Trading David Fletcher

[Docwaukee]

Just now, Stradling said:

So you’d rather make more acquisitions that net us guys like Sandoval?  I’m not saying it like it’s a bad thing.  

probably.  

I'm fine with a bunch of guys cutting their teeth this year during frankenball.  I'd get whatever I could out of anyone that isn't under contract for next year.  But everyone is on the block for the right return sans Trout and Rendon.  Bad bullpens suck but the same crew we have now could easily be good next year.  I'm not saying that fletch is untouchable, but I'd wait unless I got an offer I couldn't refuse.  

[Stradling]

6 minutes ago, failos said:

Lol

So no?  Every single game you and other criticize the pen.  I ask if anyone would consider trading for the best closer in the game who has the same amount of club control as Fletcher.  It’s not that far fetched.  Personally I wouldn’t do it but it certainly solves one gigantic problem until his arm falls off. 

[Stradling]

3 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

probably.  

I'm fine with a bunch of guys cutting their teeth this year during frankenball.  I'd get whatever I could out of anyone that isn't under contract for next year.  But everyone is on the block for the right return sans Trout and Rendon.  Bad bullpens suck but the same crew we have now could easily be good next year.  I'm not saying that fletch is untouchable, but I'd wait unless I got an offer I couldn't refuse.  

Yep and my idea of trading Fletch is just more certainty since in the rotation we have zero certainty.  Eppler brought in two arms to add inning stabilization and mostly because of Covid only one of those arms is working out and providing innings. I just want more actual talent on the mound and not the type you have to squint to see or one you have to rework his game to have success. 

[GrittyVeterans]

He’s averaging almost 5 WAR per 650 plate appearances over the span of 2019 and 2020

if you think he’s overperformed, that’s one thing. But if you think the success is legit, then you are talking about an all star player that is 26 and has 4 more years of club control at a reasonable cost. 
 

You better be getting an amazing sure thing in return. That’s all I know 

[Stradling]

4 hours ago, failos said:

Trading one of our best players for a bandaid isn’t going to give you the results you desire. But I was mostly amused because I don’t see the Angels and Dodgers being trade partners anytime soon thanks to that recent trade fiasco. The Dodgers have also proven themselves to be mal-intentioned trading partners

I think this team should keep their cost controlled, homegrown players and learn how to properly scout, recruit, and develop pitchers instead of relying on bandaid trades, dumpster diving and risky contracts.  This is a team that could’ve had Corbin, Clevinger, and even GRich. Forget GMs... this is a consistent trend with the Angels regardless of GM

 

Dodgers?  Hader  is the closer for the Brewers. 

[Docwaukee]

5 hours ago, Stradling said:

Yep and my idea of trading Fletch is just more certainty since in the rotation we have zero certainty.  Eppler brought in two arms to add inning stabilization and mostly because of Covid only one of those arms is working out and providing innings. I just want more actual talent on the mound and not the type you have to squint to see or one you have to rework his game to have success. 

we don't need that certainty right this second in my opinion.  others may disagree.  It's frustrating to watch right now but I personally don't give two turds about what happens for the rest of the 2020 season and wouldn't give up an asset in Fletcher for 30 meaningless games.  It feels like there should be more urgency because of the way things have been set up.  But we're literally watching a bunch of these guy in spring training who now have all of 20-30 innings.  I'm not giving up Fletch to make me feel better about where we're at for this shit show.  

Plus, compare the Angels to the rest of baseball.  We're actually not that bad on the pitching side of things.  The real disappointment has been the offense.  The pitching is about where it should be sans some bullpen blowups.  The offense was supposed to carry this team.  It should be one of the best in baseball and we are middle of the pack.  

I know Eppler's job is on the line, but I am letting this one play out as is for now.  Two solid pen arms and one starter could make a huge long term difference.  Get me a top five draft pick, two solid free agent relievers, and maybe one or two FA SP. 

Another thing - I've seen enough of what Dylan Bundy is capable of doing in a short time to lock him up for 4-5 years.    

[Stradling]

1 minute ago, Dochalo said:

we don't need that certainty right this second in my opinion.  others may disagree.  It's frustrating to watch right now but I personally don't give two turds about what happens for the rest of the 2020 season and wouldn't give up an asset in Fletcher for 30 meaningless games.  It feels like there should be more urgency because of the way things have been set up.  But we're literally watching a bunch of these guy in spring training who now have all of 20-30 innings.  I'm not giving up Fletch to make me feel better about where we're at for this shit show.  

Plus, compare the Angels to the rest of baseball.  We're actually not that bad on the pitching side of things.  The real disappointment has been the offense.  The pitching is about where it should be sans some bullpen blowups.  The offense was supposed to carry this team.  It should be one of the best in baseball and we are middle of the pack.  

I know Eppler's job is on the line, but I am letting this one play out as is for now.  Two solid pen arms and one starter could make a huge long term difference.  Get me a top five draft pick, two solid free agent relievers, and maybe one or two FA SP. 

Another thing - I've seen enough of what Dylan Bundy is capable of doing in a short time to lock him up for 4-5 years.    

Doc I’m not pushing a trade of Fletcher at all but if we were to trade him it’s not because the Angels are desperate to make a move, for me it would be to take advantage of a team like Cleveland or the Padres who might be desperate for that move this season to put them one step closer to make a run.  

[Docwaukee]

3 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Doc I’m not pushing a trade of Fletcher at all but if we were to trade him it’s not because the Angels are desperate to make a move, for me it would be to take advantage of a team like Cleveland or the Padres who might be desperate for that move this season to put them one step closer to make a run.  

I know you're not.  I'm essentially agreeing with you.  I can see where you're heads at because I understand where you are coming from.  I am essentially adding to the discussion that we'd have to be getting a pretty special player in return if I make that deal right now and I know that's what you're saying.  

Part of the problem is that I have a hard time believing that any team is going 'all in' for this season.  

Someone wants Fletcher?  It better be one hell of a lopsided deal in our favor. 

[failos]

1 hour ago, Stradling said:

Dodgers?  Hader  is the closer for the Brewers. 

Eh don’t mind me I had just driven 17 hours straight...I need some rest

[Stradling]

Just now, failos said:

Eh don’t mind me I had just driven 17 hours straight...I need some rest

Careful man, seriously.  

[failos]

14 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Careful man, seriously.  

Yeah I hear ya; First time I ever did a drive like that. Colorado to CA in one shot only stopping at gas stations.
 

Some dude next to me literally drove off a cliff and had to be rescued by a helicopter in the Rocky Mountain. Crazy roads man

Edited August 22, 2020 by failos

[ScottT]

 

[Vlad27Trout27]

The only way i'tt trade Flecth is if we get an god father like offer. 

Yes i do beleive that Flecth is worth a god father like offer. Why/

He's been playing at an all- star level the Past two years. Signed for 3 more years.

A good offer would be for example;

Clevlands Gets Flecth + a top 10 prospect from our system

Angels Get: Plevsac,  Nolan Jones, and Mckenzie

 

That the only or similar trade, i'd consider for Flecth.

[totdprods]

I think there was a thread last year or during this winter where I said Fletcher’s offensive production would be tied to his BAbip unless he started drawing more walks or adding a little more power.

It’s looking like he’s starting to do both. Which could make him essentially a star. 

His contact rate was always extremely good, his best tool, but it also hurt him a bit where, like with him Simmons, he’d swing *too often* and not draw enough walks. He’s changed that this year.

He’s also making hard contact much more frequently this year.

You take baseline David Fletcher and add walks and increased hard contact/power, I think you get something close to José Altuve. Maybe not an exact duplicate because Altuve may or may not have benefitted from some ahem, help, but it wouldn’t surprise me now if Fletcher has a season or two where his HR totals jump into the 15-20 range and we saw a .325/.400/.480 type hitter with 200 hits, 40-50 2B, 15-20 HR, 60-80 BB vs 70-90 K.

 

[floplag]

On 8/21/2020 at 3:26 PM, Catwhoshatinthehat said:

If I'm Cleveland and I'm over Clevinger then I look for the best possible offer and move him before the start of next season to maximize the return as the acquiring team will have at least two years of control.  I say at least two because according to Passan if Clevinger and Plesac are left where they are then they won't accrue enough service time which means another year of club control:  

https://factoryofsadness.co/2020/08/17/cleveland-indians-rumors-clevinger-trade/

A night out could cost both players a year of FA but as the article mentions by doing so that just makes the relationship worse.  If I'm the Indians and Clevinger isn't worth the headache this year I keep him where he is then move him during the off season when he still has three years of club control.  Even if he and the players association take issue with it he knowingly broke protocol which all players agreed to so I can't imagine they'd have a leg to stand on.

The Angels don't have many pieces to trade that are going to land them a #1-2 pitcher so whether it's Fletcher, Adell or some other young cost controlled players to fill the need of a #1-2 SP they're going to create a lesser need.  Like Stradling said replacing Fletcher is easier than getting a #1-2 pitcher.  I like Fletcher and would definitely rather have him on the team than not but as has been reported he's one of so many Angels players that has value and could realistically be moved.

AS i said it might be the one deal that works... but then what do we do about SS?  Im not sold on Rengifo as a full timer there, are you?  Do we keep Simba?  Big picture wise how do you follow up?

[IheartLA]

Amazing looking back what Fletcher's perceived value on this board was versus what he is now. If we really could have gotten a good starter for him we messed up.

[Jason]

Lol, I guess they should have traded him 

[ten ocho recon scout]

Not pointing fingers at anyone at all. If anything in this thread stands out it's how much things change in such a small amount of time.

But there's some gold in here. And again, I'm not making fun of anyone.

@Docwaukee mentioning extending bundy. A few people saying Fletcher is better than ohtani. The talk about having to include adell with Fletcher to get a good return, and how that's an automatic no. Etc etc.

And this is less than 3 years old.

Lol... why can't we ever have good luck?

[Make Angels Great Again]

On 8/21/2020 at 3:31 PM, Bronson said:

At this point I’ll take Fletcher over Ohtani any day of the week. Sorry.

 

Big yikes

[IheartLA]

This is why a board like this is better compared to Reddit. I’d gladly pay a yearly membership fee to keep the archives. Keeps everything that’s happening now in perspective. 

[Docwaukee]

1 hour ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

Not pointing fingers at anyone at all. If anything in this thread stands out it's how much things change in such a small amount of time.

But there's some gold in here. And again, I'm not making fun of anyone.

@Docwaukee mentioning extending bundy. A few people saying Fletcher is better than ohtani. The talk about having to include adell with Fletcher to get a good return, and how that's an automatic no. Etc etc.

And this is less than 3 years old.

Lol... why can't we ever have good luck?

dochalo said that.  docwaukee has a much different outlook.  

[Make Angels Great Again]

2 hours ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

Lol... why can't we ever have good luck?

 

Even our good luck evolves into bad luck somehow.

Angel fans in 2008:

"Man, I wonder if we'll ever get a home grown superstar that is an inner circle hall of famer."

10 years later...

"Angels SUCK! You guys are wasting Trout, you should trade him and kill yourselves."

 

[DMVol]

So...the question now is....Does Fletcher have any trade value, short of eating all of his remaining deal?  Bad contract for bad contract?

[Blarg]

I don't think he has any tangible value right now. His offense is so out of whack that I doubt even the demotion is going to change anything; he is who he is. 

[failos]

On 8/21/2020 at 1:31 PM, Bronson said:

At this point I’ll take Fletcher over Ohtani any day of the week. Sorry.

Easily the worst post in AW history.

Incredible stuff.