The Official 2022 Los Angeles Angels Minor League Stats, Reports & Scouting Thread

[BTH]

1 hour ago, rafibomb said:

I wonder if some people’s opinions on Silseth would be different had he never been pushed to the majors. In just his second professional season after getting drafted he is putting up insane numbers. He had some upside as a TOR guy in the draft if he figured a few things out as well. 

Maybe, but I also think people’s eyes were opened to him once he was promoted to the majors. It forced them to re-evaluate him, which pushed him from the middle of Angels’ prospect lists to a top 3-5 spot.

What I saw in the majors from Silseth was a pitcher with a straight mid 90’s fastball and a plus splitter, with needed development of a 3rd pitch and durability to pitch past the 3rd/4th inning.

[Docwaukee]

I guess I'm gonna kinda disagree with most here.  Silseth has a third pitch and it's pretty good.  A slider that he gets a decent number of swing and misses on but I haven't seen him use it much as anything other than an out pitch.  So he has to be ahead to make it useful.  Which we didn't see in his time at mlb but I've seen plenty of in his minor league starts.  He's gonna need a version of that pitch as a show me that he can throw for strikes.  On rare occasion I think I remember him showing a slower version of it here and there. 

But to me, he's gonna need that mostly because of his flat fastball.  So unless he ends up with excellent FB command or finds a way to wrinkle that FB a bit.  But it's gonna be tough for him to play off of that FB to get ahead of hitters.  

So what he actually needs it a fourth pitch.  Like a slurve/curve or cutter.  

I'm also not convinced that a poorly located flat fastball works any better out of the bullpen vs. as a starter.  

[Inside Pitch]

28 minutes ago, Docwaukee said:

I guess I'm gonna kinda disagree with most here.  Silseth has a third pitch and it's pretty good.  A slider that he gets a decent number of swing and misses on but I haven't seen him use it much as anything other than an out pitch.  So he has to be ahead to make it useful.  Which we didn't see in his time at mlb but I've seen plenty of in his minor league starts.  He's gonna need a version of that pitch as a show me that he can throw for strikes.  On rare occasion I think I remember him showing a slower version of it here and there. 

That's kind of what I mean by a consistent 3rd pitch. Whether that was his call or the org telling him to keep it simple -- dunno.  

Edit: it was def his FB getting lit up.

28 minutes ago, Docwaukee said:

I'm also not convinced that a poorly located flat fastball works any better out of the bullpen vs. as a starter.  

Somewhere in NV, Kevin Jepsen just got triggered.

[Inside Pitch]

Man, baseball savant is such a great database.  I remembered Silseth FB being super flat, seems like the issue is less up and down and more left to right.

[Angel Oracle]

Does Silseth throw the heat up in the zone, or lower in the zone?

Up in the zone allows it to be flatter, correct?

[Docwaukee]

1 minute ago, Inside Pitch said:

That's kind of what I mean by a consistent 3rd pitch. Whether that was his call or the org telling him to keep it simple -- dunno.  Maybe I'm wrong but he seemed to struggle the most with his split -- the FB is flat but he was able to get away with some mistake pitches, the splitter seemed to be where he was burned by some that didn't "split" enough.

To me it's a pure out pitch and should never touch the strike zone as it's crossing the plate.   When it did, it got hammered.  Because when it's that high, it doesn't actually split.  

I've seen him slow the slider down and try to get it in for a strike as a show me pitch.  It's not bad.  

And I agree that he'll get away with his fastball more than others just because of his velo.  

5 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Man, baseball savant is such a great database.  I remembered Silseth FB being super flat, seems like the issue is less up and down and more left to right.

which is why he gets away with it sometimes I think right?  It can be high or low in the zone and still be effective.  If it's middle middle or middle out...

which is why I thought a cutter might do him some good.  (kinda like ohtani who I think has similar issues with his fastball but also gets away with it because he throws 101).  They both could end up with a similar repertoire.  Like if Ohtani had a less talented little brother who can't hit and isn't japanese.  

[Inside Pitch]

9 minutes ago, Docwaukee said:

To me it's a pure out pitch and should never touch the strike zone as it's crossing the plate.   When it did, it got hammered.  Because when it's that high, it doesn't actually split.  

No, I was dead wrong -- it's been the FB that's been toasted.  He's had a lot more success with the split -- even when it's stayed up.  So, it's likely what I thought it was a split that stayed up, it was just his heater... or the sinker.  I was just so sure his FB was totally flat that I fooled myself.

Check these out..

It's crazy that hitters put up a .750 SLG% off his 4 seamer and he was actually lucky it wasn't worse...

[Warfarin]

4 hours ago, Trendon said:

Don’t forget Reid Detmers!

So, ideally:

Ohtani

Sandoval

Detmers

Silseth

Bush

Suarez

 

(and then there’s also Bachman)

My bad man, nice catch, totally forgot about Detmers.  Yeah, then the above plays rather well.  We really need to re-sign Ohtani, but as long as we do, I think we can have a rather effective core moving forward.  I believe in Perry's background and I think he has the right people in place to help our prospects develop well.  Maybe I am overly optimistic, but..

[Warfarin]

5 hours ago, Angel Oracle said:

Let it be CRod, please!   Health, stay good.

After how little he has pitched, I have given up on him as a SP, but I do think he can be a really good high-leverage reliever, which is a valuable role too.  He could be our closer of the future, pending health.  

[Chuck]

 

[Second Base]

Regarding Silseth and Bush....

It's undeniable to me that Bush carries higher upside, but Silseth is the better pitcher, and with good reason. 

Silseth's fastball is hittable because of the angle. It's considered straight, but like any pitch from any major leaguer, if he puts it in the right spot he'll be successful. 

For me, it's the third pitch. It looks good in AA but I haven't seen him use his breaking ball effectively in the bigs. It doesn't mean he doesn't have it, it just means he's still a work in progress, like any prospect.

Bush creates a better downhill angle, making him harder to hit. He's got a better breaking ball than Silseth and his change up is also pretty solid. Not quite where Silseth's is though. As a major leaguer, I think Bush could and will be a Sandoval type starter. His ceiling, as I said before is David Price. 

Silseth.... It's difficult to say. I think they both ever up being mid rotation starters, just two different looks. 

[Docwaukee]

1 hour ago, Second Base said:

Silseth.... It's difficult to say. I think they both ever up being mid rotation starters, just two different looks.

maybe it'll be more of a career arc thing. 

Where Bush is more steady.  The guy that gives up his 2 or 3 or 4 runs over 6 or 7 almost every time out but only rarely will he give you that dominant start.  His peaks years will be solid and there will be more of them.  

Silseth will be the guy that alternates dominant starts with ones where he gets blown up.  And at his peak he'll have a couple of really really good seasons.  

[Vlad27Trout27]

I actutally think that Sisleth fits more of that Sandoval mold. High off-speed use and  better use of the Fastball. Similar to early in Sandoval's career and besides controling his emotions, its going to be the command/control to take that next step for silseth. 

Bush, I actually thing he has over-powering stuff, at time's his fastball has looked unhittable and that slider is plus. With his size and ability to hide the ball, the balls comes out better! I give him the Snell/Price comp. The Fastball/Slider is elite. 

[Vlad27Trout27]

I might be biased, but I think it total bs that silseth isn't in the top 100 With the stuff he's shown, the season he's had in AA, how quick he's climbed up the system. 

[Angel Oracle]

13 hours ago, Vlad27Trout27 said:

I might be biased, but I think it total bs that silseth isn't in the top 100 With the stuff he's shown, the season he's had in AA, how quick he's climbed up the system. 

I wonder if his small MLB experience and resultant struggles played into it?

[Docwaukee]

1 hour ago, Angel Oracle said:

I wonder if his small MLB experience and resultant struggles played into it?

I actually think there is some merit to the idea of him coming on the radar for prospect lists due to that call up.  He was in the latter third to start the year.  Without that 'audition', and with the limited time and effort sites put into watching prospects in the range he was in, he probably would have moved up to like the teens.  

[Angelsjunky]

I know minor league stats don't tell the whole picture, but if you don't know the player's name or org, how is this not a very serious, top 100 prospect? Especially when you factor in that he only pitched 5.1 IP in 2021, so it is effectively his first season in the minors. Utterly dominant.

Age 22 (AA): 83 IP, 27 BB, 110 Ks, 2.28 ERA

 

[Inside Pitch]

17 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

I know minor league stats don't tell the whole picture, but if you don't know the player's name or org, how is this not a very serious, top 100 prospect? Especially when you factor in that he only pitched 5.1 IP in 2021, so it is effectively his first season in the minors. Utterly dominant.

Age 22 (AA): 83 IP, 27 BB, 110 Ks, 2.28 ERA

 

Can't put too much weight in those 83 innings when he posted an ERA near 12.00 the previous season.

I've said this before -- I struggle to understand how minor league sites rank guys anymore.  You could count on BBA to go tools happy, FG to lean production wise and MLB seemed to follow their own hype train..  but lately they all just seem to be pulling things out of their bums.

[Angelsjunky]

5 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Can't put too much weight in those 83 innings when he posted an ERA near 12.00 the previous season.

For a second there I thought you were serious. LOL.

5 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

I've said this before -- I struggle to understand how minor league sites rank guys anymore.  You could count on BBA to go tools happy, FG to lean production wise and MLB seemed to follow their own hype train..  but lately they all just seem to be pulling things out of their bums.

Yep, it seems so. I think "draft pedigree" is big too, at least with BBA and MLB. But it is received knowledge. "He was drafted in the 1st round, so must be really good; he was drafted in the 5th round, so probably not as good as his numbers imply."

[Inside Pitch]

9 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

For a second there I thought you were serious. LOL.

LOL!

9 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

Yep, it seems so. I think "draft pedigree" is big too, at least with BBA and MLB. But it is received knowledge. "He was drafted in the 1st round, so must be really good; he was drafted in the 5th round, so probably not as good as his numbers imply."

Yep, draft pedigree has always been hyped up.   Ditto international hype. 

The funny things is IMO, the international market is way less hyped now than it used to be.  In the days before budgeted pool monies teams tended to throw a shit ton at guys that never amounted to anything -- including the A's.  I still remember when they broke a 9 or 10 year old record (Wily Mo Pena), for the biggest international FA signing ever (4.25 M), on Michael Ynoa.  It's crazy but that 4.25 Mil was the biggest first year bonus paid out by the A's to any amateur topping the 3.2 mil they gave Mulder in 98 when he was the 2nd or 3rd overall pick.

[Angelsjunky]

3 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

LOL!

Yep, draft pedigree has always been hyped up.   Ditto international hype. 

The funny things is IMO, the international market is way less hyped now than it used to be.  In the days before budgeted pool monies teams tended to throw a shit ton at guys that never amounted to anything -- including the A's.  I still remember when they broke a 9 or 10 year old record (Wily Mo Pena), for the biggest international FA signing ever (4.25 M), on Michael Ynoa.  It's crazy but that 4.25 Mil was the biggest first year bonus paid out by the A's to any amateur topping the 3.2 mil they gave Mulder in 98 when he was the 2nd or 3rd overall pick.

Do you have any idea of how many eventual major leaguers--and at different tiers of performance (bench, regular, star, etc)--come from international signings vs. the amateur draft?

 

Edited September 19, 2022 by Angelsjunky

[Inside Pitch]

10 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

Do you have any idea of how many eventual major leaguers--and at different tiers of performance (bench, regular, star, etc)--come from international signings vs. the amateur draft?

I know an article exists detailing this -- I'm going to dig around and try to find it, think I still have the link saved somewhere.   But the vast majority of success stories are the guys that sign for chump change and let's be honest, the reason is simple -- there are a ton more of them than the bonus baby ones...

[AngelsFaninGA]

41 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

For a second there I thought you were serious. LOL.

Yep, it seems so. I think "draft pedigree" is big too, at least with BBA and MLB. But it is received knowledge. "He was drafted in the 1st round, so must be really good; he was drafted in the 5th round, so probably not as good as his numbers imply."

Hence why, for example, O'Hoppe is still a bit of an afterthought while Moreno is widely regarded as top 5 (despite his power disappearing) and Cartaya is top 20-30 (despite playing at a level below O'Hoppe).

[Angel Oracle]

7 minutes ago, AngelsFaninGA said:

Hence why, for example, O'Hoppe is still a bit of an afterthought while Moreno is widely regarded as top 5 (despite his power disappearing) and Cartaya is top 20-30 (despite playing at a level below O'Hoppe).

I think you meant to say Alvarez and not Moreno?

[DMVol]

Touki pitching in relief for SLC.....3 straight clean 1 inning appearances....too small a sample size I guess but maybe he shows enough to stay on the 40 man over the winter and compete for a bullpen job in the spring....