The Official 2017-2018 Anaheim Ducks Thread

[UndertheHalo]

Probably for the best that the last week of Ducks hockey has been lost on AW.

Fuck Bob Murray. 

Fuck Randy Carlyle.

 

[gotbeer]

Ducks sucked so hard, it brought down AW.com.  

[nate]

I still don't understand what Murray could really have done.

Eaves gets a phantom disease and Kesler is coming off of injury.

The problem is RC, Murray built the team he wanted.

Now, you can blame Murray for hiring RC and I accept that.

[gotbeer]

1 hour ago, nate said:

I still don't understand what Murray could really have done.

Eaves gets a phantom disease and Kesler is coming off of injury.

The problem is RC, Murray built the team he wanted.

Now, you can blame Murray for hiring RC and I accept that.

I'm fine with Murray.  Trade wise, sure he dumpster dives.  But Eaves was a really good get before coming on with a rare disease.   Henrique is just money.  I think he got Kesler in a trade.  Draft wise, I don't think we can really question his teams record.  

I think the biggest mistake he made was not having Bieska waive his NTC and trading away Theodore.  

But RC and his style just is wearing thin.  We need to go a different direction.  Because we have the talent to be an elite team.  Just not the scheme.

[nate]

From everything I have read, Bieksa waiving his NTC was not going to happen.  They couldn't get assurances that LV wouldn't take him.

The mistake was signing Bieksa, and Stoner at all.

The Ducks ability to draft well really screwed them in the expansion draft, they just couldn't protect everyone.

To me, the biggest issues with the team were:

1) RC

2) Perry

3) Lack of speed

4) Forward play overall

[deepdrive]

So, what is Perry costing us per year (salary - buyout)? A little over 2 million a year? He's getting close to not being worth that. 3 years left. It will be interesting to see how long he lasts. Kind of says something about Samuli's desire to win. We'll see.

[deepdrive]

44 minutes ago, nate said:

From everything I have read, Bieksa waiving his NTC was not going to happen.  They couldn't get assurances that LV wouldn't take him.

The mistake was signing Bieksa, and Stoner at all.

The Ducks ability to draft well really screwed them in the expansion draft, they just couldn't protect everyone.

To me, the biggest issues with the team were:

1) RC

2) Perry

3) Lack of speed

4) Forward play overall

I would add lack of over all natural talent. 

I wonder if BM's response to this playoff loss will be to emulate SJ. By that, l mean get talented 20 goal scorers on all 4 lines. And not paired with slugs like Ritchie. We have the centers. We need to dump Perry, Ritchie, Vermette, Silfverberg and make a good decision about Eaves going forward.

[gotbeer]

1 hour ago, deepdrive said:

So, what is Perry costing us per year (salary - buyout)? A little over 2 million a year? He's getting close to not being worth that. 3 years left. It will be interesting to see how long he lasts. Kind of says something about Samuli's desire to win. We'll see.

Buyout Details

SEASON	SALARY	INITIAL CAP HIT	ACTUAL COST	SAVINGS	BUYOUT CAP HIT
2018-19	$6,500,000	$8,625,000	$2,055,556	$4,444,444	$4,180,556
2019-20	$8,000,000	$8,625,000	$2,055,556	$5,944,444	$2,680,556
2020-21	$4,000,000	$8,625,000	$2,055,556	$1,944,444	$6,680,556
2021-22	$0	$0	$2,055,556	-$2,055,556	$2,055,556
2022-23	$0	$0	$2,055,556	-$2,055,556	$2,055,556
2023-24	$0	$0	$2,055,556	-$2,055,556	$2,055,556

 

And if we buy him out after next year.

SEASON	SALARY	INITIAL CAP HIT	ACTUAL COST	SAVINGS	BUYOUT CAP HIT
2019-20	$8,000,000	$8,625,000	$2,000,000	$6,000,000	$2,625,000
2020-21	$4,000,000	$8,625,000	$2,000,000	$2,000,000	$6,625,000
2021-22	$0	$0	$2,000,000	-$2,000,000	$2,000,000
2022-23	$0	$0	$2,000,000	-$2,000,000	$2,000,000

 

Last column is the cap hit for that year.  While he has a NMC.  At least in the NHL, we see that as a non issue.  I wonder if some team that needs to hit the salary cap floor will trade for him?  Kind of like what Detroit was doing with Arizona.  Arizona still has plenty of cap space left.  

[Thomas]

When both So-Cal teams are down 0-3 in their playoff series #HooliganHockey #LAKings https://t.co/bbbLg5cSxq pic.twitter.com/sJDaPgB2bx

— Hooligan Hockey (@HooliganHockey) April 17, 2018

[UndertheHalo]

I don’t understand the reluctance to hold Bob Murray to account.  The guy has been in the GM chair for almost 10 years.  Most of those years he’s had enviable amounts of talent.   Including a generational type in Getzlaf.  How many GM’s have traded a William Karlsson for peanuts ? He trades a 2nd round pick essentially for Patrick Eaves last year.   A 2nd rounder this year netted the Sharks Evander Kane.  He is ill suited for building a championship winner.  He should have traded Vatanen 2 years ago.  He didn’t and cost us Theodore.  At least that.  Who knows what would have been different if we had another player in those play off runs.  I could go on and on.  His track record is not good.  The issue is the sum of errors.  He’s made tons of them and he’s failed to deliver a champion when by all accounts the Ducks had the talent for one.  Now the teams great talent is aging out and that’s it.  It now or never with Getzlaf.  I have no confidence in waiting for Bob Murray to figure it out.  He hasn’t and there’s no reason to believe he will.  You guys are all happy to blame Carlyle.  CARLYLE IS BOB MURRAYS GUY.  He’s to blame for that failure as well.  Enough is enough.  Bob built his team and it wasn’t good enough.  Time for new blood. 

Edited April 17, 2018 by UndertheHalo

[UndertheHalo]

And maybe it’s time for Getzlaf to lose the C. The Ducks need a massive shake up. 

[gotbeer]

19 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

I don’t understand the reluctance to hold Bob Murray to account.  The guy has been in the GM chair for almost 10 years.  Most of those years he’s had enviable amounts of talent.   Including a generational type in Getzlaf.  How many GM’s have traded a William Karlsson for peanuts ? He trades a 2nd round pick essentially for Patrick Eaves last year.   A 2nd rounder this year netted the Sharks Evander Kane.  He is ill suited for building a championship winner.  He should have traded Vatanen 2 years ago.  He didn’t and cost us Theodore.  At least that.  Who knows what would have been different if we had another player in those play off runs.  I could go on and on.  His track record is not good.  The issue is the sum of errors.  He’s made tons of them and he’s failed to deliver a champion when by all accounts the Ducks had the talent for one.  Now the teams great talent is aging out and that’s it.  It now or never with Getzlaf.  I have no confidence in waiting for Bob Murray to figure it out.  He hasn’t and there’s no reason to believe he will.  You guys are all happy to blame Carlyle.  CARLYLE IS BOB MURRAYS GUY.  He’s to blame for that failure as well.  Enough is enough.  Bob built his team and it wasn’t good enough.  Time for new blood. 

How do you blame Bob Murray for Bruce "I make no adjustments, first round exit" Boudreau?  He built the teams, and really good ones.  And once they got in the playoffs, they just were mismanaged.  Again, with all the injuries, we finished second in the division.  But the playoffs have been a disaster.  And again, you can probably point to the coach and lack of strategy and adjustments.  Maybe you can point to Murray for the coaching choices, but to say he has mismanaged the team is pretty wild.  

And let's not forget that William Karlsson did crap after we traded him to Columbus.  So much so, that the Blue Jackets traded a first rounder, a second rounder and a player so that the Knights would take Karlsson.  Yes, he's had a great season with the Knights.  But to blame Murray for trading Karlsson is a bit much.  

As far as Vatanen.  The big problem with him, was he was hurt this offseason.  So while I'm sure we wanted to trade him before the expansion draft.  You would then complain that we traded Vatanen for peanuts, if we traded him in the condition he was.  Because no team would take that big of a gamble.  Instead we got Henrique for him after he got healthy, which was a win win for both teams.  And remember, the reason why we kept Vatanen instead of trading him 2 years ago, was to make another run at the cup.  Which Bruce fubared.  And at least last year we got to the conference championships.

And about Eaves.  He was money last year.  You can't blame the GM when a player comes down with a rare neurological disease.  Sure the Sharks got Kane.  But I would say, as contributions go, Eaves put up as much as Kane.  And if the Sharks get dumped by the Knights, the Sharks might have to go pretty big on Kane contract wise, and make that second a first.  And if during the new contract, another rape allegation comes out, then the Sharks won't look that great.  

[nate]

Yeah, absolutely ridiculous to blame him for Karlsson.  In ten years the Ducks won a cup and went deep in the playoffs a few times.

While they had ridiculous talent, the Blackhawks and Kings had better talent.

My biggest problem with BM is that he re-hired RC.

[UndertheHalo]

Ok.  Lol.  I’ll have a point by point rebuttal to this later.  Bob Murray DID NOT win a cup.  And I do blame Bob Murray for Karlsson because it’s not just Karlsson.  It’s mistake after mistake after mistake.  Karlsson did not produce.  You are correct.  But consider the guys we kept around instead.  Its maybe not egregious but like I said.  Its about the sum of transactions that have gone south with Bob.  It’s just another one on the heap of fuck ups.  And you guys act like the expansion draft snuck up on him.  Bob Murray should have traded Vatanen at least 2 years ago.  He wasn’t hurt that entire time.  Bob rolled the dice because he wanted a better deal and he got fucked.  The end.  That’s exactly what happened.  Anyway.  I’ll enjoy this debate ! lol. 

And perhaps the worst mistake he made was getting rid of Boudreau.  The Kings and Blackhawks made significant in season acquisitions.  The Ducks never do shit.  

Edited April 17, 2018 by UndertheHalo

[nate]

Lol, Wild Bill came out of nowhere, LV took him only because they got picks.  Any team in the league could have had him for nothing, he is a total anomaly, and he's going to get paid a ton and probably only score like 15 goals next year.

Ducks have made a move every year around the deadline for a forward.  Eaves, Perron, and the guy from Buffalo.

[tennischmp]

It's more of the type of players BM is targeting when building the team, focusing more on size and grit rather than speed and hockey IQ. That goes hand in hand with dump and chase they play which is obviously not working. 

[gotbeer]

When you look at the last 5 years.

This year, we are just getting run out of the playoffs.

2016-2017  We reached the conference finals.  And met Kryptonite.

2015-2016  had a 3-2 series lead.  And couldn't get it done, due to coaching not making adjustments.

2014-2015 had a 3-2 series lead in the conference finals against the hawks.  And just got out coached big time.  Should have won it all, but the Hawks did.

2013-2014  Finished with 116 points.  And couldn't get by the Kings in round 2.  And if I remember right, we had a 3-2 series lead in that one also.   Kings won it all.

2012-2013  Guess it was  a strike shortened season, and we lost to the Wings in the first round, with a 3-2 series lead.  

I still don't see how it's Murray's fault in not putting together a good team.  In 2014, we should have won it all.  But got outcoached.  In 2015, we should have won it all.  But got outcoached.  In 2016 we should have made it out of the first at least, and got outcoached.  2017 at least we made it to the conference finals but got stonewalled by Pikachu.  This year, we are getting run out.  But the injuries at the beginning, and the unlucky injury at the end really made even making the playoffs kind of remarkable.  And I don't know if we would have fared better with him in the lineup, but it shows how important Fowler is to this D.  

[tennischmp]

22 minutes ago, gotbeer said:

When you look at the last 5 years.

This year, we are just getting run out of the playoffs.

2016-2017  We reached the conference finals.  And met Kryptonite.

2015-2016  had a 3-2 series lead.  And couldn't get it done, due to coaching not making adjustments.

2014-2015 had a 3-2 series lead in the conference finals against the hawks.  And just got out coached big time.  Should have won it all, but the Hawks did.

2013-2014  Finished with 116 points.  And couldn't get by the Kings in round 2.  And if I remember right, we had a 3-2 series lead in that one also.   Kings won it all.

2012-2013  Guess it was  a strike shortened season, and we lost to the Wings in the first round, with a 3-2 series lead.  

I still don't see how it's Murray's fault in not putting together a good team.  In 2014, we should have won it all.  But got outcoached.  In 2015, we should have won it all.  But got outcoached.  In 2016 we should have made it out of the first at least, and got outcoached.  2017 at least we made it to the conference finals but got stonewalled by Pikachu.  This year, we are getting run out.  But the injuries at the beginning, and the unlucky injury at the end really made even making the playoffs kind of remarkable.  And I don't know if we would have fared better with him in the lineup, but it shows how important Fowler is to this D.  

I could understand the coach argument if it was just 1 coach, but it wasn't just 1 we are on #2 already. When does it turn from outcoached to outplayed?

[UndertheHalo]

2 minutes ago, tennischmp said:

I could understand the coach argument if it was just 1 coach, but it wasn't just 1 we are on #2 already. When does it turn from outcoached to outplayed?

It was also Boudreau’s fault. 

[tennischmp]

9 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

It was also Boudreau’s fault. 

It may have been but my point is we have had 2 coaches already with similar results while the GM and the core players have remained constant

[UndertheHalo]

34 minutes ago, tennischmp said:

It may have been but my point is we have had 2 coaches already with similar results while the GM and the core players have remained constant

My phone is retarded I meant to post more then that.  No, I’m with you man.  Look Boudreau was imperfect but I don’t think he’s a primary reason why the Ducks lost in his years.  Carlyle I think we all agree plays a style of hockey that has issues being effective with the prevalent speed in all zones type of game being played now.  But even he I don’t think is a main cause of the Ducks problems.  After all, it’s no secret what kind of style Randy Carlyle is going to play.  He was brought back to implement the dump and chase game that he always has his teams play.  That is Bobs fault.  This is why I don’t understand the fervent impulse to blame him above all else in Ducks land.  

The chief problem among a myriad of them is Bob Murray.

Edited April 18, 2018 by UndertheHalo

[gotbeer]

10 hours ago, UndertheHalo said:

My phone is retarded I meant to post more then that.  No, I’m with you man.  Look Boudreau was imperfect but I don’t think he’s a primary reason why the Ducks lost in his years.  Carlyle I think we all agree plays a style of hockey that has issues being effective with the prevalent speed in all zones type of game being played now.  But even he I don’t think is a main cause of the Ducks problems.  After all, it’s no secret what kind of style Randy Carlyle is going to play.  He was brought back to implement the dump and chase game that he always has his teams play.  That is Bobs fault.  This is why I don’t understand the fervent impulse to blame him above all else in Ducks land.  

The chief problem among a myriad of them is Bob Murray.

I agree that the hiring of the coach is the blame of Murray.  But him not putting together a team that can compete does not fall on him.  He has put out very competitive teams that should have done much better than they have.  

[fan_since79]

According to ESPN, tonight's do-or-die Ducks game will be broadcast on the Golf Channel.

The Golf Channel?!

WTH?

 

[gotbeer]

I don't know why I'm bothering with tonights pain.  Oh well, bring it on.  

It's close to Go Vegas Go.  

[gotbeer]

Whenever Corey Perry talks about what they have to do.  I want to punch him in the face.