Are we done?

[Stradling]

1 minute ago, tdawg87 said:

We drafted Newcomb in the first round. He's now a 27 year old reliever.

I'm hoping there's a good college starter available this year at #10 but I'd also hope Eppler doesn't reach and draft a pitcher just because. 

He hasn’t panicked yet.  

[Nolan Fregosi]

46 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Who here wants to waste four more years?  No one.  This has been a rebuild over the time Eppler has been here.  Some might call it something different, but it is absolutely a rebuild.  As for trading Trout, haha haha.  I agree, you are being ludicrous.  Once again, it has been a rebuild.  

 

[Nolan Fregosi]

But you are proposing waiting for the rebuild and not trading to improve the rotation,

I’m not sure how you might do that now?   In terms of trading Trout, of course it’s ludicrous- just like waiting 

to grow a pitching corps quickly via the minor leagues and compete quickly. 

[tdawg87]

The rebuild is basically over. We have a top 10 pick this year and will hopefully be in on some good international prospects. We've already acquired a few.

The Angels are very much looking to compete now. And if we're in the middle of the division race AND WC race, I think Eppler will part with the pieces needed to bring in a starter to put us over the top.

[Stradling]

24 minutes ago, Nolan Fregosi said:

But you are proposing waiting for the rebuild and not trading to improve the rotation,

I’m not sure how you might do that now?   In terms of trading Trout, of course it’s ludicrous- just like waiting 

to grow a pitching corps quickly via the minor leagues and compete quickly. 

I’m not proposing that at all.  I’m telling you that the moment Eppler got here they started rebuilding. 

[AngelsLakersFan]

38 minutes ago, Nolan Fregosi said:

But you are proposing waiting for the rebuild and not trading to improve the rotation,

I’m not sure how you might do that now?   In terms of trading Trout, of course it’s ludicrous- just like waiting 

to grow a pitching corps quickly via the minor leagues and compete quickly. 

Eppler isn't going to make a move for the sake of making a move. We are at the start of the open window for competing and this is not the time to push all the chips in. Adell and Marsh are going to be a big piece of this team's window over the next several years, so it only makes sense to move them if the value is there. 

[Inside Pitch]

The 2015 Angels that Eppler inherited had Shoemaker, Richards, Santiago, Skaggs, and Heaney all with at least four years of control (3+ for his first year), and Tropeano in AAA .... a year removed from the PCL ERA title.   

Their top 20 prospects at the time included Ellis, Newcomb, Gatto, Bedrosian, Gott, Alcantara, Hunter Green, Kyle McGowin, Nate Smith and Jeremy Rhoades....  The highest position player prospects at the time were Baldoquin, Kubitza, and Cowart...    The team had no C, no 3B, no 2B, no LF, and a SS on an expiring contract to open 2016.   But yeah it was a real mistake to try to infuse the system with position players I guess.

Here's Sickles' take on the system's strengths and weaknesses at that time... https://www.minorleagueball.com/2015/2/16/8047917/los-angeles-angels-top-20-prospects-for-2015

 

[Lou]

I miss Kyle Kubitza 

[Stradling]

I’m not sure who just got murdered but someone just got murdered.  

[Inside Pitch]

1 minute ago, Lou said:

I miss Kyle Kubitza 

He was the Brandon Wood of his time...

[Lou]

4 minutes ago, Stradling said:

I’m not sure who just got murdered but someone just got murdered.  

[Lou]

50 minutes ago, RBM said:

has had great value as both a starting pitcher and as a late inning reliever.

huh?

[Inside Pitch]

1 hour ago, RBM said:

Newcomb is a good illustration of my point. He was a good pick at #15 in 2014 and he was the last pitcher we drafted in the 1st round. He had great value as a trade piece and has had great value as both a starting pitcher and as a late inning reliever.

BTW, he is going to be a SP this year.

Since you weren't around at the time.... Enjoy... 

 

 

[nate]

The trade was so bad that John Coppolella got banned from baseball.

[ukyah]

3 hours ago, Nolan Fregosi said:

So...in your scenario, we should endure four years of rebuild, waste more Trout years?  

that’s better than admitting the mistakes and trading unproven outfield or infield surplus assets to become competitive more quickly?  that does not sound appealing or why they bring Joe Madden and Rendon in...but ok 

if that’s the case, trade Trout and begin the rebuild.  Ludicrous 

i feel like i'm playing the role of another poster in this exchange, probably lou, who knows.

my scenario is not enduring four more years of rebuild, we're currently in a four year rebuild. my scenario is don't destroy your farm system that you've just spent the last four years rebuilding from a garage fire. the angels are going to need adell and marsh's performances and salary control in order to be truly competitive. if they could get an equal pitching prospect for one of them, then i could understand that because it has the same net dollar effect, but otherwise, no it's a mistake.

we needed to sign one of the top FA starters this year. we failed to do so. that was a mistake, but making another mistake to fix a prior mistake is in itself a bigger mistake.

by the lake. 

jake takes the cake.

[tdawg87]

That was gay-ke.

[Lou]

8 minutes ago, ukyah said:

i feel like i'm playing the role of another poster in this exchange, probably lou, who knows.

my scenario is not enduring four more years of rebuild, we're currently in a four year rebuild. my scenario is don't destroy your farm system that you've just spent the last four years rebuilding from a garage fire. the angels are going to need adell and marsh's performances and salary control in order to be truly competitive. if they could get an equal pitching prospect for one of them, then i could understand that because it has the same net dollar effect, but otherwise, no it's a mistake.

we needed to sign one of the top FA starters this year. we failed to do so. that was a mistake, but making another mistake to fix a prior mistake is in itself a bigger mistake.

by the lake. 

jake takes the cake.

good take 

[ukyah]

2 minutes ago, Lou said:

good take 

[Vegas Halo Fan]

13 minutes ago, ukyah said:

we needed to sign one of the top FA starters this year. we failed to do so. that was a mistake, but making another mistake to fix a prior mistake is in itself a bigger mistake.

I don't believe that it can be said that not signing pitchers who wanted something that we couldn't offer was a mistake.

[Claude]

2 hours ago, Inside Pitch said:

The 2015 Angels that Eppler inherited had Shoemaker, Richards, Santiago, Skaggs, and Heaney all with at least four years of control (3+ for his first year), and Tropeano in AAA .... a year removed from the PCL ERA title.   

Their top 20 prospects at the time included Ellis, Newcomb, Gatto, Bedrosian, Gott, Alcantara, Hunter Green, Kyle McGowin, Nate Smith and Jeremy Rhoades....  The highest position player prospects at the time were Baldoquin, Kubitza, and Cowart...    The team had no C, no 3B, no 2B, no LF, and a SS on an expiring contract to open 2016.   But yeah it was a real mistake to try to infuse the system with position players I guess.

Here's Sickles' take on the system's strengths and weaknesses at that time... https://www.minorleagueball.com/2015/2/16/8047917/los-angeles-angels-top-20-prospects-for-2015

 

Lol I remember reading the same story about how Dipoto inherited a bad situation from Reagins. The “thank you Jerry” chants were awesome. 

 

[Inside Pitch]

2 hours ago, RendZone said:

Lol I remember reading the same story about how Dipoto inherited a bad situation from Reagins. The “thank you Jerry” chants were awesome. 

 

Cut the bullshit, Claude...

If you remember that, then you remember I was one of the guys calling those people out for being full of shit and making excuses for "Teflon Jerry".   It's completely disingenuous to try to take this route in response to my comment given my position at that time..   Eppler actually did step into the mess that people tried to say Jerry did.

But since you want to pretend the two situations are remotely the same -- here's a refresher..   Eppler didn't inherit a team with three top 100 prospects in the system.  There was no Mike Trout standing by ready to carry the team on his back.  There was no 21 year old Tyler Chawood or 24 year old Garret Richards still looking to break into the rotation, no Jean Segura, CJ Cron, Matt Shoemaker, Kole Calhoun, or Randal Grichuk, all waiting in the wings about to start on productive MLB careers.   He didn't have a 25 year old Mark Trumbo fresh off a 29 HR, 114 OPS+ season.   He didn't have three SPs coming off 220+ IP seasons and ERA+s running from 111 to 159, and he didn't have a 23 year old closer fresh off an all star game appearance.   Most importantly, he didn't get to blow 350 million in his first winter on the job.   

The only reason people thought Jerry had it bad is because they got used to the way things where under Bill Stoneman...  Having three guys in the top 100 seemed like a disaster after getting used to having as many as what 5/6 guys in there .. But a team with an above league average offense and above league average pitching staff, payroll flexibility, and 6 future MLB regulars in the farm system is a far cry from what Eppler walked into.

[Lou]

[tdawg87]

[Claude]

18 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Cut the bullshit, Claude...

If you remember that, then you remember I was one of the guys calling those people out for being full of shit and making excuses for "Teflon Jerry".   It's completely disingenuous to try to take this route in response to my comment given my position at that time..   Eppler actually did step into the mess that people tried to say Jerry did.

But since you want to pretend the two situations are remotely the same -- here's a refresher..   Eppler didn't inherit a team with three top 100 prospects in the system.  There was no Mike Trout standing by ready to carry the team on his back.  There was no 21 year old Tyler Chawood or 24 year old Garret Richards still looking to break into the rotation, no Jean Segura, CJ Cron, Matt Shoemaker, Kole Calhoun, or Randal Grichuk, all waiting in the wings about to start on productive MLB careers.   He didn't have a 25 year old Mark Trumbo fresh off a 29 HR, 114 OPS+ season.   He didn't have three SPs coming off 220+ IP seasons and ERA+s running from 111 to 159, and he didn't have a 23 year old closer fresh off an all star game appearance.   Most importantly, he didn't get to blow 350 million in his first winter on the job.   

The only reason people thought Jerry had it bad is because they got used to the way things where under Bill Stoneman...  Having three guys in the top 100 seemed like a disaster after getting used to having as many as what 5/6 guys in there .. But a team with an above league average offense and above league average pitching staff, payroll flexibility, and 6 future MLB regulars in the farm system is a far cry from what Eppler walked into.

I never said it was your story. I said I remember reading it here on Angelswin. There were plenty of Dipoto supporters here while I called Reagins a patsy. Reagins wasn’t a great GM but he also didn’t have full control of anything. He had advisers at many levels. I said that Scioscia and Arte had a lot to do with Reagins fail with Napoli and Wells to start with. Remember now? I also said that Dipoto was in over his head when he proudly boasted about acquiring Iannetta as some great achievement. Lou loved Reagins or it appeared that he did when he interviewed him. 

[Inside Pitch]

8 minutes ago, RendZone said:

I never said it was your story. I said I remember reading it here on Angelswin. 

You said it was the same story -- the implication being that the two situations were similar when you know they weren't..   So, again -- lets cut the BS..  In your opinion did Eppler and Dipoto come into the same situation?

BTW -- here's the greatest example of "Thank you Jerry" ever..