Why are fans like this??

[Jeff Fletcher]

I’m going to rant to you guys because on Twitter there are even more irrational people than here. 

In my story today I quoted a few Angels basically saying they care and they are trying. Lack of motivation is not why they’re losing. This seems fairly obvious to me because I’ve talked to players for 22 years I know that’s how they’re wired.

But fans don’t want to accept it. They refuse to believe that it’s possible to just not be good enough. It must be that the players “don’t care.”

I suppose the only way to look like you “care” is to have a bunch of blow ups and tantrums on the field whenever anything doesn’t go your way, like a team of 3-year-olds. 

That’s all. Carry on.

[UndertheHalo]

I think for a lot fans it’s less frustrating to imagine the players aren’t trying then it is to accept that the team is actually pretty bad.  I think that posters on AW are probably more serious Angels fans then the rando that pops into your twitter feed to talk shit and then move on.  I mean I think most of us have a better grasp of the Angels situation then the typical fan.  So that’s the difference.  Not saying that we aren’t dumb on here also.  But we’re probably less dumb generally. 

Edited September 15, 2019 by UndertheHalo

[Troll Daddy]

You’ve got to be a idiotic if you don’t believe the players aren’t giving 100% and don’t care if they win or lose. 

Every game is its own .... example,  a walk off for a struggling team will be celebrated like they just won game seven of the WS.  

[Claude]

When you miss the playoffs for five years in a row despite having the best player in baseball and a very respectable payroll this stuff can happen. Arte sells 3 million tickets per season and we’re told that the Cardinals are the best fans in baseball. Yeah the fans are pissed off and rightly so. 

[tdawg87]

Twitter sucks. 

I think it's the same argument that people make when Sosh would say "turn the page". Fans want the players and managers to act out their own anger. Like calling the players out in the media. That almost never happens because it's stupid and looks really bad. Hell just look at the backlash the Angels received over Carpino's comments about Hamilton. 

And when things were going well for the organization, was Sosh calling out slumping players weekly to the media, or players throwing tantrums when things weren't going their way? No because that's stupid and successful organizations don't let that crap happen. 

I'd compare it to a regular 9-5 job: If you are screwing up and doing poorly, do you throw shit around and get angry? No, because you'd get fired for being a lunatic. Do you expect your boss to hold a meeting and tell everyone how bad you suck? No, because he'd be a complete asshole. Instead, you try to improve in rational, human ways and your boss discusses your performance with you behind closed doors.

Like I said, fans get angry and don't want to see the players acting like rational human beings and the managers not acting like unprofessional dickwads. They want to see their feelings acted out.

I think we all take the game too seriously, but as important as it may be to our every day lives, it really is just a game. 

Edited September 15, 2019 by tdawg87

[Glen]

4 minutes ago, Calzone 2 said:

When you miss the playoffs for five years in a row despite having the best player in baseball and a very respectable payroll this stuff can happen. Arte sells 3 million tickets per season and we’re told that the Cardinals are the best fans in baseball. Yeah the fans are pissed off and rightly so. 

So you're one of Fletch's Twitter guys.

[tdawg87]

Just now, Glen said:

So you're one of Fletch's Twitter guys.

If you followed Fletcher on Twitter you'd already know this.

[Claude]

1 minute ago, Glen said:

So you're one of Fletch's Twitter guys.

no I’m never on twitter. I don’t even like twitter.

[Glen]

I vent quite a bit but I never doubt the players are giving their all. It's their career and how much they make is directly related to how well they do. Yes, I know, after they sign a big contract that motivation can be questioned but I think most players still want a good legacy.

[Claude]

Fletcher said it best. They’re just not good enough. 

[Glen]

4 minutes ago, Calzone 2 said:

no I’m never on twitter. I don’t even like twitter.

I was speaking metaphorically.

[Glen]

1 minute ago, Calzone 2 said:

Fletcher said it best. They’re just not good enough. 

I think that's the truth of it. 

[tdawg87]

1 minute ago, Calzone 2 said:

Fletcher said it best. They’re just not good enough. 

We know. 

And the players know, too. And I'm sure it frustrates the hell out of them.

But oddly, it frustrates the fans even more. And they want the players to be as MAD as they are. Hence, this thread.

[Justin]

11 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

Fans want the players and managers to act out their own anger.

This is the key. Fans adopt a team and its accomplishments. When the team is good, the fan feels good about himself (or herself, I suppose), as if the team's accomplishments have anything to do with the fan. (I've found this more back east, with cities populated by people whose families have been there for generations, no one has ever tried to make a new life anywhere else, and there are no accomplishments of which to speak. I've known families where the Yankees, Steelers, and Redskins are far more important than church, work, or even fellow family members.)

When the team is bad, the fan is angry, takes it personally, and lashes out. Rationality goes out the window. It's much easier to say "This team doesn't give a shit" than it is to objectively say "Well, maybe a lineup without Trout, Ohtani, Upton and La Stella isn't going to be very good."

Fans exhibit fanatical behavior. Hence the name. 

[Justin]

I am also reminded of Anna Karenina: "Happy families are all alike; every unhappy family is unhappy in its own way."

Every Angels fan in Southern California has friends who are Dodgers fans. We have watched them celebrate two years in a row as they have gone to the World Series, and it looks almost certain it will be three. Our AL West neighbors to the north, the A's, are going to win close to 100 games two years in a row with a roster that appears on paper inferior to the Angels. 

The Angels have not seen the postseason in five years despite having a once-in-a-generation player in Trout, and possibly a once-in-a-century player in Ohtani. This is the unhappiness unique to our family and it provides another level of fanaticism. 

[Sherlock31]

Jeff sorry I disagree, if my team went 13-33 for their last 46 games, of course I'd want to know if they still care or not....

[AngelsLakersFan]

Not trying 100% is an easy narrative, and there is really no way to prove it's not true. When the team isn't playing most of the talented parts of it's roster and it continues to lose the vast majority of games fans aren't just going to take Andrew Heaney's word for it when he says they are focused on winning every game.

[Stradling]

It’s jealousy. 

[Jeff Fletcher]

2 hours ago, tdawg87 said:

But oddly, it frustrates the fans even more.

Why do you think this? Can you read their minds?

Or is it just because you can’t see them having tantrums?

[Jeff Fletcher]

1 hour ago, Sherlock31 said:

Jeff sorry I disagree, if my team went 13-33 for their last 46 games, of course I'd want to know if they still care or not....

That’s why I wrote the story. The players say they do. 

The issue is that fans refuse to believe them.

[Jeff Fletcher]

27 minutes ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

Not trying 100% is an easy narrative, and there is really no way to prove it's not true. When the team isn't playing most of the talented parts of it's roster and it continues to lose the vast majority of games fans aren't just going to take Andrew Heaney's word for it when he says they are focused on winning every game.

It’s just common sense. 

They all have worked their whole lives to get to the major leagues. They know that if they want to stay there they need to do every thing they can to be successful. They know that every time they step on the field they are being evaluated by their manager, GM, teammates and every other team. They know that all of those people can tell what a lack of effort looks like. 

It’s just not logical to think that they’d half ass it when they’ve gotten this far. These guys aren’t playing in some beer league after work. 

Like Heaney said, anyone who thinks that way would never gotten this far.

[34red4]

I think as a whole, it is accurate that the players do care. But the game I went to in Oakland on 9/4 made it seem that they have games they do stop caring about.

After being down 0-4 after the 5th, the team lost all energy and their body language seemed like they were already defeated. That they just wanted the game to be over with already. No fight after that. 

[tdawg87]

8 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

Why do you think this? Can you read their minds?

Or is it just because you can’t see them having tantrums?

I think I worded that incorrectly. 

What I meant was, it seemingly frustrates fans more because of how they act. Not that the players aren't just as/more frustrated.

[Angel Oracle]

Heck, when I used to play in the AW softball game in the late 2000s, I give it my all, and that’s just in a fun game.

Imagine a player being paid a big salary and the pressure that comes from living up to it.   Pretty hard to imagine them not giving their all normally.

There are isolated cases, like Hamilton with the Rangers in 2012 loafing after the ball skipped by him in the season ending game with the A’s.

[AngelsLakersFan]

10 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

It’s just common sense. 

They all have worked their whole lives to get to the major leagues. They know that if they want to stay there they need to do every thing they can to be successful. They know that every time they step on the field they are being evaluated by their manager, GM, teammates and every other team. They know that all of those people can tell what a lack of effort looks like. 

It’s just not logical to think that they’d half ass it when they’ve gotten this far. These guys aren’t playing in some beer league after work. 

Like Heaney said, anyone who thinks that way would never gotten this far.

Yeah but you are putting thought into this. These fans are offering emotional reactions which are not logical, not fully thought out. Explaining why they are losing will not correct the losing. "Effort" is an easy scapegoat which means the team can start winning simply by turning a switch.