Ken Rosenthal on the Angels next managerial search

[Stradling]

I wish they’d drop Yakult as a sponsor. 

[DMVol]

1 hour ago, Inside Pitch said:

The bit about Phil "taking care of the players", is what makes me believe its more than casual lip service.  Mike Trout is always vague, he tends to speak in generalities, he doesn't typically focus on one thing. That seemed a little more nuanced than the usual Mike Trout non answer, answers.

It is enough, given Trout's standing with the team, that Nevin's chances of managing next year just improved....how much, not sure.....that is assuming there isn't a quick sale this winter...

[BTH]

4 hours ago, Dtwncbad said:

This obsession with who the manager is next year reminds me of someone starting a new business that spends all day every day working on the logo for their business cards.

The team is transitioning to a new owner, needs some upgrades at some key positions, and is faced with trying to lock down Babe Ruth.

The manager isn’t going to matter, at all, if the big things are not taken care of.

I think the reason why people are talking about it a lot right now is that it is a matter that will be settled within the next few days.

It's probably gonna be months before a new owner is in place. Meanwhile, Jeff Fletcher said the Angels are expected to make a decision on Nevin by or around Wednesday.

[Swordsman78]

28 minutes ago, Trendon said:

I think the reason why people are talking about it a lot right now is that it is a matter that will be settled within the next few days.

It's probably gonna be months before a new owner is in place. Meanwhile, Jeff Fletcher said the Angels are expected to make a decision on Nevin by or around Wednesday.

That's a pretty fast "Nationwide search"

[Puget Sound Angel]

We're stuck with him for now.

[khouse]

On 10/3/2022 at 12:58 AM, Trendon said:

It’s Nightengale, so I don’t know how much truth there is here.

Who exactly would love to have Bochy? Arte? Perry?

Everyone here knows that Nevin may or may not stay, and that it’s complicated by the status of ownership.

Walt Weiss “could be the favorite.” OK. He also could not be the favorite.

Tying the Angels to Weiss and Gibbons is a connection anyone can come up with because they worked with Perry.

LOL...I don't know what your beef is with Nightengale...but to condemn him for making these connections as others/many on this site have as well is absurd...

[khouse]

On 10/3/2022 at 12:00 AM, Swordsman78 said:

They don't deserve that much respect.  Strongly dislike that team and city.  Please don't bring them up on this forum unless the Angles are beating them.

Glad to see that the Angels are worthy of your respect then lol...

[Stradling]

40 minutes ago, khouse said:

LOL...I don't know what your beef is with Nightengale...but to condemn him for making these connections as others/many on this site have as well is absurd...

Bob has had a bad run of being wrong. 

[BTH]

It's admittedly unfair to Nevin, but I hope he's not the manager after this season.

I'd prefer to wipe the slate clean after this awful season.

 

I'm a stupid fan that would buy into hope that a new manager could help turn things around, even though I know that's not gonna be what turns this team into a contender.

I'd rather them hire a new manager and sell me on false hope rather than running it back with the manager from a season that left a bad taste in my mouth.

[Swordsman78]

In 1957 the Northwestern football coaches were Ara Parsegian and Bo Shembechler.   The team went 0-9.

Both coaches left and went on to win Championships.  Northwestern......not so much.

At least the fans got that bad taste out of their mouths after the '57 season tho.

[Warfarin]

8 hours ago, Trendon said:

It's admittedly unfair to Nevin, but I hope he's not the manager after this season.

I'd prefer to wipe the slate clean after this awful season.

 

I'm a stupid fan that would buy into hope that a new manager could help turn things around, even though I know that's not gonna be what turns this team into a contender.

I'd rather them hire a new manager and sell me on false hope rather than running it back with the manager from a season that left a bad taste in my mouth.

I think managers’ true roles these days just isn’t as essential as others may feel it is.

In this era of time, most tactical moves come from the front office.  A manager’s main role is to maintain a cohesive clubhouse and help serve as a connection between the FO and the players.

Look at the Dodgers with Roberts or the Rays with Cash.  Does anyone think Roberts is a genius, and that’s why the Dodgers have won 110 games, or is it that their front office is incredible and Roberts is simply executing their plan, while keeping the clubhouse an upbeat, enjoyable environment?

[BTH]

4 hours ago, Warfarin said:

I think managers’ true roles these days just isn’t as essential as others may feel it is.

In this era of time, most tactical moves come from the front office.  A manager’s main role is to maintain a cohesive clubhouse and help serve as a connection between the FO and the players.

True.

I just don’t know what Nevin’s relationship is like with the front office.

I’d have no doubt that Ray Montgomery would be in lock step with the front office, whereas I have doubts that Nevin would be since Maddon has fed him “advice.”

Perry knows, though, so that will surely be a factor in the decision on Nevin.

[Swordsman78]

31 minutes ago, Trendon said:

True.

I just don’t know what Nevin’s relationship is like with the front office.

I’d have no doubt that Ray Montgomery would be in lock step with the front office, whereas I have doubts that Nevin would be since Maddon has fed him “advice.”

Perry knows, though, so that will surely be a factor in the decision on Nevin.

What makes you so sure that being in lock step with the front office will provide better managerial decisions?  A big part of being a manager is player relationships and knowing how each player responds psychologically. 

Newsflash:  Perry has no managerial cred.  Montgomery really does not either.

Being a manager is much more than analyzing data where to position players during a defensive shift.

Nevin excels at player relationships.  He holds them accountable, pushes them via practice, and genuinely cares about them as the players expressed.

There are 3 things a person looks for in a manager (any business).

1. Does he know what he's talking about.

2.  Can I trust him.

3.  Does he care about me.

[BTH]

38 minutes ago, Swordsman78 said:

What makes you so sure that being in lock step with the front office will provide better managerial decisions?  A big part of being a manager is player relationships and knowing how each player responds psychologically. 

How do you know that Montgomery won’t have those good relationships, in addition to being in total lock step with the front office?

[Warfarin]

50 minutes ago, Swordsman78 said:

What makes you so sure that being in lock step with the front office will provide better managerial decisions?  A big part of being a manager is player relationships and knowing how each player responds psychologically. 

Newsflash:  Perry has no managerial cred.  Montgomery really does not either.

Being a manager is much more than analyzing data where to position players during a defensive shift.

Nevin excels at player relationships.  He holds them accountable, pushes them via practice, and genuinely cares about them as the players expressed.

There are 3 things a person looks for in a manager (any business).

1. Does he know what he's talking about.

2.  Can I trust him.

3.  Does he care about me.

I think no fan can really attest to any of these things.  It’s hard for us, as fans, to know any of this.  How are we in any position to know how Nevin compares to Montgomery in any of these things?  Honestly, we don’t at all.  We‘ll see what happens, but any fan who claims to really know any of this is really just fabricating their knowledge.

I am guessing Montgomery takes over, because he seems like he would be a handpicked option who has experience with both the FO and in the dugout, but that is just a total guess - I really have no clue.

EDIT: I posted this as news broke out that Nevin got a one year deal, lol. 

[Swordsman78]

25 minutes ago, Warfarin said:

I think no fan can really attest to any of these things.  It’s hard for us, as fans, to know any of this.  How are we in any position to know how Nevin compares to Montgomery in any of these things?  Honestly, we don’t at all.  We‘ll see what happens, but any fan who claims to really know any of this is really just fabricating their knowledge.

I am guessing Montgomery takes over, because he seems like he would be a handpicked option who has experience with both the FO and in the dugout, but that is just a total guess - I really have no clue.

EDIT: I posted this as news broke out that Nevin got a one year deal, lol. 

 

[failos]

On 10/1/2022 at 11:06 AM, Swordsman78 said:

The word "if" denotes uncertainty.  Hence a "questionable" result.

That’s dumb. Everything you said is incorrect.

[Just Sayin]

My understanding is that Minasian hired Nevin after Nevin was fired as the Yankees third base coach to be the new third base coach for the Angels.
 

I am guessing when I say Minasian bounced the idea off Maddon before hiring him.  But he may not have.  I don’t know. 
 

All I can say is that if I am managing a ball club and someone other than myself selects a member of my staff of assistant coaches, that’s just not going to sit right with me.

Probably wouldn’t sit right with very many managers as well.  
 

Pretty easy to connect the dots here.

It’s a chickenshit way of blowing a guy out and an even more chickenshit way of being handed the reins.

 

 

 

 

[Stradling]

17 minutes ago, Just Sayin said:

My understanding is that Minasian hired Nevin after Nevin was fired as the Yankees third base coach to be the new third base coach for the Angels.
 

I am guessing when I say Minasian bounced the idea off Maddon before hiring him.  But he may not have.  I don’t know. 
 

All I can say is that if I am managing a ball club and someone other than myself selects a member of my staff of assistant coaches, that’s just not going to sit right with me.

Probably wouldn’t sit right with very many managers as well.  
 

Pretty easy to connect the dots here.

It’s a chickenshit way of blowing a guy out and an even more chickenshit way of being handed the reins.

 

 

 

 

Or Maddon bought into the idea of adding Nevin since Maddon coached Nevin the past. And Maddon is vocal about feeling wronged about everything and I don’t believe he mentioned or hinted at Nevin being a problem or the hiring process of Nevin. So it’s probably not what you think it is. 

[Stradling]

All three of the coaches the Angels brought in had a history with Maddon, so I believe he had significant input in those hirings.  Or else it’s a huge coincidence. 

[Dtwncbad]

36 minutes ago, Just Sayin said:

My understanding is that Minasian hired Nevin after Nevin was fired as the Yankees third base coach to be the new third base coach for the Angels.
 

I am guessing when I say Minasian bounced the idea off Maddon before hiring him.  But he may not have.  I don’t know. 
 

All I can say is that if I am managing a ball club and someone other than myself selects a member of my staff of assistant coaches, that’s just not going to sit right with me.

Probably wouldn’t sit right with very many managers as well.  
 

Pretty easy to connect the dots here.

It’s a chickenshit way of blowing a guy out and an even more chickenshit way of being handed the reins.

 

 

 

 

“Pretty easy to connect the dots here.”

Put five random dots on a piece of paper.  

Now tell how it would ever be hard to connect them.

 

[Brandon]

Perry seems to be pretty involved or wants to be involved.

https://www.si.com/mlb/2022/10/06/joe-maddon-angels-gm-perry-minasian-ordered-pull-mike-trout-mid-game-new-book?fbclid=IwAR3LBSWCabBKUqlLq9ma6Lkmy6PtfSW1E6IyTeHDpiCFuO80Wi1DwDoW_CA

[failos]

On 10/3/2022 at 8:15 AM, Stradling said:

I wish they’d drop Yakult as a sponsor. 

Forreal. I hate seeing that eyesore of a sign in the stadium, and all the giveaways with their ugly ass logo

[Stradling]

5 minutes ago, Brandon said:

Perry seems to be pretty involved or wants to be involved.

https://www.si.com/mlb/2022/10/06/joe-maddon-angels-gm-perry-minasian-ordered-pull-mike-trout-mid-game-new-book?fbclid=IwAR3LBSWCabBKUqlLq9ma6Lkmy6PtfSW1E6IyTeHDpiCFuO80Wi1DwDoW_CA

I read that, “ordered” is a funny word for what happened when you read the article.  If Maddon felt he could tell his boss to “never fucking call the dugout again” then he felt he could simply keep Trout in the game.  Maddon was a joke and he is holding onto something that has passed him by.  

[Just Sayin]

It would depend on if Maddon sought out Nevin or Minasian did.  I don’t recall any issues with the previous third base coach for the Angels.  Why make a change?  Nevin was FIRED as a third base coach for lacking judgement.  He took a lot of heat in NY.  For baserunners getting blown down at the plate or not being sent when they should have been sent.  But to be fair, everybody in NY takes heat for one reason or another.

Look....it isn’t like we had some glaring deficiency in the third base coaching box in 2021 to warrant hiring a “hot shot third base coach” who had just been fired from the Yankees to replace that individual

So yeah, Minasian had more in mind than “upgrading” the third base coaching box.  And I’m not so sure it was an “upgrade”...

I would say he had Maddon on a short leash and wanted one of his cronies to be in position when he pulled the plug.

If you’re gonna fire a guy then fire him. Don’t be chickenshit about it.
 

I just don’t agree with a GM recruiting or hiring assistant coaches for a manager.  Period.  
 

Minasian has his front office staff and it isn’t like Nevin or Maddon are involved in the hires for Minasians staff. 
 

The team played pretty well after the initial shock of Maddon’s firing wore off. I give Nevin a mulligan for his first 20 games or so because of that.  I think I’m being reasonable in doing so.

A 12-game losing streak is definitely grounds for dismissal. It’s a long season though. Let’s say you lose 12 straight but rattle off a couple 6-8 game winning streaks over the course of the long season.  Every team “gets hot” a couple of times over 162 games.  The 12-game losing streak then officially becomes a wash.
 

In MLB, no matter how great you are you’ll still probably lose a third of your games.  And no matter how bad you are, you’ll still probably win a third of your games.  It’s what a manager does with that other third that defines him as a manager.

Many have stated here that the Angels have the two best players in baseball.  I don’t think I would argue that.  But you can’t tell me Nevin or Maddon had anything to do with either of those two players being what they are.  

I’m not an Orioles fan.  But I have definitely “admired” the job done by Hyde managing them this season. He basically had nobody of note on that roster.  They won 52 last year.  And went 83-79 this season.  That’s quite a turnaround.

And he was able to pull this off without the two best players in the game.

Did Hyde have something to do with that?  You would have to be the judge on that question.

I’m just not seeing Nevin as the “miracle worker” many hope he will be.  And I’m not really down with the way he inherited the gig.  Just sayin ....