Trading David Fletcher

[Bronson]

Our offense and defense is so much weaker without Fletch it’s not even funny. He’s untouchable to me unless you’re getting a Bieber type arm and we all know that won’t happen. 

[Stradling]

I love Fletcher, but he can be replaced a lot easier than getting a young #2 type of starter.  

[Angels 1961]

I keep Fletcher, sign LaStella in off season to play 1B. Your INF be set and go after Bauer in off season. You hope Canning and Sandoval can develop into rotation pieces along with Detmers. Bullpen a total mess with very little to keep. What to do with Upton and Pujols going forward another big ?. This team at start of this short season look to have so much hope but now going forward a lot of questions of what to do. I keep Fletcher and Goodwin because of the value they bring with those contracts. Totally forgot about Bundy for next year. Good news Teheran was just signed for 1 year.

[totdprods]

I’m not totally against it. Simmons would need to be extended. La Stella kept on for some 1B/2B work. I still believe in Rengifo too - it’s easy to forget that this time last year I think he was still in AA and had started the year in A+. He’s very young still and has a wide skill set. Something should click to give him value still, and playing everyday in ‘20 could help move his development along.

That said, really hard seeing them moving Fletcher. They’d have to be blown away. A couple teams could...

San Diego is supposedly interested in Whit Merrifield who’s a good comp for what Fletcher could offer a team and they’re loaded with pitching. Paddack, Patino, Gore...all likely out of reach. Dinelson Lamet probably too with his performance this year. I’d think names like Adrian Morejon, Cal Quantrill, Joey Lucchesi could be in play though. Ryan Weathers and Michel Baez too, but they’re not in the bigs yet so probably not quite as attractive. 

The Dodgers don’t really have a need but Fletcher could still have a big impact there. They liked Rengifo so who knows what they’d offer for Fletcher. Maybe the Angels pry back Kike or Taylor (or Stripling!) as part of a larger deal, but no doubt they’d be zeroing in on someone like Graterol, Gray, Gonsolin. 

Detroit is loaded with pitching prospects. Turnbull fits the bill the closest in terms of some MLB success and control, but is definitely not the tier I would hope for in dealing Fletcher. They’re going to want to start getting some offense though and Eppler deals with them a lot. Still think Goodwin makes sense here. 

Cleveland for Plesac, Clevinger, or another top arm is pretty reasonable to work with too. If it let you keep Adell and Marsh it’s pretty hard not to consider. 

After that, I can’t really think of any teams that have a huge need mid-infield who also have more than enough pitching to meet our demands...the teams that could seriously match our pretty limited. Toronto has pitching prospects but are very heavy on infielders, as is Tampa.

[floplag]

1 hour ago, Catwhoshatinthehat said:

Clevinger has been rumored to be someone the Indians may move for over a year now and his current situation has only led to more speculation that he and/or Plesac could be moved.  The Indians pitching has been very good while leading the league in ERA and they just called up one of their top SP prospects.  On offense they currently rank last in average, 23rd in OBP, last in SLG and 29th in OPS.  They've needed OF help for a while now and at 16-9 with pitching depth they have the pieces to make a move to help the offense.  Obviously acquiring Clevinger or anyone like him isn't without risks but that's one reason guys with his upside and club control become available.  I don't disagree that the type of pitcher the Angels need is going to be very expensive via trade but it's either that or hope they land one in FA which may be even more risky given the long term contract it will take.  There's no easy way to accomplish what the Angels need to do and it's not going to happen without taking risks.

This might be the one name that actually works, but it still has fleas.
Do you do that if youre Cle?  Clevinger has 2 more arb years before FA and they get 4 of Fletcher.  On paper that might balance it out.  I dont think most would call that even, im a high on Fletcher as anyone and im not sure i would.  Do his issues balance that, are they issues we want to take on for a guy that apparently put himself above the club?
If we do it what do we do about SS?  Re-up Simba?  Im not sure i see Rengifo as a full time SS.
Im not a fan of deals that open other holes but perhaps thats the kind of deal were going to have to make.

[Catwhoshatinthehat]

9 minutes ago, floplag said:

This might be the one name that actually works, but it still has fleas.
Do you do that if youre Cle?  Clevinger has 2 more arb years before FA and they get 4 of Fletcher.  On paper that might balance it out.  I dont think most would call that even, im a high on Fletcher as anyone and im not sure i would.  Do his issues balance that, are they issues we want to take on for a guy that apparently put himself above the club?
If we do it what do we do about SS?  Re-up Simba?  Im not sure i see Rengifo as a full time SS.
Im not a fan of deals that open other holes but perhaps thats the kind of deal were going to have to make.

If I'm Cleveland and I'm over Clevinger then I look for the best possible offer and move him before the start of next season to maximize the return as the acquiring team will have at least two years of control.  I say at least two because according to Passan if Clevinger and Plesac are left where they are then they won't accrue enough service time which means another year of club control:  

https://factoryofsadness.co/2020/08/17/cleveland-indians-rumors-clevinger-trade/

A night out could cost both players a year of FA but as the article mentions by doing so that just makes the relationship worse.  If I'm the Indians and Clevinger isn't worth the headache this year I keep him where he is then move him during the off season when he still has three years of club control.  Even if he and the players association take issue with it he knowingly broke protocol which all players agreed to so I can't imagine they'd have a leg to stand on.

The Angels don't have many pieces to trade that are going to land them a #1-2 pitcher so whether it's Fletcher, Adell or some other young cost controlled players to fill the need of a #1-2 SP they're going to create a lesser need.  Like Stradling said replacing Fletcher is easier than getting a #1-2 pitcher.  I like Fletcher and would definitely rather have him on the team than not but as has been reported he's one of so many Angels players that has value and could realistically be moved.

[Chuck]

5 hours ago, mymerlincat said:

I'd only make him available if we were getting a Mike Soroka, Walker Buehler, Shane Bieber, or Jack Flaherty type of young pitcher.

I think this is fair return of talent. 

[floplag]

2 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

I think this is fair return of talent. 

Put yourself in the shoes of the other side, do you make that deal straight up?  I dont think any of them would.

[totdprods]

12 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

I think this is fair return of talent. 

To me that means it’s probably not realistic. 

If it’s sort of a consensus on the board that one of those players are appropriate returns - the truth is probably a half-step or full step down. 

That’s why I’d think Clevinger/Plesac, Gonsolin/Gray, Quantrill/Morejon/Lucchesi, Turnbull are probably more realistic, maybe with a name or two added from each side depending on the deal. 

I have to admit, a deal involving something like Fletcher and Suarez/Adams/Barria for a top SDG SP and catcher could be pretty intriguing.

Edited August 21, 2020 by totdprods

[Jeff Fletcher]

5 hours ago, mymerlincat said:

I'd only make him available if we were getting a Mike Soroka, Walker Buehler, Shane Bieber, or Jack Flaherty type of young pitcher.

You mean “Fletcher and Adell” right?

[stormngt]

6 hours ago, Kevinb said:

Starting pitching. Young starting pitching. The only people untouchable are obviously Rendon, Trout and Ohtani I think Fletcher is a stud and I would put him a step lower than those three. But I don't think he is not a trade able asset. 

Ohtani should be untouchable only because his stock had dropped.  Otherwise he shouldnt be untouchable.  

In fact, I believe Fletcher is more important to teams success right now than Ohtani.

[stormngt]

6 hours ago, SoPas Angel said:

At the beginning of last season (I think it was), there was a thread asking for your unpopular Angels opinions. I said that I enjoyed watching Fletcher more than Trout. I wasn't 100% serious, but I also wasn't 100% joking. I just love watching the guy play. 

But, obviously, the Angels are desperate for starting pitching. It seems like we're going on half a decade of "Well, if everythingWell, if everything goes our way, we should be okay goes our way, we should be okay." That needs to stop. So if the Angels could get a guy in return that meets all your qualifications, I would be just fine with the move. 

But, as you correctly point out, there's little chance of that. How many teams have a really good pitcher with 4+ years of control that they'd be willing to trade? 

I like watching Hader pitch, but am I the only one who expects his elbow would explode as soon as he was an Angel? 

Half decade?  Try full decade

[Stradling]

Just now, stormngt said:

Half decade?  Try full decade

Yes, half decade.

[eligrba]

3 hours ago, Stradling said:

I love Fletcher, but he can be replaced a lot easier than getting a young #2 type of starter.  

I would normally agree but based on Eppler‘s track record, I will be cautiously agreeable.

[gotbeer]

JMO, but I don't think Fletcher will net us a good starting young pitcher.  Those guys are only available for guys like Adell.  Might be able to get a good pitcher with a big contract though.

I think that Simmons is more likely traded than Fletcher is.  Simmons glove will be very desirable to a contender that has the bats but will want the D.  

Big pros for keeping Fletcher is he can play SS competently.  He can leadoff.  He's be in year 2 of MLB service.  Which is important to counteract the Trout, Rendon, and hopefully FA pitcher salary.   

[Jeff Fletcher]

1 hour ago, Game 6 said:

Don’t think it would be a one for one trade if something did happen. I envision Fletcher would be part of a package to get a SP. I’d like to know what the Tribe is thinking of doing with Plesac and Clevinger. Are they just in a time out for a few weeks or are they done. 

They’d be stupid to get rid of them. And if they want to, there will be a long line of teams ready to bid, it’s not like you could get them for half price or anything.  
 

The cost for Clevinger last winter was Adell plus a second player. 

[Jeff Fletcher]

22 minutes ago, Game 6 said:

Agreed. It would be unwise for them to not allow this Chicago episode to pass but where there is confusion there is profit. What do you think the cost for Plesac would be? He would be a great get.   

Would Fletcher, Adams/Goodwin and Middleton get the Angels there?

There’s a big difference between Adams and Goodwin, so I’m not sure how to evaluate it that way. I honestly don’t know what the Indians need, but I would say if they got 2 players who could be key contributors immediately who each had at least 3 years of control, that would be fair. 

[Stradling]

8 minutes ago, JocStrapling said:

That’s laughable! 

It’s also true. 

[Stradling]

51 minutes ago, JocStrapling said:

Only 26 and an everyday starter  and excellent lead off hitter with the intangibles and attitude Fletch brings can not be easily replaced. That #2 goes every 5th day and. Let’s face it, the amount  of projected #2 starters turning into pumpkins or ending up on the DL lately is rising. Rather keep Fletch as this team needs more than a #2 arm anyway.

And yet this team needs a top of the rotation starter a helluva lot more than it needs a guy like Fletcher.  I like Fletcher a ton but his performance is much easier to replace than a good starter. 

[Stradling]

1 hour ago, JocStrapling said:

Absolutely agree. Many of us were  skewered last year and even now by the fanboys on this site for telling it like it is about Ohtani. The dude is a major distraction and now he is turning into an offensive liability.  It really was easy to read. Guarantee he amounts to nothing but a novelty player with maybe a couple ok years for another team, but nothing more.  Oh, but his power is legit in BP..give me a break, he seems like a great kid, but a major head case between the lines. Ditto for Adel 

 

 

 

 

[Docwaukee]

I love Fletcher and I really hope they don't trade him.  I'd rather trade prospects to get a #2 starter.  But if he alone could net you a club controlled #2 arm then you probably have to do it.  The problem is that he likely won't.  And I sure as hell wouldn't give up and ounce more.  

[Stradling]

6 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

I love Fletcher and I really hope they don't trade him.  I'd rather trade prospects to get a #2 starter.  But if he alone could net you a club controlled #2 arm then you probably have to do it.  The problem is that he likely won't.  And I sure as hell wouldn't give up and ounce more.  

Yep and I’m only trading him if he brings back that type of arm.  He’s our most valuable asset that is replaceable.  

[Docwaukee]

1 minute ago, Stradling said:

Yep and I’m only trading him if he brings back that type of arm.  He’s our most valuable asset that is replaceable.  

since pitching is so volatile I'd almost rather give up other assets from the same category like guys who are expiring or unproven in exchange for pitchers who are less proven.  

[Stradling]

Just now, Dochalo said:

since pitching is so volatile I'd almost rather give up other assets from the same category like guys who are expiring or unproven in exchange for pitchers who are less proven.  

So you’d rather make more acquisitions that net us guys like Sandoval?  I’m not saying it like it’s a bad thing.  

[failos]

16 hours ago, Stradling said:

Would any of you consider trading him for Josh Hader?  

Lol