Pile on the hate: The Angels looks like Dbags today

[stevestevens]

Here's the thing....

The Angels are going to be paying Hamilton $90 million over the next three years no matter what.

What's the best way to get something for that?

Seems to me you wanna make Hamilton feel supported, like you want him back.

The best thing for the Angels is that the guy comes back and produces.

 

 

Which is why these comments lead me to believe that they don't think he can/will come back.

[beatlesrule]

Here's the thing....

The Angels are going to be paying Hamilton $90 million over the next three years no matter what.

What's the best way to get something for that?

Seems to me you wanna make Hamilton feel supported, like you want him back.

The best thing for the Angels is that the guy comes back and produces.

You can wish all you want that he'd just disappear and his contract would be voided but it's not gonna happen.

 

It seems to me that if the FO came out and totally supported Hamilton, they would be blasted.  They are in a lose lose situation.  You are right in the sense that they should do nothing but give praise to him in hopes he might finally listen to his friend and retire. Cots contracts has him getting 23 million this year and 30 million for the next 2 years so if he does not care about getting better, he will stay with the team and collect his paycheck.  MLB has guaranteed contracts so Hamilton really has it made. If I were the FO, I'd kiss his butt so he has no resentment towards them and hope he just retires to save them all that cash. 

[beatlesrule]

Possibly. I'm not gonna argue that point. It's just hard to read people saying he got off on a technicality. The only reason the rule exists is to allow what happened to happen. There is no other intent of the rule. It wasn't a technicality. It was the purpose.

 

It points out how stupid MLB was to accept it.  Hamilton used drugs, admitted he did it so he wouldn't get punished and gets to keep getting paid.  All within the rules MLB agreed to.

[QuinlansMinion]

"An a hole and a jerk"? How do you figure? I've watched him sit for hours in Diablo Stadium signing for any and everyone. He did it everyday he could on his own time when every other player had left. He made some stupid decisions but that doesn't make an a hole or a jerk.

 

 

Just take any of the number of cracks hes made since hes been here.  He slides into 1st head first, injures himself, LAUGHS ABOUT IT on the way back to the dugout, says later on that he will do the same thing again.  Comes back in the playoffs unprepared and flailing at pitches that literally me or you wouldnt swing at, then says its "comical" that the fans are frustrated with him, that he put "poisons" in his body so he could play, that he doesnt play for nor does he care about the fans.  Alienates himself from his teammates and sits by himself on the bench like a loner.  Maybe a hole was a little strong of a word, but he hasnt exactly done any favors to win me or any of the Angels fans over.  This thread is a joke, of course the situation would be different with Trout or literally any other player on the Angels because nobody else acts like Hamilton does.  

[mtangelsfan]

I think Carpino's comments were out of line, outraged at the lack of discipline. I'm not alone reading that. Not on this board nor among some baseball writers. Rosenthal, Heyman, and Bob Nightengale all had a less that positive reaction regarding the Angels' position.

I respect you Chuck and what youve created here, but everything can't be rainbows and unicorns regarding the Angels. Sometimes you need to go against the grain and hold those entities accountable.

You guys don't want negative posts on the team because it jeopardizes your one hour yearly talk with Tim Mead, or the potential guest lists at ST, I can certainly understand that.

I'm disappointed in the franchise I like. If you don't feel Carpino's original comments, before he apparently tried to backtrack, aren't indicative of my OP, then so be it.

 

I understand the emotion of this but it is simply untrue.  There exists thousands upon thousands of posts on AW critical of Moreno, Dipoto, Sosh, the players and the organization as a whole.

[beatlesrule]

Bill Shaikin of the Times says Arte is "livid". Not a quote, but inferring it from the other statements by the FO.

 

http://www.latimes.com/sports/sportsnow/la-sp-sn-josh-hamilton-angels-arte-moreno-20150403-story.html

 

So what if he is?  I'm sorry but I just don't understand posters here that really think Arte is going to release him and eat 83 million.  I think the most realistic scenario for Hamilton never playing in an Angels uniform again is if they find an equally bad contract a team is willing to swap and Josh agrees to the trade. Ryan Howard? Arod? Those are some terrible contracts off the top of my head that might be feasible. Hamilton is holding ALL the cards here.

 

Edit* I found this article http://grantland.com/features/worst-mlb-contracts-2015-alex-rodriguez-ryan-howard-prince-fielder/

Edited April 3, 2015 by beatlesrule

[Thomas]

Maybe they could trade his contract for Pujols' contract. Oh wait...

[Thomas]

Arod is owed $73 million on the remainder of the his contract. That is a bargain compared to Hamilton's contract considering ARod might actually produce a little.

[DB24]

He made a commitment to Arte, and the team to stay clean before signing his $125 million contract. He broke that commitment, why can’t they be disappointed?

[Angel Oracle]

Do you know anything about addiction?

It's more comparing Hamilton to the every day employee who gets dumped from their job fur something like this.

Granted he at least reported it himself instead of hiding it. There is something to be said for that.

[tdawg87]

I don't think Dipoto's comment was completely out of character and I agree with everything he said. Carpino on the other hand seems to have shot himself in the foot with his original comment. That's not really the kind of thing you want to hear or read one of your employers saying about you.

[Tank]

is there a buyout clause in hamilton's contract? wonder how much it would be.

 

as for speaking out publicly, i don't disagree with how the front office feels, but i disagree with going public about it. should have kept this as an internal discussion.

[The Ghost of Bob Starr]

I understand the emotion of this but it is simply untrue.  There exists thousands upon thousands of posts on AW critical of Moreno, Dipoto, Sosh, the players and the organization as a whole.

 

Many posts, not as many threads.

[mtangelsfan]

Many posts, not as many threads.

 

If you were to count I'd lay a wager that there are more negative threads than positive ones.  Bottom line though is if what you said were really true, this thread would have been deleted already.

[beatlesrule]

So do people want Carpino fired now?

[Docwaukee]

is there a buyout clause in hamilton's contract? wonder how much it would be.

 

as for speaking out publicly, i don't disagree with how the front office feels, but i disagree with going public about it. should have kept this as an internal discussion.

his buyout is probably around 83 million.  

[Hollyw00d]

the FO should have gone the scioscia route and either said nothing or just done the PC, happy cheery response. 

[Mark68]

This is EXACTLY why I was opposed to signing Hamilton to begin with. Waiting for the other shoe to fall. That goddamn boot just stomped on the Angels.

 

Addicts remain addicts. They are never cured, they have to struggle against that addiction every single day. Many succeed, but many do not. Even for those who do succeed, they have to live with the knowledge that they absolutely cannot slip up. Ever.

 

This should always be a consideration before committing nearly a quarter of a billion dollars to someone who has this issue. You're betting a LOT of money that he's not going to have a slip up while he is under contract. That is a losing gamble.

 

The Angels brought this upon themselves by believing that Hamilton wouldn't relapse...also by believing that the drugs and alcohol he abused when he was younger hadn't taken the toll on his body that they probably have. This is why it's surprising that they (especially Carpino) would make the public statements they did. The front office did themselves no favors today.

 

This will be a toxic relationship for however much longer it lasts. Hamilton, while he has his issues, which are magnified by the profession he currently holds, is a human being and at least deserves to not be thrown under the bus, no matter how much we all dislike him as a player. As a fan of this team, I loathe Hamilton the player, and what he has (or hasn't) done in his tenure here. However, as a human being, I love him as a fellow human and hope that he finds the peace that his family deserves.

 

I do not think that the comments made by the front office were in any way helpful to the future working relationship between the team and the player that the team still owes some $90 million to. Hamilton deserved (deserves) every chance in the world to have a successful life. However, I always believed in letting someone else take that chance.

 

The Angels' front office has made things much more complicated. They would have been better served by either not commenting or by issuing a blanket statement such as, "We understand and accept the ruling of the arbitrator in the Josh Hamilton matter." That would have been much more productive.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Mark68

[Turd Ferguson]

Are we so sure that the organization's strong reaction isn't to protect the team? For example, if Hamilton's actions jeopardized the organization or others within the organization, then I think the response by the team is justified--i.e., maybe they are protecting the other 24 guys in the club house? 

 

Or what if the Angels feel compelled to protect the Hamilton family, which the Angels reference in their statement? What if Hamilton's actions put his family in jeopardy? Given the scrutiny that other professional sports teams have faced of late for failing to act in light of domestic issues, what if the team is privy to information about such an incident stemming from Hamilton's substance abuse? If the team were to back the player in such a scenario and the details ever came to light, the organization would get hammered (I hate even going there with how little we know and acknowledge that this is totally unfair to Hamilton, but I purely raise as a hypothetical). 

 

My point isn't to disparage Hamilton or make up farfetched scenarios, but more to illustrate there is far too little we know and, it would seem, far more to this story for anyone--you, me, some apparently righteously indignant media members--to slam the Angels. With that said, if the response is borne out of frustration or anger that the team wasn't able to save a few bucks through a Hamilton suspension, then the organization deserves all the heat it is getting.

 

All that said, my sincere hope is that Hamilton gets whatever help he needs, first and foremost, and does whatever he needs to do to get his life on track (if it isn't already). Then, and only then, I really do hope he gets back to being a productive baseball player. This team is undoubtedly better with a productive Josh Hamilton. 

[HaloMagic]

If the public knows so little them why would it be necessary to make a statement like that to protect anyone? Protect them from what? Info no one knows?

[Turd Ferguson]

If the public knows so little them why would it be necessary to make a statement like that to protect anyone? Protect them from what? Info no one knows?

 

That's kind of my point--I'm not necessarily sure the statement is for us. Maybe its directed at the team? The Hamilton family? Maybe the team is being proactive as opposed to reactive?  

[HaloMagic]

If they didn't intend for it to be directed to the public then they probably shouldn't have directed it to the public.

If it was for the team I imagine they have their phone numbers.

[NrM]

Most companies have a zero tolerance policy. If it was in the military he would have been kicked out with a dishonorable discharge for his first offence.
Good luck finding a job after that. "would you like fries with that?"

Why should baseball be any different? If anything, they should be more strict.

Edited April 4, 2015 by Poozy

[HaloMagic]

Most companies don't have a zero tolerance policy if you come forward and ask for help.

[tdawg87]

Most companies have a zero tolerance policy. If it was in the military he would have been kicked out with a dishonorable discharge for his first offense.

Good luck finding a job after that. "would you like fries with that?"

Why should baseball be any different? If anything, they should be more strict.

 

Than.........than the military?