Relief Pitching

[Stradling]

1 hour ago, tdawg87 said:

How many of those 15 blown saves turned into losses? You'd have to think at least 7-8. What's the average amount of losses caused directly by the pen? Is this even a measurable statistic? Does it matter?

I think 9

[Stradling]

1 hour ago, floplag said:

I truly didnt think it was that high, i guess i was wrong. 
So, inherited 7th most, and allowed 5th most... interesting.  All thinss being equal if they inherit 7th most they should have allowed 7th most, but they moved up 2 spots, so they have definitely under performed regardless of how you look at it i suppose.  

They’ve allowed the lowest percentage of inherited runners to score in baseball.  Or 5th least amount of actual inherited runs scored. 

[Taylor]

6 minutes ago, The Boogie Man said:

They’ve allowed the lowest percentage of inherited runners to score in baseball.  Or 5th least amount of actual inherited runs scored. 

So the key is to only bring in a new pitcher if there is a runner on base.

[Angel Oracle]

Would be nice if Shoe can return by September and help the pen out, if still in 2nd WC spot contention.

[stormngt]

Are we talking about how our relief pitching isn't as bad as we think?

[Tank]

8 hours ago, 2020worldseries said:

Angels just picked up Hansel Robles from the Mets who DFAd him and look what a Mets fan made on Twitter made lmao

https://mobile.twitter.com/MeekPhill_/status/1010590657201823744

That's awesome.

[floplag]

11 minutes ago, stormngt said:

Are we talking about how our relief pitching isn't as bad as we think?

They were trying to it seems, i found it laughable then and even moreso now.  

Thank god weve got a couple peanut castoffs coming in...

[Stradling]

1 hour ago, stormngt said:

Are we talking about how our relief pitching isn't as bad as we think?

No

[Stradling]

12 hours ago, The Boogie Man said:

.  I am not trying to sell to anyone that we have a good pen

 

[Puget Sound Angel]

Didn't you guys hear the news today? Pitching's on  the way. From the Mets.

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

17 hours ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

Honestly, the Angels bullpen has probably been about average, all things considered.

The blown saves figure is a little misleading because those can happen in the 6th inning and a lot of times when you have one you still win the game. 

The Mariners have 14 and the Angels have 15.

Otherwise, some of the stats are good and some of them are bad. 

All I know is, is that whenever our bullpen comes in late in the game, especially in the 9th with less than a 3 run lead, I cringe on every pitch until the final out. It seems more often than not we end up losing that game.

How about losing games that aren't close enough to be a save opportunity? Tonight's game wasn't a blown save only because the game was tied when the big blow happened.

The eye test says our bullpen is terrible and most sport shows agree.

[Stradling]

3 hours ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

All I know is, is that whenever our bullpen comes in late in the game, especially in the 9th with less than a 3 run lead, I cringe on every pitch until the final out. It seems more often than not we end up losing that game.

How about losing games that aren't close enough to be a save opportunity? Tonight's game wasn't a blown save only because the game was tied when the big blow happened.

The eye test says our bullpen is terrible and most sport shows agree.

Yes but last nights game was entirely on the offense. One damn run.  Justin Anderson isn’t pitching the ninth if we have a one run lead.   Unless Parker wasn’t available.  I saw the end of a game in a bar and couldn’t hear if they said anything like that. 

[Jeff Fletcher]

6 hours ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

All I know is, is that whenever our bullpen comes in late in the game, especially in the 9th with less than a 3 run lead, I cringe on every pitch until the final out. It seems more often than not we end up losing that game.

How about losing games that aren't close enough to be a save opportunity? Tonight's game wasn't a blown save only because the game was tied when the big blow happened.

The eye test says our bullpen is terrible and most sport shows agree.

If they blew a game that wasn't close enough to be a blown save when the bullpen took over, it would still be a blown save eventually because at some point the lead would shrink to where it was a save situation, unless one guy came in with a 4-run lead and gave up 4 runs all by himself. Usually someone would come in with a 4-run lead and then give up a few runs and then someone else would come in, and if he blew it, it would be a blown save.

As for losses in relief, which would include most blown saves plus tie games when the bullpen takes the loss (like last night), the Angels have 13, which is exactly the major league average. The Mets have 19. The Mariners have 12.

Again...

The Angels bullpen has been an issue and it could be improved. It has not been "terrible." It only seems that way because you remember the failures more than the successes. (Anyone say anything about Thursday or Friday's games?)

It is not even the main reason for the team's struggles. I still say the offense is a bigger problem, because in a lot of the games that get blamed on the bullpen, the offense gave them no help. (Last night, for example, the Angels scored 1 run and never had the lead, but you're all going to talk about how the bullpen lost it.)

 

[mulwin444]

5 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

If they blew a game that wasn't close enough to be a blown save when the bullpen took over, it would still be a blown save eventually because at some point the lead would shrink to where it was a save situation, unless one guy came in with a 4-run lead and gave up 4 runs all by himself. Usually someone would come in with a 4-run lead and then give up a few runs and then someone else would come in, and if he blew it, it would be a blown save.

As for losses in relief, which would include most blown saves plus tie games when the bullpen takes the loss (like last night), the Angels have 13, which is exactly the major league average. The Mets have 19. The Mariners have 12.

Again...

The Angels bullpen has been an issue and it could be improved. It has not been "terrible." It only seems that way because you remember the failures more than the successes. (Anyone say anything about Thursday or Friday's games?)

It is not even the main reason for the team's struggles. I still say the offense is a bigger problem, because in a lot of the games that get blamed on the bullpen, the offense gave them no help. (Last night, for example, the Angels scored 1 run and never had the lead, but you're all going to talk about how the bullpen lost it.)

 

Oh yeah the offense was dead last night and was the main reason for the loss.  Lots of singles and stranded runners and, if Mike Trout is not having a good game like last night, though find heroes who come through.  Simmons and Upton need to step up in those instances.

[Blarg]

9 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

It is not even the main reason for the team's struggles. I still say the offense is a bigger problem, because in a lot of the games that get blamed on the bullpen, the offense gave them no help. (Last night, for example, the Angels scored 1 run and never had the lead, but you're all going to talk about how the bullpen lost it.)

I got criticized for blaming the offense earlier in this thread. If you are going to roll relief pitchers out there every night for 3-4 innings your offense has got to support that in some manner. So far the offense isn't really supporting a team scoring 3 runs against them. In what world of balance is giving up 3 runs such a huge deficit to overcome when the opposing pitcher sports an ERA in the 4+ range. It's not like the Angels are facing the cream of the American league pitchers every night. 

[Griffey's Corner]

8 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

If they blew a game that wasn't close enough to be a blown save when the bullpen took over, it would still be a blown save eventually because at some point the lead would shrink to where it was a save situation, unless one guy came in with a 4-run lead and gave up 4 runs all by himself. Usually someone would come in with a 4-run lead and then give up a few runs and then someone else would come in, and if he blew it, it would be a blown save.

As for losses in relief, which would include most blown saves plus tie games when the bullpen takes the loss (like last night), the Angels have 13, which is exactly the major league average. The Mets have 19. The Mariners have 12.

Again...

The Angels bullpen has been an issue and it could be improved. It has not been "terrible." It only seems that way because you remember the failures more than the successes. (Anyone say anything about Thursday or Friday's games?)

It is not even the main reason for the team's struggles. I still say the offense is a bigger problem, because in a lot of the games that get blamed on the bullpen, the offense gave them no help. (Last night, for example, the Angels scored 1 run and never had the lead, but you're all going to talk about how the bullpen lost it.)

 

The bullpen has been bad. The bullpen has been terrible. The bullpen has sucked. 

 

The offense has sucked too. This thread is about the bullpen so that is probably why people are on here posting about the bullpen. There is lot's of other threads on angelswin talking about how crappy the offense is and certain individual offensive performances.

 

I have no doubt that certain members will come to your rescue. And I already understand that the Angels can do no wrong in your eyes. But seriously the bullpen has sucked.

 

 

[Stradling]

3 minutes ago, Griffey's Corner said:

The bullpen has been bad. The bullpen has been terrible. The bullpen has sucked. 

 

The offense has sucked too. This thread is about the bullpen so that is probably why people are on here posting about the bullpen. There is lot's of other threads on angelswin talking about how crappy the offense is and certain individual offensive performances.

 

I have no doubt that certain members will come to your rescue. And I already understand that the Angels can do no wrong in your eyes. But seriously the bullpen has sucked.

 

 

Dude you must not read Fletchers stuff because he has zero issues criticizing the team.  Hell in the post you quoted he criticized the offense. 

[Blarg]

Some people are just too wrapped up in their own point of view and they have blinders on about their own team. Everything can be a tragedy if you are only looking at one small portion of the game. Blaming the relief corps for every loss seems to be the focus many have.

[Stradling]

3 minutes ago, Blarg said:

Some people are just too wrapped up in their own point of view and they have blinders on about their own team. Everything can be a tragedy if you are only looking at one small portion of the game. Blaming the relief corps for every loss seems to be the focus many have.

Yep.  I don’t trust the bullpen but statistically they aren’t as bad as we think.  We absolutely need a closer. 

[stormngt]

44 minutes ago, The Boogie Man said:

Yep.  I don’t trust the bullpen but statistically they aren’t as bad as we think.  We absolutely need a closer. 

I would agree our need is a closer.  Parker. Anderson, Alvarez, and Noe are just fine in lesser pressure situations.   Bedrosian could be added to that group.  However I still hold my breath when any of them come into the game

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

4 hours ago, The Boogie Man said:

Yes but last nights game was entirely on the offense. One damn run.  Justin Anderson isn’t pitching the ninth if we have a one run lead.   Unless Parker wasn’t available.  I saw the end of a game in a bar and couldn’t hear if they said anything like that. 

If Anderson could pitch a scoreless inning we might have won. So it wasn't entirely the on the offense, Anderson didn't help.

[Stradling]

15 minutes ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

If Anderson could pitch a scoreless inning we might have won. So it wasn't entirely the on the offense, Anderson didn't help.

No Anderson didn’t help.  He’s not pitching if we have a small lead in the 9th. 

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

3 minutes ago, The Boogie Man said:

No Anderson didn’t help.  He’s not pitching if we have a small lead in the 9th. 

But he was pitching, regardless. He needed to hold them and he didn't.

If our starters pitched complete game victories everyday we wouldn't need a bullpen at all. Point being the bullpen's job is to prevent further damage and ours hasn't done that often enough to be considered good. Saying they are league average means little with all of the teams in rebuild mode.

[Blarg]

1 hour ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

If Anderson could pitch a scoreless inning we might have won. So it wasn't entirely the on the offense, Anderson didn't help.

The Angels didn't score in the 9th so the might have doesn't hold much credence. The offense blew multiple chances with RISP and Valbuena got seriously lucky not striking out on a pitch at the letters for his solo shot. 

Their chance to win really hinged on the previous 8 innings. They didn't accomplish enough on the offensive side. 

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

1 minute ago, Blarg said:

The Angels didn't score in the 9th so the might have doesn't hold much credence. The offense blew multiple chances with RISP and Valbuena got seriously lucky not striking out on a pitch at the letters for his solo shot. 

Their chance to win really hinged on the previous 8 innings. They didn't accomplish enough on the offensive side. 

And Anderson didn't do any thing good either which is why he got the loss. Sure the offense wasn't very good last night but neither was Anderson. In fact Anderson gave 3x more runs in 1 inning than Barria did in five.