Has Arte had enough?

[angelsnationtalk]

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/10/angels-rumors-manager-joe-maddon.html

With Arte seemingly pushing for a managerial change and recognizing he has Trout permanently it seems like Arte is tired of playing games. 

The Angels like their internal budget of around $175M-$180M. The Angels can still sign Cole and stay within that budget. I wonder if Arte has had enough and might expand some things in terms of dollars.

What has already been one hell of a 2019 season is about to get more interesting. Angels could make some serious roster additions/changes.

[Dtwncbad]

Maybe it’s not that he has “had enough” (as if he is changing direction) but rather he and the other brains are simply on schedule to make more significant moves.

There really is no good reason to not be aggressive right now in bringing in a few impact players.

It’s just time.

[AngelsFaninGA]

I don't like the idea of Arte being the primary driver for these changes, given his track record. If he is, we're gonna see something appalling like 4/60 for Miley. Ideally this is an Eppler decision with some minor, hands-off advice from Arte. 

[TBailey]

I’m sure Arte has “had enough” as we all have as fans. As much as Eppler is to blame for the terrible free agent acquisitions, he is a huge reason why Trout wanted to stay imo. Trout speaks highly of Eppler. From a fan’s standpoint, I believe that Eppler is a big reason our club has had any hope over the last few seasons. 

Eppler has done some bad, but he’s also done some good. I’m not 100 percent that Eppler is on the hot seat with Arte. I believe that Eppler has “had enough” just as much as Arte has. Imho, I really believe that Eppler and Arte made this choice together. Again, that’s just my opinion.

They’ve “stayed the course” the last few seasons and this is the worst it’s gotten. I think Arte opens up the bank, throws big offers at multiple Free Agents in an effort to put this team back in the playoffs. 

I think if Maddon comes, a lot of other players will be coming too. It really does start at the top. And quite frankly, i don’t really think Ausmus had the personality to spark this team. Times have changed, and you need someone who’s a little bit “hip.” Regardless, we need someone who the players love playing for. Bottom line. Everything else will fall into place.

Here’s my prediction(s):

Joe Maddon

Gerrit Cole 

Odorizzi

Trade for #2/3 type.

[Claude]

“It’s going to be a crazy offseason,” Trout said. “We’ve got a lot of money freed up. It’s going to be interesting. I like the direction we’re going.”

Mike Trout

October 1st, 2017

[Taylor]

The last time Arte "had enough" didn't go very well.

[Stradling]

We have no idea if this is Arte driven.  Sure he could have the voice, so does Eppler.  It is just as likely that Eppler, who is much more in tune with what is going on in the clubhouse, didn’t like what he saw and went to Arte with the decision to move on from Brad.  We already heard the issue with the communication between White and the pitchers, so that is a fireable offense.  We just don’t know and unless Eppler is fired, or resigns, we may never know.

[ukyah]

something that never seems to be said around here is that every year people start talking about how arte is going to expand the budget, "spend for the right player", and yet it never happens. i'm sure we'll bring in some pitching, but i'm the type to go with history. i predict the angels budget will end up extremely similar to where it always is.

[Hubs]

Just now, ukyah said:

something that never seems to be said around here is that every year people start talking about how arte is going to expand the budget, "spend for the right player", and yet it never happens. i'm sure we'll bring in some pitching, but i'm the type to go with history. i predict the angels budget will end up extremely similar to where it always is.

Except for Torri Hunter, Vernon Wells, Pujols and Wilson, Hamilton, etc.

 

[Dtwncbad]

6 minutes ago, Stradling said:

We have no idea if this is Arte driven.  Sure he could have the voice, so does Eppler.  It is just as likely that Eppler, who is much more in tune with what is going on in the clubhouse, didn’t like what he saw and went to Arte with the decision to move on from Brad.  We already heard the issue with the communication between White and the pitchers, so that is a fireable offense.  We just don’t know and unless Eppler is fired, or resigns, we may never know.

Yes exactly.

And it is also possible that the private consensus was always that they would prefer Maddon if he ever became available.

[ten ocho recon scout]

3 minutes ago, Hubs said:

Except for Torri Hunter, Vernon Wells, Pujols and Wilson, Hamilton, etc.

 

Trouts new contract...

But to be fair, its been a long time since we nabbed the top guy. Pujols and hamilton were them... you can see why we stopped.

[angelsnationtalk]

I still have a gut feeling that things will change now that this is the first offseason where the future of Mike Trout isn't up in the air. Arte and Eppler now officially know that they can build around him without having to rush before he signs somewhere else. I think Eppler is a genius when it comes to drafting, waiver claims and trades. I also think he lacks in the free agency side (aside from Ohtani). This is where the willingness of Arte comes into play. With Trout locked down Eppler can still give his contract offers to various arms, but Arte can make sure it's done by financially backing it up knowing he's got Trout to lead the team.

As simple as it sounds I think this plays a significant role in the offseason plans this time around. 

Arte has a legitimate reason to spend more. 

[Hubs]

I expect another 2011 type winter to be honest. I think Arte understands that the Pujols contract didn't live up to the value, and neither did Hamilton. CJ Wilson had injuries.

That won't stop him from pursuing top of the class free agents. I also think there will be a pretty big shake up with the regulars. There will be trades.

The rotation needs help. They need a catcher with some offense. Upton could be on the move, but I doubt it. However, I thought they'd be fine with Aybar, and they traded for Simmons a few years back, so who knows.

 

[Claude]

1 minute ago, Taylor said:

The last time Arte "had enough" didn't go very well.

Arte is in a bind right now. Eppler’s plan isn’t producing fast enough for him and he’s losing leverage with the city of Anaheim with the lack of playoff revenue. Plus he’s in too deep on a few contracts that actually need to produce at a high level but we all know how that goes. It’s October and the best player in baseball is hunting, fishing, golfing and enjoying football season. 

Arte needs to drain the swamp. 

[Dtwncbad]

3 minutes ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

Trouts new contract...

But to be fair, its been a long time since we nabbed the top guy. Pujols and hamilton were them... you can see why we stopped.

Not to make this thread pivot fully to a Hamilton or Pujols thread. . .

But in the context of bad contracts, those tow don’t even come close to comparing in my opinion.

Pujols underperformed overall but he was never a cancer.  The team overpaid for his production.  The cost was some money.

Hamilton underperformed and then literally didn’t perform and was a distraction and disruption.  The cost was more than money.  It was money.  It was performance.  It was culture.  It was clubhouse.  It was brand damage.  It was humiliation to the owner.

The two really don’t belong in the same sentence.

[Stradling]

7 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

Yes exactly.

And it is also possible that the private consensus was always that they would prefer Maddon if he ever became available.

Which is totally possible and quite frankly probably the right call.  

[angelsnationtalk]

8 minutes ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

Trouts new contract...

But to be fair, its been a long time since we nabbed the top guy. Pujols and hamilton were them... you can see why we stopped.

I think we've stopped with handing out heavy longterm contracts to players 32 and over.

I doubt Arte is afraid to offer Cole a 7 year deal for a guy who will have his age 29 season next year...

Same goes for Zack Wheeler...

Those guys are just entering their prime, not exiting it.

[Claude]

14 minutes ago, ukyah said:

something that never seems to be said around here is that every year people start talking about how arte is going to expand the budget, "spend for the right player", and yet it never happens. i'm sure we'll bring in some pitching, but i'm the type to go with history. i predict the angels budget will end up extremely similar to where it always is.

I remember some posters (they know who they are) being excited about Major League Baseball raising the threshold. I think only a handful of teams took advantage of that. It’s a tough competitive business but it’s not a fair system. They actually need to implement a salary cap to keep teams like the Dodgers / Yankees under control.  

[Angel Oracle]

40 minutes ago, TBailey said:

I’m sure Arte has “had enough” as we all have as fans. As much as Eppler is to blame for the terrible free agent acquisitions, he is a huge reason why Trout wanted to stay imo. Trout speaks highly of Eppler. From a fan’s standpoint, I believe that Eppler is a big reason our club has had any hope over the last few seasons. 

Eppler has done some bad, but he’s also done some good. I’m not 100 percent that Eppler is on the hot seat with Arte. I believe that Eppler has “had enough” just as much as Arte has. Imho, I really believe that Eppler and Arte made this choice together. Again, that’s just my opinion.

They’ve “stayed the course” the last few seasons and this is the worst it’s gotten. I think Arte opens up the bank, throws big offers at multiple Free Agents in an effort to put this team back in the playoffs. 

I think if Maddon comes, a lot of other players will be coming too. It really does start at the top. And quite frankly, i don’t really think Ausmus had the personality to spark this team. Times have changed, and you need someone who’s a little bit “hip.” Regardless, we need someone who the players love playing for. Bottom line. Everything else will fall into place.

Here’s my prediction(s):

Joe Maddon

Gerrit Cole 

Odorizzi

Trade for #2/3 type.

I can see all but the last one, as the farm needs to be preserved as much as necessary.    Cole and one solid starter plus improved team health plus Maddon should = huge improvement over 2019, maybe WC contention in 2020, maybe.

 

[angelsnationtalk]

18 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

Yes exactly.

And it is also possible that the private consensus was always that they would prefer Maddon if he ever became available.

Plus he brings a reputation that players are attracted to. Maddon lets the players be themselves. That alone would make a player think "i'd love to play next to Trout while having a great coach like Joe Maddon."

[angelsnationtalk]

43 minutes ago, TBailey said:

I’m sure Arte has “had enough” as we all have as fans. As much as Eppler is to blame for the terrible free agent acquisitions, he is a huge reason why Trout wanted to stay imo. Trout speaks highly of Eppler. From a fan’s standpoint, I believe that Eppler is a big reason our club has had any hope over the last few seasons. 

Eppler has done some bad, but he’s also done some good. I’m not 100 percent that Eppler is on the hot seat with Arte. I believe that Eppler has “had enough” just as much as Arte has. Imho, I really believe that Eppler and Arte made this choice together. Again, that’s just my opinion.

They’ve “stayed the course” the last few seasons and this is the worst it’s gotten. I think Arte opens up the bank, throws big offers at multiple Free Agents in an effort to put this team back in the playoffs. 

I think if Maddon comes, a lot of other players will be coming too. It really does start at the top. And quite frankly, i don’t really think Ausmus had the personality to spark this team. Times have changed, and you need someone who’s a little bit “hip.” Regardless, we need someone who the players love playing for. Bottom line. Everything else will fall into place.

Here’s my prediction(s):

Joe Maddon

Gerrit Cole 

Odorizzi

Trade for #2/3 type.

To your point @Angel Oracle I've been thinking this plan all along as well. (instead of Odorizzi it's Wheeler)

But maybe the production of Fletcher would make Eppler think that money can be saved by trading Simmons. That could help us keep Adell. We'd only have to bite our tongues by saying bye to Marsh.

[ukyah]

24 minutes ago, Hubs said:

Except for Torri Hunter, Vernon Wells, Pujols and Wilson, Hamilton, etc.

 

i didn't say we don't sign FA. i said the payroll adds up to a very similar number year in and year out. we're always in the 178 range. my point was every year the same hopes arise, "arte, is going to open up the pocket book. he's had enough." i'm saying, history suggests otherwise. go with history.

[angelsnationtalk]

4 minutes ago, Calzone 2 said:

I remember some posters (they know who they are) being excited about Major League Baseball raising the threshold. I think only a handful of teams took advantage of that. It’s a tough competitive business but it’s not a fair system. They actually need to implement a salary cap to keep teams like the Dodgers / Yankees under control.  

I'd like to see the Angels this year raise their internal budget of $175M to around $190. Let Trout have some fun.

[Claude]

15 minutes ago, ukyah said:

i didn't say we don't sign FA. i said the payroll adds up to a very similar number year in and year out. we're always in the 178 range. my point was every year the same hopes arise, "arte, is going to open up the pocket book. he's had enough." i'm saying, history suggests otherwise. go with history.

He opens his wallet when someone comes off the books. When Hamilton was coming off the books he approved the trade for Upton. If Hamilton had another year on the books Upton wouldn’t be here. 

[TNAngelsFan71]

34 minutes ago, angelsnationtalk said:

I'd like to see the Angels this year raise their internal budget of $175M to around $190. Let Trout have some fun.

I would like to see this same graphic with a side by side of the angels opening day and end of season payrolls for comparison if anyone out there has that info.