Marcus Stroman

[Stradling]

Just now, RBM said:

Fixed. 

No way.  If I could have one or the other and if we are serious about contending then the money issue won’t be an issue, I will go with the higher ceiling guy.  They are both pitching in their age 28 season.  Boyd doesn’t have the track record.  Boyd is pitching in a pitcher friendly stadium or at the very least a neutral park, in the Central.  Stroman is pitching in a hitters wet dream of a ball park and in the East.  

[totdprods]

3 minutes ago, RBM said:

Fixed. 

Boyd is gonna cost more but I do think we match up there a lot better, enough to offset the difference in cost between he and Stroman and certainly Bauer.

[TroutField]

I don’t believe dealing away from the rotation to add to the rotation would be very wise at all. 

[totdprods]

9 minutes ago, TroutField said:

I don’t believe dealing away from the rotation to add to the rotation would be very wise at all. 

Very rarely (if ever?) are good SPs (with control) traded without quality pitching prospects going back. 

And it’s also pretty hard to say Barria (especially) or Suarez are in the rotation given they’ve made like a half dozen starts. Suarez is bumped when Cahill or Harvey are back. Ramirez too.

I’d like to see the Angels trade for one and sign one by the start of next season. Even if we lose one SP prospect, we will be in great shape and there’s considerable help not far away. 

Edited June 20, 2019 by totdprods

[UndertheHalo]

I suspect that the Angels would have to give up Soriano + or Chris Rodriguez and Barria (if the Jays wanted to roll the dice on massive upside) to land Stroman.  Probably Soriano.  It’s a tough call.  Soriano is starting to get a ton of buzz. 

[UndertheHalo]

9 minutes ago, RBM said:

I wouldn't do that for one year of control.

Stroman is a top of the rotation type and by the time Soriano or Rodriguez may be ready to join the Angels it’s hard to know what the team will look like.  It’s possible that Simmons isn’t with the team or is starting to become a less effective bat.  And the same is true with Upton.  

I 100% agree it’s a tough call but the Angels really can’t afford to punt any more with this group.  You have to pay the price for good players.  I’d love to get Cole and the Angels need to go hard after him but it’s not really something the Angels can bank on.  And the truth is that they probably won’t get him.  That’s just the thing you have to assume.  Landing Stroman would be a huge deal for the team. 

It’s a tough call.  I honestly am not sure what I’d do. 

Edited June 20, 2019 by UndertheHalo

[floplag]

I know some wont like this comment, but I think the rotation needs a leader, not just more depth or youth.   That doesnt mean an old vet just someone with a resume of achievement.  Bauer for example all star, cy votes, actual post season experience even if it wasnt all awesome.  Stroman maybe as hes been in the cy voting and won a GG while pitching in the much tougher east.  Boyd... not so much.   Thats not knocking him, at all, its just that i think we need something more. 

[Angel Oracle]

3 hours ago, Jay said:

Angels should not be trading their pitching prospects.

Bundle up some of these surplus position players to get more pitching.

I would absolutely be shopping LaStella, Calhoun.

 

This

Anyway, both Toronto and Detroit are even more desperate for hitting than for pitching.   That's where the Halos may match up, with their position player prospects not named Adell. 

 

[Inside Pitch]

2 hours ago, totdprods said:

Both have pitched a little better than their ERA/record reflects. They're fine heading up the back of the rotation. 

Still think it'd be worth shopping Skaggs this July though, especially if he reels off a few more good starts and the Angels slip from WC. 

Heaney got a lot of love from people here based on K totals early on.   Since he's started facing teams other than the top two K machines in MLB those have evaporated.  It's hard to argue that he's been unlucky or pitched better than his ERA IMHO when you see him sporting a .211 BABIP, and a FIP of 5.54 .vs a real ERA of 5.68 -- he's essentially pitched to his peripherals.  To date the HRs are no less a problem for him than they have been for Cahill but people seem to wave it off.  Yes, he's not received a lot of help from the pitchers that have followed him, but his LOB% is better than both Skaggs, and Cahill, it's not like he's alone there..   

I'd argue that last night was a particular bad game and that it happens, but those early K totals masked some of his issues early on.  Personally I think it's a case of what he's doing .vs what he's capable of ...  the dude is posting a career worst GB% (26.6% .vs 39.2% career), in the era of launch angles and HRs -- it's a recipe for disaster.  I don't know if it's because he's essentially been a two pitch guy all year but he clearly needs to work his change into the mix to try to keep hitters from teeing off on his FB.   I'm betting on him to get better but he's got to fix a few things.

[Duren, Duren]

Stroman knows he is gone from Toronto. You can hear it in every interview. He has become very cynical about "the business of baseball" and has a defeatist attitude on their current team. 

But he would still be a risky acquisition if the cost was too high. The Jays know he is one of their few youngish veteran assets with a decent track record and is better than his recent stats. In Toronto he is a big name, and they will leverage him to the max, hoping a contender overpays. Probably at the deadline.

That said, he would be a strong addition every five days. On a team with much better defense his numbers will improve quickly. But not sure the Angels are ready for a long term commitment. 

[floplag]

34 minutes ago, RBM said:

Agreed. Gerrit Cole would be an ideal #1 in 2020.

i have a grander plan.  Go get Bauer now if you can then sign Cole
If thats the direction were going to go then go big.... though im not sure about other spots as there wont be much left to file other needs. 

[totdprods]

1 hour ago, UndertheHalo said:

Stroman is a top of the rotation type and by the time Soriano or Rodriguez may be ready to join the Angels it’s hard to know what the team will look like.  It’s possible that Simmons isn’t with the team or is starting to become a less effective bat.  And the same is true with Upton.  

I 100% agree it’s a tough call but the Angels really can’t afford to punt any more with this group.  You have to pay the price for good players.  I’d love to get Cole and the Angels need to go hard after him but it’s not really something the Angels can bank on.  And the truth is that they probably won’t get him.  That’s just the thing you have to assume.  Landing Stroman would be a huge deal for the team. 

It’s a tough call.  I honestly am not sure what I’d do. 

Well said, and this here is the biggest reason I want to see the Halos swing a trade either this July or this offseason for a very good mid-rotation (or better) SP in addition to whomever they pursue in free agency. 

There is no guarantee you'll get the guy you want, especially at a price you want, in free agency. The Angels will have money to spend, and no doubt, they'll look into Cole - as well as any number of other FA SPs - Wheeler, Ryu, Odorizzi, Wacha, Bumgarner, Wood, Gibson, all the way down to guys like Pineda, Gio, Porcello, Roark, Chacin. If you swing a trade now or very soon, you're guaranteeing yourself a good addition and an expected quality to the rotation, and leaving room for an addition in free agency with the ability to be flexible. If you land someone like Bauer, you might not need to put all your efforts into signing Cole - someone like Roark or Gibson might be more acceptable now. You're buying yourself leverage and breathing room. If Cole's price gets too high, and you already have Stroman or Bauer set for 2020, you can look at someone much cheaper, like Wheeler. 

The next few months are a great opportunity for the Angels to add two SPs to their rotation which will already gain Ohtani back next year. Skaggs will be a FA after next year, and there's no guarantee we'll keep him around. Even if a trade costs you one of Barria, Suarez, and Sandoval, you've added Canning already, and it won't be long before Madero, Bradish, Castillo, Hernandez, Soriano, Yan are in the mix. Remember, Suarez and Barria moved from A+ to AAA in one season. Eppler moves these guys quick and challenges them. Kyle Bradish and Aaron Hernandez might be making MLB starts in 2020 if needed. Soriano and Yan might be on the MLB depth chart as early as 2020 mid/late season. With that in mind, it makes it a lot easier for me to consider moving one of Barria, Suarez, or Sandoval now - guys who are not yet entrenched in the MLB rotation - for a guy who will be, like Boyd, Bauer, Stroman, etc.

Edited June 20, 2019 by totdprods

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

3 hours ago, Glen said:

There's no way anyone wants to be traded to the Angels. That's unpossible.

Our lineup and defense are top shelf. lt's our SP that is the problem. Any SP worth his pay should be happy to pitch for us, especially with Ohtani returning to the mound next year.

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

3 hours ago, Stradling said:

Cole

Ohtani

Stroman

Canning

Skaggs

Heaney

l really hope Ohtani returns to pre-TJ surgery shape next season, not all pitchers do.

[jsnpritchett]

1 hour ago, totdprods said:

The next few months are a great opportunity for the Angels to add two SPs to their rotation which will already gain Ohtani back next year. Skaggs will be a FA after next year, and there's no guarantee we'll keep him around.

I'm perfectly fine if they don't keep him around.

[totdprods]

3 hours ago, RBM said:

I wouldn't do that for one year of control.

I really doubt Billy Eppler, the GM who is as stingy as can be with dealing prospects, the GM who convinced Ohtani to sign here and Trout to sign an extension, the GM who gave Harvey, Cahill, and Allen nearly $30m, would trade for a short-term rental like Stroman, who just raved about Trout, without feeling pretty confident his chances signing that rental to an extension.

Be it Bauer, Bumgarner, Stroman, Ray...if Eppler swings a deal for someone, I’d feel pretty good about it being beneficial longterm and not just a rental, unless he paid a pure rental price. Especially in a year like this where the Angels aren’t clearly competing.

[floplag]

Just now, totdprods said:

I really doubt Billy Eppler, the GM who is as stingy as can be with dealing prospects, the GM who convinced Ohtani to sign here and Trout to sign an extension, the GM who gave Harvey, Cahill, and Allen nearly $30m, would trade for a short-term rental like Stroman, who just raved about Trout, without feeling pretty confident his chances signing that rental to an extension.

Be it Bauer, Bumgarner, Stroman, Ray...if Eppler swings a deal for someone, I’d feel pretty good about it being beneficial longterm and not just a rental, unless he paid a pure rental price. Especially in a year like this where the Angels aren’t clearly competing.

Inst Bumgardner one of those "F the DH" types?  

[totdprods]

4 minutes ago, floplag said:

Inst Bumgardner one of those "F the DH" types?  

If there was any AL team that would be willing to let him hit as a PH, or when he starts, or even as an occasional DH...wouldn’t it be the Angels?

Bumgarner is pretty low on my list. My gut tells me he’s gonna sign with Atlanta this offseason. They need a vet like him, who can either lead a staff or gracefully transition to the wily vet, and he grew up a Braves/Maddox fan. If we were in clear running for a playoff spot, I’d feel a little differently, just to try and catch some of his postseason magic, even if only as a rental. Yankees or Astros make all the sense in the world for him as a rental trade target.

Edited June 20, 2019 by totdprods

[floplag]

1 minute ago, RBM said:

I would hope there were some assurances in place but I’m just not as high on Stroman as some of you guys are. I would trade for and extend Bauer or Bumgarner. 

This is where i am as well.  Thats nothing against Stroman, its more about needing someone the kids will look up to and respect. 

[Lou]

Suddenly, I'm ok with giving up Suarez for Stroman

[ten ocho recon scout]

9 hours ago, jsnpritchett said:

Is Stroman?

Hes the sausage king of chicago, for one thing.

[Chuck]

4 hours ago, Lou said:

Suddenly, I'm ok with giving up Suarez for Stroman

I was before tonight's outing. 

Suarez and Ausmus for Stroman. 

Git-R-Done.

[Lou]

"The Tigers are reportedly willing to listen to offers on breakout lefty Matthew Boyd, but Jason Beck of MLB.com reports that the team has unsurprisingly placed a sky-high asking price on the southpaw. Beck cites the four-player packagesent by the Cubs to the White Sox in the Jose Quintanablockbuster in 2017 as a point of comparison in describing Detroit’s early ask. That package was headlined by Eloy Jimenezand top pitching prospect Dylan Cease. If the Tigers are to deal Boyd, it seems they’d need multiple high-end prospects to headline any deal"

[Taylor]

Quintanablockbuster?