Mike Trout on playing CF

[Lifetime]

How hard is it to look up a top 20 marlins prospect list? Its not hidden.

it's not. which of the pitchers on their top 20 were available for Bourjos?

[Lifetime]

Which is pretty much what he would be with Trumbo on the roster.

and again, I don't want Trumbo getting that much time in the OF. IF Calhoun is going to be up at this point in his career, it should be to come off the bench as a 4th OF. If things change over the off season and a quality value trade comes in return for Bourjos, then Calhoun should be in the mix. 

[Tyler]

Definitely not Jose Hernandez, unless you think thats what Bourjos can bring in.

The point is Dipoto wanted to keep him so he did.

[xboom28x]

and again, I don't want Trumbo getting that much time in the OF. IF Calhoun is going to be up at this point in his career, it should be to come off the bench as a 4th OF. If things change over the off season and a quality value trade comes in return for Bourjos, then Calhoun should be in the mix. 

Why not? You argued with me last season that Trumbo was a perfectly capable Major League right fielder. You said you even watched his minor league games at Salt Lake in the past to make the argument valid. But now you don't want him to play in RF that much?

[Lifetime]

Except you don't know that to be true. If there weren't any reasonable value offers in return, why would he trade Bourjos? If he thinks Bourjos is more valuable than perceived (based on the offers), why wouldn't he want to hold back, let Bourjos have an opportunity to show his value and increase the chances of gaining a more valuable return?

 

Definitely not Jose Hernandez, unless you think thats what Bourjos can bring in.

The point is Dipoto wanted to keep him so he did.

[Lifetime]

Why not? You argued with me last season that Trumbo was a perfectly capable Major League right fielder. You said you even watched his minor league games at Salt Lake in the past to make the argument valid. But now you don't want him to play in RF that much?

Because I no longer believe Trumbo should be an OF starter. Despite what I expected, and I wasn't alone in that projection by any means, he hasn't shown himself to be that kind of player. I love his bat, I like him at 1B, he's fine as an occasional corner OF off the bench - he's not a starter or even a platoon worthy OF though.

[Tyler]

What if there were reasonable offers and he chose ti keep him hoping he can sniff his own potential? If he trades him at the deadline or offseason, then he all of a sudden found a trade? No, it means he has come to the realization that he doesnt fit in the Angels' futute plans.

[xboom28x]

Calhoun and Trumbo could each play 80 games in RF and the team wouldn't suffer because of it. Trumbo could DH the other 80 and the team could pick up a vet OF'er as insurance for Calhoun in case he doesn't pan out.

[Lifetime]

What if there were reasonable offers and he chose ti keep him hoping he can sniff his own potential? If he trades him at the deadline or offseason, then he all of a sudden found a trade? No, it means he has come to the realization that he doesnt fit in the Angels' futute plans.

well Shane, if there is no evidence that such reasonable offers existed and he chose to keep Bourjos anyway, then what is the point of speculating that?

 

If he trades him during the offseason, it may very well be an indication that the offers in return for Bourjos are more worthy of pulling the string in that now the trade makes sense and brings value to the team to make it better. Bourjos becomes expendable to the team when there is something coming back or other options that make the team better. 

[Lifetime]

Calhoun and Trumbo could each play 80 games in RF and the team wouldn't suffer because of it. Trumbo could DH the other 80 and the team could pick up a vet OF'er as insurance for Calhoun in case he doesn't pan out.

yes, all of those things could happen. I don't think that is a value based decision for trading Bourjos at this time. You do, fine. We disagree.

[Tyler]

Dipoto publicly said he didnt want to trade Bourjos nor was he looking to. Di you have any evidence that says there weren't reasonable offers on the table for Bourjos? Could it be Dipoto had a different plan in mind that included having 3 cf's in hopes of an amazing defense that will play well for a pitchers park with flyball pitchers? hmmmmmmm

[stormngt]

But, if Trout bats better when he plays CF then wouldn't the right decision be to play him there? That would give them the best chance to win, wouldn't it? It's not like Trout isn't a capable, above-average CFer.

However, many discount the argument that Trout's bat is better in CF.  In fact, there is no logical argument to back it up outside of mere supposition.

[stormngt]

This year his OPS while playing CF is 300 points higher than when playing left.

 

BA as LF, .247

BA as CF, .324

However, last year's argument discounts the premise that Trout hits better in CF.  If the position was a causal factor than it would show in both samples.  it does not.  Therefore there must be another factor causing Trout's decline in offensive production this year.

[Lifetime]

Last May:

 

“We constantly field calls about players, but we are not actively shopping Peter Bourjos or looking for a fit for him," Angels General Manager Jerry Dipoto said. "We believe he’s an asset to us."

 

last July: 

 

"I don't (want to trade Bourjos)," Dipoto said. "Peter is a valuable asset to the organization. Today, he's a valuable asset. He makes us a better 25-man roster. He happens to have a fair amount of market value because he's a young center fielder who can go out there and perform in an every-day role. He also has a tremendous amount of value to us going forward because of what he's able to do for this team both in an every-day role and from a balancing-the-payroll perspective.

"All of that together makes it very difficult for me to envision a scenario in which moving Peter is a good idea."

With a smile on his face, though, Dipoto adds two caveats – "but you never say never" and "you have to give to get."

Last Nov:

Bourjos lost his job to Trout in May and was essentially mothballed for the summer, his role reduced to pinch-runner and late-game defensive replacement. He started two games from July 31 on.

But Dipoto loves Bourjos' skill set and is confident Bourjos can regain his 2011 form, when he hit .271 with 12 homers, 11 triples, 26 doubles, 72 runs and, according to FanGraphs, saved 21 runs on defense, second-most in the major leagues.

Bourjos has struggled to make consistent contact, but his plate discipline improved in 2011, as he went from 79 strikeouts and 18 walks in 86 games in the first half to 45 strikeouts and 14 walks in 61 games in the second half.

"He's a terrific defensive center fielder; he can fly, and he's done it before," said Dipoto, who will be in Indian Wells for general managers' meetings Wednesday through Friday. "We've seen what he's capable of when given an opportunity to play. We believe in Pete's upside. He has the ability to play every day in the big leagues."

 

All of that indicates it would take a very good return to replace Bourjos' value to the team, but trading him is not out of the question. He wants a substantial return in order for it to make sense on a net balance, if not they are more than fine keeping him and taking advantage of what he brings to the table for the team.

[Lifetime]

Dipoto publicly said he didnt want to trade Bourjos nor was he looking to. Di you have any evidence that says there weren't reasonable offers on the table for Bourjos? Could it be Dipoto had a different plan in mind that included having 3 cf's in hopes of an amazing defense that will play well for a pitchers park with flyball pitchers? hmmmmmmm

so you have nothing to support your assertion that there was in fact a reasonable value offer for Bourjos. Of course the plan of having three very good OF's is a worthy plan if there isn't a better value option available. Make me an offer, if it works for us we'll make the trade. If not, we're happy to move forward keeping what we feel is a valuable asset on this team. If he has a good year this year (as he has so far) and better trade options are available this coming off season that make the team better overall, then you consider the trade. If it's more of the same, you stand pat with that player.

[2002_halos_II]

"When you're out there playing free and comfortable, I think you play better."

 

 

He means he's not wearing underwear....

[stormngt]

Dipoto publicly said he didnt want to trade Bourjos nor was he looking to. Di you have any evidence that says there weren't reasonable offers on the table for Bourjos? Could it be Dipoto had a different plan in mind that included having 3 cf's in hopes of an amazing defense that will play well for a pitchers park with flyball pitchers? hmmmmmmm

My son loves Southpark.  His favorite episode is a mock on the history channel.  "There is no evidence to suggest Aliens were not at the first Thanksgiving".  Therefore, they were at the first Thanks giving.

 

Shane, your argument is very similar.  Since there is no evidence that there weren't "offers on the table" than you conclude there were offers on the table.  God I love you logic.  It is very entertaining.

[Ray McKigney]

However, many discount the argument that Trout's bat is better in CF.  In fact, there is no logical argument to back it up outside of mere supposition.

 

Mere supposition and, um, actual batting statistics.

[Lifetime]

actual statisitics don't support your mere supposition

[Ray McKigney]

I believe that my supposition is fully supported by actual batting statistics.

[Lifetime]

interesting, since it has been shown otherwise. But hey, stick to your guns.

[AngelsLakersFan]

What if there were reasonable offers and he chose ti keep him hoping he can sniff his own potential? If he trades him at the deadline or offseason, then he all of a sudden found a trade? No, it means he has come to the realization that he doesnt fit in the Angels' futute plans.

 

Bourjos value was pretty low in this offseason. General perception of him was roughly the equivalent to Dee Gordon. About the only thing keeping his value up was DiPoto's faith in his ability this year. We would not have got a very good return for him this offseason IMO. 

 

Think of Bourjos like a stock, he might never have been in the Angels long term plans, but the team may see him as a solid short term investment.

[haloman]

Bourjos needs to play and be our leadoff guy(tired of Aybar) doesnt matter where. if Trout is going to be a diva or a complete mental basketcase at the plate because he had to shift 40 yds. Like most you guys seem to think, Im glad the Angels are realizing it now rather than later.

I think he'll be fine in LF just like he was last year.

[Tyler]

My son loves Southpark.  His favorite episode is a mock on the history channel.  "There is no evidence to suggest Aliens were not at the first Thanksgiving".  Therefore, they were at the first Thanks giving. Shane, your argument is very similar.  Since there is no evidence that there weren't "offers on the table" than you conclude there were offers on the table.  God I love you logic.  It is very entertaining.

Yeah, no.

Like I already said, he didnt try to move Bourjos even though there was interest around the league.

[Blarg]

Do you have anything to prove there was interest around the league and the level of interest, or are you just making stuff up again?