Bourjos traded to Cardinals

[Corona]

Everyone on here is so quick to defend Bourjos for his woes but immediately points to Freese's bad year.

[Scott34]

Unless we get Tanaka, Arroyo and 2 solid RPs, there is no way this offseason can work.

[halodground]

Anybody know anything about Salas?  Is there at least quality stuff there maybe without results?  I'm trying to find a silver lining here.  Wasn't he the closer for St Louis for a brief time?

[Lifetime]

Everyone on here is so quick to defend Bourjos for his woes but immediately points to Freese's bad year.

huh?

[Catwhoshatinthehat]

ALF - the Cardinals have been interested in  him for a while.  I like the guy and would like to see him playing for the Angels but the team obviously likes Calhoun enough to move him.

 

Inside - never said he was iron man just that 3B has been an area of need.  For the record I'm not really high on Freese but I'm willinig to take a flyer on him considering how poor the Angels have been at 3B offensively for the last few years as they've been near the bottom of MLB in terms of SLG/OPS. 

[DMVol]

When the Wells trade happened, every knowledgeable baseball pundit panned the Angels.  They all turned out to be right.  Here, the same thing is happening.  There can be no doubt this was a one-sided trade. 

Every trade is always subject to playing itself out....but when everybody says it was a dumb move (see Wells), it usually is a dumb move....and this sure has a Wells feel to it....

[bloodbrother]

No worries folks, on the bright side the Halos have some up and coming talent to look forward to

 

John Manuel ‏@johnmanuelba 9m

Hard to remember a farm system in worse shape than #Angels. Going to rival '08 Astros for worst top 30 in Prospect Handbook history

[jshep]

Can we just go back to the part of the offseason where we were doing nothing but hiring ALL the coaches?

 

That was at least less painful.

[AngelsLakersFan]

This makes the move to trade Callaspo look REALLY BAD now. And that's a move I liked at the time.

[Dave Saltzer]

I have a question for all those who are opposed to this deal: Can I find a post from you talking about playing Trout in CF instead of Bourjos? Remember the whole controversy about displacing Trout from CF, his preferred position? If you think/thought Trout should go back to CF, most of your rage on this deal is deflated because the best part of Bourjos' value was tied to his defense in CF. If he's not in CF, then his value is diminished. 

 

I am a big fan of both Peter Bourjos and Grichuk. Really like both guys, and have known them since they first came into our system. I had a sneaky suspicion that Grichuk would be included in this deal. On a personal note, I will be sad to see them playing elsewhere, although I am happy that they are going to a good organization.

 

However, I am a bigger fan of the ANGELS. I want to see the Angels win over any one player.

 

I will hold off on evaluating this trade until I see all the moves that Dipoto makes. As Chuck has argued, this move frees up a potential Aybar/Kendrick/Trumbo move to get pitching. I hope Freese bounces back, but also see him as a placeholder until Cowart develops.

 

Unlike some, I am not going to go into a fullblown panic over the move until I see the whole picture. I see this as the first step in a sequence of moves. Give it some time and have patience.

[jshep]

No worries folks, on the bright side the Halos have some up and coming talent to look forward to

 

John Manuel ‏@johnmanuelba 9m

Hard to remember a farm system in worse shape than #Angels. Going to rival '08 Astros for worst top 30 in Prospect Handbook history

 

Clearly John Manuel missed the part where we acquired a prospe- oh, no, that's right.

[wopphil]

He was good in 2011, terrible in 2012 and 2013.  Advanced stats like him better than his actual numbers (just like Mr. Blanton!), and his peripherals don't seem terrible.  He is very comparable, IMO, to Jepsen. 

[DMVol]

Unless we get Tanaka, Arroyo and 2 solid RPs, there is no way this offseason can work.

We just added salary....think we're probably going to be dumpster diving for SP again...

Edited November 22, 2013 by DMVol

[bloodbrother]

Ok, I found the positive in this trade

 

Jeff Fletcher ‏@JeffFletcherOCR 1m

I'm assuming this trade means that RHP Juan Gutierrez and IF Chris Nelson, both arb eligible, will be non-tendered. #Angels

[Richard]

I have a question for all those who are opposed to this deal: Can I find a post from you talking about playing Trout in CF instead of Bourjos? Remember the whole controversy about displacing Trout from CF, his preferred position? If you think/thought Trout should go back to CF, most of your rage on this deal is deflated because the best part of Bourjos' value was tied to his defense in CF. If he's not in CF, then his value is diminished. 

 

I am a big fan of both Peter Bourjos and Grichuk. Really like both guys, and have known them since they first came into our system. I had a sneaky suspicion that Grichuk would be included in this deal. On a personal note, I will be sad to see them playing elsewhere, although I am happy that they are going to a good organization.

 

However, I am a bigger fan of the ANGELS. I want to see the Angels win over any one player.

 

I will hold off on evaluating this trade until I see all the moves that Dipoto makes. As Chuck has argued, this move frees up a potential Aybar/Kendrick/Trumbo move to get pitching. I hope Freese bounces back, but also see him as a placeholder until Cowart develops.

 

Unlike some, I am not going to go into a fullblown panic over the move until I see the whole picture. I see this as the first step in a sequence of moves. Give it some time and have patience.

Somewhere in the madness, I touched on this. Trout gets to play the position he's most comfortable with and showing loyalty to Trout, hoping to get a long term deal done.

 

[Mudville]

No, but there may have been other options at 3b.   Do you believe the Angels explored all their options with Grichuk before including him?     Perhaps they explored all of the potential options at 3b, but Freese is very mediocre, and we've specialized in mediocrity there since Macpherson and Wood.  

 

It feels like a bad deal.   Obviously they felt good, so they pulled the trigger.   It just seems some other chips could have fallen into place with another team.

You obviously have no idea what mediocre means in baseball. It is not a guy with a career 115 OPS+.

 

Bourjos on the other hand is a 98 OPS+ player. It makes him just about average.

[gotbeer]

Ok, I found the positive in this trade

 

Jeff Fletcher ‏@JeffFletcherOCR 1m

I'm assuming this trade means that RHP Juan Gutierrez and IF Chris Nelson, both arb eligible, will be non-tendered. #Angels

 

Silver lining.

[CardsFanVegas]

Salas isn't even one of St. Louis' top 10 prospects according to Baseball America.  /sigh.

 

Salas isn't a prospect.   He's going into his first year of arbirtation I do believe.

 

he did spend significant time in Memphis last year, but has been with the big league for a few years.

 

He was closing for a while in 2011 and pretty solid of us then.   But 2012 and 2013 he just flat out sucked.   Cards were likely going to non-tender him if they couldn't move him.

[Section517]

Nightmare visions of Gary Gaetti redux are coming to mind.

 

Dipoto is playing checkers while other GMs are playing chess.

[AngelsLakersFan]

ALF - the Cardinals have been interested in  him for a while.  I like the guy and would like to see him playing for the Angels but the team obviously likes Calhoun enough to move him.

 

Inside - never said he was iron man just that 3B has been an area of need.  For the record I'm not really high on Freese but I'm willinig to take a flyer on him considering how poor the Angels have been at 3B offensively for the last few years as they've been near the bottom of MLB in terms of SLG/OPS. 

 

This team is NOT better with Calhoun starting. This lineup is more efficient with Calhoun in it (a natural corner OFer) than Bourjos, but attempting to take advantage of that efficiency does not mean you trade Bourjos for pennies on the dollar. 

 

It's like winning a new Civic on the Price Is Right so you decide to sell your newish Mercedes for $10k. 

[Catwhoshatinthehat]

I think this is a trade of 2013 underperformers (whatever the reason - injuries, mechanics) as far as ML talent. We will never know who else the Angels could have used PB to acquire but I think some are definitely overvaluing him. Not sure about trading one of our top prospects but the Angels have the OF depth to do it.  I'm honestly in the middle on the trade and not worked up one way or the other to throw in the towel.  Regardless I look forward to this thread getting bumped throughout 2014.

[gurn67]

Added salary and made things worse. Dipoto should go work for the federal government.

[jshep]

Salas isn't a prospect.   He's going into his first year of arbirtation I do believe.

 

he did spend significant time in Memphis last year, but has been with the big league for a few years.

 

He was closing for a while in 2011 and pretty solid of us then.   But 2012 and 2013 he just flat out sucked.   Cards were likely going to non-tender him if they couldn't move him.

 

lol

[tdawg87]

You obviously have no idea what mediocre means in baseball. It is not a guy with a career 115 OPS+.

Bourjos on the other hand is a 98 OPS+ player. It makes him just about average.

Well yeah, if offense is the only thing you use to judge a player.

[CardsFanVegas]

For what its worth Angel's fans, I think David Freese has a good shot to turn it around this year.

He hit 20 HRs in 2012, so he has the potential to do that again if he can stay healthy.

 

He is a hometown hero for what he did in 2011 and I'm sad to see him go.

 

I am happy to see Borjous get a shot in St. Louis,  I was saying earlier this last summer that he looked like the kind of player the Cards would target.    He is definitely an upgrade over Jon Jay.

 

I hope Freese turns it around for you guys this year.    Really rooting for him, and Albert too.  

 

Salas sucks.