Angels-Phillies discussing trade...

[Inside Pitch]

Wasn't it Alex Meyers from the Nats for Denard Span?

 

You may be right...  Both of them were moved same season.

Edit: they traded Trevor May and Vance Worley for Revere.  So a MLB pitcher and a prospect..   Not sure if thats worse or not.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Inside Pitch

[Inside Pitch]

Just what we need: another low OBP player.

 

Revere has speed, which is nice, considering that Trout is the only Angel with more than 2 SB. But his lifetime line of .289/.322/.340 leaves much to be desires, especially of a leadoff man.

 

One of my critiques of Jerry is that he seems to undervalue OBP. sure, the .290ish BA and 40+ SB a year is sexy, but all things being equal I'd rather see him go after a .270 hitter with a .350 OBP.

 

AJ you seen the Angels walk rate in May?  Lowest in all of baseball, sub 5%.   I don't get how a saber leaning GM doesn't look at that and is okay with it.

[Chuck]

Speaking of Tyler DeLoach: In 59 games appeared in, 45 starts, DeLoach has struck out 296 batters over 274 1/3 innings, while holding opposing batters to a .202 BAA. his ERA over that span is 3.08, with a solid 1.14 WHIP career.

 

This season he hasn't missed a beat, boasting a 2.00 ERA, 0.91 WHIP and holding opposing batters to a .196 BAA.

 

What's NOT to like about DeLoach? He doesn't throw 98 MPH with movement like Richards, but he's around 89-93 MPH with his fastball, has average to above average secondary stuff. 

[SoWhat]

I think we're seeing a lot of knee-jerk reactions here and there are a few things to point out.

1. Ben Revere is BETTER than Matt Joyce. He hits for a higher average, plays better defense and gives the Angels some much needed speed. You can complain all you want about his lack of power or OBP but he's am above average player in his physical prime making a reasonably low salary.

2. The trade market is EXPENSIVE. They aren't buying a slim jim from the dollar store, they're buying an organic grass fed beef stick from Whole Foods. When you trade, especially this time of year, you overpay. Remember how much getting Street from the Padres cost? How about a few offseasons ago when we acquired Iannetta? It cost Chatwood, who was a former top prospect and held his own in the majors at a young age. He was brilliant in Colorado, but injuries happen.

Something between those two is essentially the price Revere rightfully should be. The Phillies probably ask for Tropeano and Bedrosian. Angels counter with Jeremy Rhoades, plus a RP with upside like Danny Reynolds. The middle point that may work for both sides might be a lottery ticket Victor Alcantara and one if our solid lefties like Nate Smith.

Reasonably, that's two of our top 10 prospects. Amaro us notorious for jacking up the prices in everything because as I said of many GM's, he's an egomaniac, he might decline, but I doubt they get a better offer than that anywhere else, and I doubt Revere leads them to the promised land.

The Street trade didn't cost much in terms of quality. The Angels gave up more quantity than anything else. Every prospect in that deal has the ceiling of a league average player. If we still had them now, none would rank in the top 10.

Club control and a low salary doesn't mean much to me if the guy is a replacement level player. Giving up Tropeano and Bedrosian for a guy who has never posted an OPS above league average in his 5 year career should cost Dipoto his job.

Btw, Chatwood's 2013 season was nothing more than smoke and mirrors. Those peripherals scream fluke. I'd do that trade again any day of the week.

[Inside Pitch]

I think we're seeing a lot of knee-jerk reactions here and there are a few things to point out.

1. Ben Revere is BETTER than Matt Joyce. He hits for a higher average, plays better defense and gives the Angels some much needed speed. You can complain all you want about his lack of power or OBP but he's am above average player in his physical prime making a reasonably low salary.

 

If he plays better defense than Matt Joyce it's not shown up in the defensive metrics the previous 3 years.    And if the best he can do while in his physical prime is a 85 OPS+ (78 so far this year), he can only get worse.

[ukyah]

revere may help the angels by moving calhoun and trout into more rbi opportunities. howard will certainly not help the angels.

[Tyler]

It will happen today.

[Inside Pitch]

 

Speaking of Tyler DeLoach: In 59 games appeared in, 45 starts, DeLoach has struck out 296 batters over 274 1/3 innings, while holding opposing batters to a .202 BAA. his ERA over that span is 3.08, with a solid 1.14 WHIP career.

 

This season he hasn't missed a beat, boasting a 2.00 ERA, 0.91 WHIP and holding opposing batters to a .196 BAA.

 

What's NOT to like about DeLoach? He doesn't throw 98 MPH with movement like Richards, but he's around 89-93 MPH with his fastball, has average to above average secondary stuff. 

 

 

I like him, I like Nate Smith more cause he has a better FB.   But if you have to rank the guys youd be least willing to trade for mediocrities like Revere I'd imagine Heaney, Tropeano and Smith would rank ahead of Deloach.

[mtangelsfan]

The Angels offense is so bad that two below average hitters would actually make them a bit better.

[floplag]

yeah i suspect Philly want to increase that deal beyond Revere perhaps more than we might.

i wouldnt be shocked if they are trying to do a Revere/Howard/Hammels package to try to fleece the farm over here or dump all the payroll problems

[tdawg87]

*tdawg reaches into bag of random shit trade suggestions that will never happen*

Tropeano, Bedrosian, Cron, Featherston, Gott, and Stamets to the Indians for Brandon Moss and Carlos Santana

[bloodbrother]

Revere is basically the definition of an empty BA but I'd take him on this team. They need some elite speed at the top of the lineup. It's a start at least. It would help push Joyce out of a starter's role and the OF defense would improve - holy crap though Revere's arm is Juan Pierre-esque. After this, they need to be looking for a legit power bat for DH, preferably a left-handed power bat

[Docwaukee]

a low obp guy with no power batting leadoff and playing out of position.  awesome. 

[Inside Pitch]

It will happen today.

 

I hate you so much ..... so so much...

[Tyler]

I hate you so much ..... so so much...

 

I'm not tripping. I don't see him more than a stopgap and same with Dipoto. I don't think he will overpay.

[Inside Pitch]

I'm not tripping. I don't see him more than a stopgap and same with Dipoto. I don't think he will overpay.

 

Oh sure..  Way to be boring.   You're far more entertaining when you have your pitchfork and torch going.

 

But yeah, I can't see JD giving much of anything for Revere.

[Angel Oracle]

AO, you can't have it all. Aging slugger on the decline costs player C. Slugger in his prime costs A, A and B. So would you rather get Aging Slugger for Tropeano or in his Prime Slugger for Newcombe, Bandy and Bedrosian?

There has to be some middle ground. We've been burned far too often with aging sluggers.

When does that change?

[Deek]

Howard on top of Revere?  I know we need offense, but you guys are going off the deep end. 

 

Revere can't even get on base, he's like Aybar with more speed and even less power.  Career .320 OBP, with a .302 OBP this year in almost 200 PA's.  Career 4% BB rate.  Negative UZR rating the past couple years, mediocre defensively.

 

Maybe I'm missing something here, but I don't see how he even remotely brings us offensive value.

 

Has Revere ever batted in front of Mike Trout...?

[Cdaniel]

People are buying into the names and the reputations and completely ignoring the actual production.

Ryan Howard's combined triple slash lines since 2012 are .236/.309/.422... grats on the hot streak, but he's been awful. Both these guys are just mediocre to well below average hitters for their positions and yet people are talking about them as if they could fix what ails the Angels.

Do people really expect two guys who combined for a negative OPS+ in Philly to come to Anaheim and perform?

Howard was hurt in 2012 and 2013. 2014 was his first year recovering from injuries. He is on pace closer to his carter norms this year.

[Chuck]

Has Revere ever batted in front of Mike Trout...?

 

Good point! 

[HeavenlyHalos]

All the Howard support shows just how truly desperate this team is for offense. This is an aging veteran who will strike out 175+ times a year, hit an occasional HR and has posted an OPS under .700 on the road over the past 4 seasons. He will also most likely receive a considerable amount of playing time through the remainder of his contract because Sosh loves veterans that used to be good. I have zero interest in going after him and hope we don't. 

[HeavenlyHalos]

Howard was hurt in 2012 and 2013. 2014 was his first year recovering from injuries. He is on pace closer to his carter norms this year.

 

Lol, recovering from injuries or not, he struck out 190 times, hit .223, and had an OPS under .700. He can still hit some HRs though. He is Vernon Wells with more strike outs and walks. 

[Cdaniel]

Lol, recovering from injuries or not, he struck out 190 times, hit .223, and had an OPS under .700. He can still hit some HRs though. He is Vernon Wells with more strike outs and walks.

So are we just ignoring what he is doing this year then? You don't think a proven vet hitting 260 with 25 plus bombs a year for let's say 5 mil a year is not a good move? Are strikeouts a concern? An out is an out right?

[nando714]

I can't wait till we sign Cespedes in the off season and our LF issues will finally disappear

[Reveille1984]

Has Revere ever batted in front of Mike Trout...?

 

Lineup protection has proven to be nothing more than hot air multiple times, but if you have evidence to the contrary feel free to fill me in.