,000
Skaggs	SP	1,900,000	1,900,000
Alvarez	RP	1,100,000	1,100,000
Wood	RP	2,200,000	2,200,000
Bedrosian	RP	1,200,000	1,200,000
Heaney	SP	800,000	800,000
Bridwell	SP	550,000	550,000
Cowart	2B/3B	550,000	550,000
Graterol	C	550,000	550,000
Meyer	SP/RP	550,000	550,000
Middleton	RP	550,000	550,000
Paredes	RP	550,000	550,000
Tropeano	SP/RP	550,000	550,000
Moustakas	3B	14,000,000	15,000,000
Cozart	SS/2B	12,500,000	12,500,000
Santana	1B	12,500,000	14,000,000
McGee		5,000,000	5,000,000
Petit		2,500,000	2,500,000
Chatwood		7,000,000	7,000,000
		190,433,333	181,960,000

[Inside Pitch]

18 minutes ago, Erstad Grit said:

Then why do you think his hrs increased at a higher rate than other players?  

I'm more concerned with how his seemingly chasing hrs brought his overall performance down.... and how or if that will carry over.   

You're not listening to what I'm actually saying, you're seemingly so caught up in the actual HR tally itself you're ignoring the why or how it may have impacted other parts of his offense. 

We are looking at things.    Not a right or wrong type of thing.   If you've read what 've said...  I'm unsure how to read his performance other than the concern for the ugly rates

[oater]

16 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

I think a more accurate statement to be made is that the current focus is better for us than the previous one.   It remains to be seen whether the issue was poor scouting or a bad draft strategy...   I dont believe the scouts or Ric Wilson were bad, I think they were looking at the wrong things and chasing different types of players as a result.

 

I agree.  The main point I was trying to make in my discussion with Scotty is to not over-value second round draft picks.  By all accounts, Swanson is well regarded in the baseball industry, and I have no issues with the job he is doing.

[Blarg]

There is a lot of tunnel vision with Moustakas. If he were such a performer you would think the Royals would drop a qualifying offer on him or an extension. I think they know he is over valued and would rather flounder without him than pay too much for the same results. 

[Cdaniel]

1 minute ago, Blarg said:

There is a lot of tunnel vision with Moustakas. If he were such a performer you would think the Royals would drop a qualifying offer on him or an extension. I think they know he is over valued and would rather flounder without him than pay too much for the same results. 

I though the Royals did give him a QO, did they not?

[Inside Pitch]

4 minutes ago, oater said:

I agree.  The main point I was trying to make in my discussion with Scotty is to not over-value second round draft picks.  By all accounts, Swanson is well regarded in the baseball industry, and I have no issues with the job he is doing.

Yep.....  what's more I think if you asked Eppler, he'd say he's less worried about the pick itself and more concerned with the loss of the actual pool money.   We have seen them do a really good job of spreading the money around.

 

[Hubs]

He was offered a QO. He is expected to get 5/80. Which is reasonable.

[DMVol]

2 hours ago, ettin said:

I am going to go out on a limb here and say that if we actually do sign Moustakas he will not stay at 3B for very long and will be moved over to 1B in the near future.

 

33 minutes ago, Hubs said:

He was offered a QO. He is expected to get 5/80. Which is reasonable.

I think it's all about the market....5/80 might be a little strong for us to get in but we obviously don't know where Eppler's line would be.  If the market flattens out a little, maybe in the 60 million or so range, I'd have to think we'd get in....we'll see....

[Hubs]

FYI, I am a fan of Moustakas, but would be equally pleased with Zack Cozart at 3rd and Neil Walker at 2nd, or Todd Frazier at 3rd and either of those guys at 2B.. The Angels just need help and I don't want them to give up current assets in a trade. Cozart was not given a QO, nor was Walker or Frazier.

Getting a fix at 2b and 3B slightly outweighs the need for a 1B, but not by much. I hope the Angels address all three positions, and I've come around on Carlos Santana. I like Hosmer as well, but mainly because of his youth. I'd be fine with three to four years of Cozart, Walker, and Santana for around $40 M total per year. 

Cron can be moved for a pen arm. Valbuena then can fill in at all three infield positions.

If they skipped Moose, and put their cash on those other three, you'd be essentially looking at a lineup most days that looked like:

Calhoun RF

Walker 2B

Trout CF

Upton LF

Pujols DH

Santana 1B

Cozart 2B

Maldonado C

Simmons SS

 

Versus getting a player like Moustakas might break up the Trout-Upton-Pujols Log jam. I doubt they hit Pujols 6th, though, so its more likely Calhoun is dropped and then you need a more leadoff friendly addition at 2B.

 

 

[Angelsfan1984]

5 minutes ago, Hubs said:

FYI, I am a fan of Moustakas, but would be equally pleased with Zack Cozart at 3rd and Neil Walker at 2nd, or Todd Frazier at 3rd and either of those guys at 2B.. The Angels just need help and I don't want them to give up current assets in a trade. Cozart was not given a QO, nor was Walker or Frazier.

Getting a fix at 2b and 3B slightly outweighs the need for a 1B, but not by much. I hope the Angels address all three positions, and I've come around on Carlos Santana. I like Hosmer as well, but mainly because of his youth. I'd be fine with three to four years of Cozart, Walker, and Santana for around $40 M total per year. 

Cron can be moved for a pen arm. Valbuena then can fill in at all three infield positions.

If they skipped Moose, and put their cash on those other three, you'd be essentially looking at a lineup most days that looked like:

Calhoun RF

Walker 2B

Trout CF

Upton LF

Pujols DH

Santana 1B

Cozart 2B

Maldonado C

Simmons SS

 

Versus getting a player like Moustakas might break up the Trout-Upton-Pujols Log jam. I doubt they hit Pujols 6th, though, so its more likely Calhoun is dropped and then you need a more leadoff friendly addition at 2B.

 

 

Like Dee Gordon? I'm all for Cozart and Frazier but that leads us to this issue in 2 years again and we have nobody coming up worth a damn as far as prospects go at those positions.

[eaterfan]

25 minutes ago, Angelsfan1984 said:

Like Dee Gordon? I'm all for Cozart and Frazier but that leads us to this issue in 2 years again and we have nobody coming up worth a damn as far as prospects go at those positions.

A lot can happen in 2 years. Maybe our outfield prospects develop and we can trade for a stud 2B. Maybe there is a stud FA. But there will probably be a guy or two who can put up 1-2 WAR in FA then too.

[Revad]

I agree with Hubs that Cozart and Walker would be solid additions giving plenty of flexibility and not costing any draft picks.  Including Upton, that would be three solid additions (presumably making Trout happy) while leaving the farm to grow.  By this time next year the farm would be a strength with likely 2 or 3 top 100 prospects.

Another thought would be to sign Walker or Cozart and trade for Chase Headley as I think the Yanks would be open to a salary dump.  Headley, Cron and Valbuena cover 1st and 3rd next year, then in 2019, especially if there's no sign of a Trout extension, pick up one of the big FAs like Machado, Donaldson, Altuve (I imagine Walker could do 3b).

[Angelsfan1984]

36 minutes ago, eaterfan said:

A lot can happen in 2 years. Maybe our outfield prospects develop and we can trade for a stud 2B. Maybe there is a stud FA. But there will probably be a guy or two who can put up 1-2 WAR in FA then too.

Or we sign guys like Daniel Nava and Espinosa....

[eaterfan]

5 minutes ago, Angelsfan1984 said:

Or we sign guys like Daniel Nava and Espinosa....

Better than signing guys like Hamilton.

[Taylor]

Let's not kid ourselves ... if Moustakas signs with the Angels, he'll be a bust. If he signs anywhere else, he'll hit 40+ home runs with Gold Glove defense.

[California Cajun]

Bora$ alert

[Angelsfan1984]

16 minutes ago, eaterfan said:

Better than signing guys like Hamilton.

Hamilton was just a shit show. I'd still take a chance on a guy who is capable of hitting 30+ homeruns than a guy that can't hit his body weight.