Scioscia: "We need a guy in the ninth inning that's going to hold leads"

[Oz27]

12 minutes ago, tomsred said:

Well, if we use ERA, he has a 6.45 ERA.  That's kind of meaningless in a way too, once you have blown a save what does it matter how many extra runs score?  So what's the best way of measuring a closer's effectiveness?  I was just going on what the media brings up all the time, save percentage.  Actually, career wise, Street is number 5 on the all time list for those with at least 300 saves, but that's a career number.  Until we focus on what players do over a much shorter near term period, both in hitting and pitching, career numbers mean little.  I'm the guy who would like the Stadium scoreboard to post averages and stats for the past 30 days instead of for the full season, but that's a pipe dream, it will never happen in the slow to change baseball world.

 

Oh, by the way, if he were 12/12 on saves as a closer, no matter what his ERA is, this thread wouldn't exist.  Another way I look at it is that he has only had 12 save opportunities, that may not be enough to remain sharp on his command.  I'm not making excuses for him, just stating possible problems.

The whole 'save' stat is silly and baseball would be richer for it not existing. Every other stat (WHIP, FIP, xFIP, ERA...anything you can come up with really) says Street has been really bad. In his last 16 games Street has a 1.040 OPS allowed and a 6.43 ERA - and those stats don't even include today (I was too lazy to recalculate). He's given up a hit in all but four of those outings and has as many walks as strikeouts in that time. Two of the blown saves this year have been three run leads, something that is really hard to do. But looking at anything in the context of saves, a completely silly stat, doesn't give you a true reflection (again, see Rodney). Everything else says he has been horrifically bad for awhile now.

[Second Base]

Sam Miller put it really well when asked about Scioscia. This is paraphrasing a bit, but he said that Scioscia understands media needs sound bites and quotes and he actively works with them to frame his answers in a way that the media can use. 

Really what he's doing, is trying to talk without saying anything.

[Sciosciapath]

1 hour ago, hangin n wangin said:

I am not sure if any other manager in baseball would keep street in as a closer at this point, especially with someone throwing the ball as good as Bed Rock. Scioscia is a stubborn mule. 

Saint louis booted rosenthal. Houston booted gregerson. Texas booted Tolleson. Washington traded for melancon and probably were going to put Kelley in the role if that didn't happen. 

Scioscia likes veterans. Regardless if they throw 88 MPH and have a 6.45 ERA. 

But if you think of it in the long run, stuff like this helps us get a better draft pick.

so true.  remember how long it took Scioscia to demote Rodney when he was blowing games left and right in 2011?

[Billy_Ball]

Jordan Walden...clap, clap, clap, clap, clap.........

[OregonLAA]

6.45

[Troll Daddy]

7 hours ago, hangin n wangin said:

I am not sure if any other manager in baseball would keep street in as a closer at this point, especially with someone throwing the ball as good as Bed Rock. Scioscia is a stubborn mule. 

Saint louis booted rosenthal. Houston booted gregerson. Texas booted Tolleson. Washington traded for melancon and probably were going to put Kelley in the role if that didn't happen. 

Scioscia likes veterans. Regardless if they throw 88 MPH and have a 6.45 ERA. 

But if you think of it in the long run, stuff like this helps us get a better draft pick.

All three teams you mentioned are playoff contenders. 

[Troll Daddy]

I haven't heard Dipoto's named mentioned yet.

[Waybackman]

25 minutes ago, shine said:

I have been saying it for years. I'm not sure if Scioscia is really trying to win.

One thing I know for sure is that trying to figure out Scioscia is an exercise in futility. Yesterday was a classic example. O.k., put Street in. He was fine in his previous game. But when he walks the leadoff batter and the next one gets a hit, and he doesn't immediately have anyone else warming up‽ It defies any rational explanation. 

[Angel Oracle]

To be fair, he struck out the next two batters, granted bottom of the order guys.    Those pitches though to Pedroia and Bogearts absolutely reeked. 

[John Stellman]

Dah!!!

[ten ocho recon scout]

On 8/1/2016 at 7:33 AM, Troll Daddy said:

All three teams you mentioned are playoff contenders. 

Not only that, but have more depth.

I have no problem replacing street with bedrosian. It's just that I see us then having a new issue in innings 6-8. Especially with smith gone too

[Oz27]

16 minutes ago, hangin n wangin said:

Scioscia says he needs someone to hold leads in the 9th inning. He has a guy with a 0.92 ERA that can pitch in the 9th. 

He says he's going to go with a closer by committee.

Weird.

Yeah but he's not "experienced" enough for that, or something.

Seriously though, just give Bedrosian the damn ball. How much more does he need to do to show that he's really really good?

[tomsred]

3 hours ago, Oz27 said:

Yeah but he's not "experienced" enough for that, or something.

Seriously though, just give Bedrosian the damn ball. How much more does he need to do to show that he's really really good?

....uh, more than one save against a last place team?

[Oz27]

4 minutes ago, tomsred said:

....uh, more than one save against a last place team?

I would urge you to read this - http://grantland.com/the-triangle/blowing-up-baseballs-most-dangerous-stat/

[tomsred]

I wasn't referring to what he's done in a general bullpen role, I was responding to his performance as a closer and becoming a "really, really good" one.  Of course he been terrific as a relief pitcher this year.  Closing can be really, really hard though.  A real test will be when he gets rocked and blows a save, and it will happen.  Will he become more defensive, or let it bother him in some way.  I think he has good makeup, but he's inexperienced in the closer role.  Let's hope he can keep this up and responds well when rocked.  What's not to like about him as we sit here tonight?

 

By the way, what do we do with Street when he returns?  Or maybe he will sit out the remainder of the year?  I agree with some other posters that the Angels were probably trying to trade him.  If you don't put him in a role where you can showcase him, how will he ever get traded?  We're probably screwed on that front now.

[Oz27]

8 minutes ago, tomsred said:

I wasn't referring to what he's done in a general bullpen role, I was responding to his performance as a closer and becoming a "really, really good" one.  Of course he been terrific as a relief pitcher this year.  Closing can be really, really hard though.  A real test will be when he gets rocked and blows a save, and it will happen.  Will he become more defensive, or let it bother him in some way.  I think he has good makeup, but he's inexperienced in the closer role.  Let's hope he can keep this up and responds well when rocked.  What's not to like about him as we sit here tonight?

 

By the way, what do we do with Street when he returns?  Or maybe he will sit out the remainder of the year?  I agree with some other posters that the Angels were probably trying to trade him.  If you don't put him in a role where you can showcase him, how will he ever get traded?  We're probably screwed on that front now.

Street can't realistically be traded until he does anything to show he isn't downright terrible. He would go unclaimed on waivers now - that is nobody would take his contract off our hands even if they had to give up nothing in return. Scioscia will throw him straight back into the closer role when he comes back, that seems rather inevitable. But being a closer should really be no more of a showcase than any other situation. It's pitching, it doesn't matter which inning it is. Teams value good pitching regardless of whether the team that guy happens to be playing for is using that person in the sixth or the ninth.

[Inside Pitch]

On 8/1/2016 at 4:10 AM, Sciosciapath said:

so true.  remember how long it took Scioscia to demote Rodney when he was blowing games left and right in 2011?

So stupid....    http://www.espn.com/mlb/news/story?id=6297223

From the article:

"It took all of four games for the Los Angeles Angels to make a radical change in their bullpen. Fernando Rodney was replaced as the team's closer by rookie Jordan Walden, Angels manager Mike Scioscia announced before Tuesday's game in Tampa Bay."

Good talk...

[mauijim3]

Hmmm.  "The Los Angeles Angels announced Tuesday they placed closer Huston Street on the disabled list with inflammation in his right knee."

Chance for Scioscia to stay the Street is still the closer but have a way to see other guys in the role?

[arch stanton]

It's fairly plausible that he's really hurting. His location is terrible and his fastball is lacking movement. It's possible he tweaked his knee favoring the groin strain he had earlier. Either way, by not anointing a full time closer he creates a sense of competition but at the same time keeps the pressure to a minimum. And as a cherry on top we get to watch the board implode when he uses Salas in the 9th inning of a 1 run game.

[Lou]

On August 2, 2016 at 8:01 PM, Oz27 said:

Yeah but he's not "experienced" enough for that, or something.

Seriously though, just give Bedrosian the damn ball. How much more does he need to do to show that he's really really good?

 

22 hours ago, hangin n wangin said:

I think he's done more than enough to earn the role, even before street went down with the knee injury. Dude has been flat out dominant.

 

i agree 

[Oz27]

Just now, Lou said:

 

 

i agree 

Yeah, one game really disproved that. FFS.

Prior to tonight, Bedrosian had gone 25 games without earning an earned run. That's the fifth longest streak in Angels history and fourth longest in the majors this year. But he had a bad game, so let's cut him.

[Lou]

lol you might want to consider decaf 

[Troll Daddy]

The pressure of the ninth is real. 

[zenmaster]

Even Mariano Rivera blew over 70 saves in his career. And Goose Gossage blew 112 saves to his 310 successful saves.

[arch stanton]

You can't really compare anyone before Eckersly. Gossage often entered the game in the 7th and finished it.