Offense vs. Pitching

[Torridd]

I was reading the long Cobb thread and thought this whole thing is so silly. It should be obvious to management especially that the Angels can only go so far with their current pitching. But what if they have a different slant with the acquisitions of Cobb and Quintana? Do they really think the offense can outscore whatever our pitchers give up? I'd be very surprised if we didn't add a "capable" starter, but if not, can the starting nine be improved?

[BTH]

5 hours ago, Torridd said:

I was reading the long Cobb thread and thought this whole thing is so silly. It should be obvious to management especially that the Angels can only go so far with their current pitching. But what if they have a different slant with the acquisitions of Cobb and Quintana? Do they really think the offense can outscore whatever our pitchers give up? I'd be very surprised if we didn't add a "capable" starter, but if not, can the starting nine be improved?

Yeah, and I think the easiest way would be through an addition in the outfield. An addition there covers RF until one of Adell or Marsh is ready and also provides insurance for Upton in LF.

[Angel Oracle]

Here’s my question, that might be better served as a poll.

Is there a reason that all off-season Halos acquisitions are just one year from FA?

Coincidence, or Arte not wanting to do multi year contracts until the new CBA is hammered out?

Although a blow torch might be needed to thaw the relations between the two sides.

Edited February 3, 2021 by Angel Oracle

[BTH]

10 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

Here’s my question, that might be better served as a poll.

Is there a reason that all off-season Halos acquisitions are just one year from FA?

Coincidence, or Arte not wanting to do multi year contracts until the new CBA is hammered out?

Although a blow torch might be needed to thaw the relations between the two sides.

I'd imagine it's to create long-term payroll flexibility. Minasian comes from Atlanta, where they've loved to do that under AA.

[Angelsjunky]

Well, baseball involves scoring and preventing runs, each as 50% of the team's performance. Calories in, calories out. If a team has excellent "grade A" hitting and only ok "grade C" pitching, they're still a good "grade B" ballclub - so 90ish wins.

I don't think the Angels' offense is that good, though. Maybe grade B or B+. I guess the hope is that the pitching will be surprisingly good, or above average, maybe in the C+/B- range. So if you average it out, they're still hoping for a B-/B club, or 87-92 wins. But it is also possible we get B- hitting and C or C- pitching, which drops us to 80-85 wins. 

Meaning, anywhere in the 80-92 win range is plausible, with 85-88 being most likely.

[tdawg87]

29 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

Well, baseball involves scoring and preventing runs, each as 50% of the team's performance. Calories in, calories out. If a team has excellent "grade A" hitting and only ok "grade C" pitching, they're still a good "grade B" ballclub - so 90ish wins.

I don't think the Angels' offense is that good, though. Maybe grade B or B+. I guess the hope is that the pitching will be surprisingly good, or above average, maybe in the C+/B- range. So if you average it out, they're still hoping for a B-/B club, or 87-92 wins. But it is also possible we get B- hitting and C or C- pitching, which drops us to 80-85 wins. 

Meaning, anywhere in the 80-92 win range is plausible, with 85-88 being most likely.

'the fuck kinda math is this?

[tdawg87]

Just now, tdawg87 said:

math is

 

[Angelsjunky]

21 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

'the fuck kinda math is this?

Math not.

[T.G.]

Nickname...

Jeff "History isn't my favorite subject, but MATH IS"

[floplag]

7 hours ago, Torridd said:

I was reading the long Cobb thread and thought this whole thing is so silly. It should be obvious to management especially that the Angels can only go so far with their current pitching. But what if they have a different slant with the acquisitions of Cobb and Quintana? Do they really think the offense can outscore whatever our pitchers give up? I'd be very surprised if we didn't add a "capable" starter, but if not, can the starting nine be improved?

Of course it can, RF is an obvious spot.  I like Puig on a i year maybe, i would have liked Pederson but thats moot now , someone to hold it down and put up numbers till one of the kids is ready.
Maybe 1B but i kinda doubt they go there right now, besides Walsh did well enough last year as the heir apparent. 

[Junkballer]

 

1 hour ago, tdawg87 said:

math is

Que CERA CERA

[maximus p]

We've been promised the hitting will outscore what the pitching gives up before. Never seems to work out that way.

[Lou]

27 minutes ago, maximus p said:

We've been promised the hitting will outscore what the pitching gives up before

Link?

[Docwaukee]

8 hours ago, Angel Oracle said:

Here’s my question, that might be better served as a poll.

Is there a reason that all off-season Halos acquisitions are just one year from FA?

Coincidence, or Arte not wanting to do multi year contracts until the new CBA is hammered out?

Although a blow torch might be needed to thaw the relations between the two sides.

not sure it has anything to do with the CBA.  My guess is that if you're bumping up against the threshold and want the ability to hit the reset button financially, it's easier to do so with guys on 1yr deals than those on long term commitments.  

while there are going to be star players to be had on long term deals, there will also be guys who are very good on 1yr deals.  

It also allows you to potentially fill gaps with prospects more readily than complicating matters by blocking guys 

there are reasons why Minasian has done what he's done.  

Iglesias SS - great crop of SS in the 2022 FA class.  
Iglesias BP - longer term commitments to pen guys are a loser
Quintana - really good value relative to the rest of the market
Cobb - not sure.  probably because you get a serviceable SP for almost nothing in terms of 2021 cost.  

I still wouldn't be surprised if the Angels target Ozuna when all is said and done.  Could be another guy that you get great value on.  Kinda like Minasian's mention of Donaldson.  

[wopphil]

15 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

 

I don't think the Angels' offense is that good, though. Maybe grade B or B+. 

I agree with this. It isn’t hard to envision a scenario where Upton continues to regress, Ohtani provides nothing from the DH spot, and RF is a black hole again. I’d like to see them add another strong bat to the lineup. Ozuna would be perfect, albeit probably too expensive. 

[Stradling]

And if they they have a chance at getting a guy like Bauer or Odorizzi or a trade at the deadline that brings them over the threshold, with all the one year deals they can undoubtedly get below next year. 

[Stradling]

2 minutes ago, wopphil said:

I agree with this. It isn’t hard to envision a scenario where Upton continues to regress, Ohtani provides nothing from the DH spot, and RF is a black hole again. I’d like to see them add another strong bat to the lineup. Ozuna would be perfect, albeit probably too expensive. 

But where does Ozuna play?  He’s worse defensively than Upton. 

[wopphil]

5 minutes ago, Stradling said:

But where does Ozuna play?  He’s worse defensively than Upton. 

Good point, I guess I assumed he could play RF, but that is probably an unsound assumption. 

[Stradling]

1 minute ago, wopphil said:

Good point, I guess I assumed he could play RF, but that is probably an unsound assumption. 

Yea unless we see a trade that includes Ward or Albert retires in the coming days, I just don’t see Ozuna as a fit. 

[NorCal Halo]

When will it be time to move Trout to right field?  Are there any good CFs out there that would move to roving outfield when the prospects come up?

[Stradling]

1 minute ago, NorCal Halo said:

When will it be time to move Trout to right field?  Are there any good CFs out there that would move to roving outfield when the prospects come up?

Trout won’t be a right fielder, he doesn’t have the arm.  All three of our young outfield prospects could play CF with my understanding that Adams being the most natural CF of the three. 

[NorCal Halo]

I don't mind Trout's arm, Stradling, but you are right he can move to left.  I'm thinking of the legs and wear and tear as he ages.  Since Maddon has talked about reviving the running game, I was thinking that Hamilton or Bradley, Jr. could be options instead of just focusing on RF.  Trying to think of ways of improving offense.

[Angels 1961]

First I think this rotation is better and deeper then recent years. The offense will be fine and I would not add a Puig he would just be a distraction. Any money left I add bullpen arms. We need shut down arms for 6, 7, 8 and 9th inn. I look for Taylor Ward and Jamie Barria to show improvement. Cheap bullpen pieces still on market and I hope Minasian takes advantage of this.

[NorCal Halo]

10 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

First I think this rotation is better and deeper then recent years. The offense will be fine and I would not add a Puig he would just be a distraction. Any money left I add bullpen arms. We need shut down arms for 6, 7, 8 and 9th inn. I look for Taylor Ward and Jamie Barria to show improvement. Cheap bullpen pieces still on market and I hope Minasian takes advantage of this.

Probably the cheapest plan and the one Arte will endorse.  BTW, I miss Scott Shields.

[Lou]

1 minute ago, NorCal Halo said:

Probably the cheapest plan and the one Arte will endorse.

 Because Arte's cheap?