Point Counterpoint Quick Hit – Is It Time To Fire Scioscia?

[tomsred]

I thought these articles were tongue-in-cheek.

 

Tongue-in-cheek is never a good idea here,.....you're just going to end up with something you don't want to swallow.

[fan_since79]

February, 2019 is the first time we'll be able to talk about Scioscia not being here.

 

That is, unless Arte gives him another extension.

[NrM]

Scioscia is never held accountable to some of you guys.

 

I'm sick and ****ing tired of the "but the players/roster suck"  argument. It's become the equivalent of "will anyone think of the kids".

Scioscia has had more power and influence than any GM on the Angels over the last 10 years. But please continue to place all the blame on the former GM.

 

How many ****ing GM's will we have to go through before you guys realize that maybe..just maybe.. Sciosca might be the problem..

Edited April 8, 2016 by Mr. Meeseeks

[ScottT]

The 10 year contract extension is one of the most mind boggling moves in baseball history.  At least since I've been alive.  

[ten ocho recon scout]

Tongue-in-cheek is never a good idea here,.....you're just going to end up with something you don't want to swallow.

i think thats tongue in cheekS

[Vegas Halo Fan]

...the Angels need to keep Scioscia to give Eppler some stability at the start of his tenure.

 

It did wonders for Dipoto, so why not?

 

I don't know of any other organization in baseball in which the GM must agree with the field manager or be fired.

[Lou]

...the Angels need to keep Scioscia to give Eppler some stability at the start of his tenure.[/size]

 

It did wonders for Dipoto, so why not?[/size]

 

I don't know of any other organization in baseball in which the GM must agree with the field manager or be fired.[/size]

Dipoto quit

[Vegas Halo Fan]

In lieu of dismissal, I'm sure.

[Lou]

I'm not

[Stradling]

I want to agree with Lou, but I don't want TD or Eric to be right.

[ten ocho recon scout]

Scioscia is never held accountable to some of you guys.

I'm sick and ****ing tired of the "but the players/roster suck" argument. It's become the equivalent of "will anyone think of the kids".

Scioscia has had more power and influence than any GM on the Angels over the last 10 years. But please continue to place all the blame on the former GM.

How many ****ing GM's will we have to go through before you guys realize that maybe..just maybe.. Sciosca might be the problem..

ill bite.

Aside from dipoto exciting everybody because he was a sabr guy replacing reagins, what moves did he actually do? Street was a good move. Conger for tropeano was great. What else? Az came to us for trumbo, and that seems to be the move everyone gives dipo the most credit for. The rest were either decent but not anything special, or bad like jepsen for joyce, pbj-grichuck for freese-salas, the hansen trade, etc.

Again, weve had one year in the past 7 with an actual bullpen.

Everyone always points to us failing as without acknowledging the other guy. Texas put together a powerhouse team just as ours came off a decade run of dominance. Oakland we a dominant team up until a year ago. If maddon wins this year with the cubs.....will it be because hes changed his ways since his TB days? He had great success at the beginning of his run there...then not so much. Did he change or the team?...

Ill put it this way. As someone who routinely converses with people on the inside, both "upstairs" and "downstairs", as well as people from the opposition, i can say that sosh is very well respected. Theres guys who hate him, but that could be said for anyone.

[NrM]

ill bite.

Aside from dipoto exciting everybody because he was a sabr guy replacing reagins, what moves did he actually do? Street was a good move. Conger for tropeano was great. What else? Az came to us for trumbo, and that seems to be the move everyone gives dipo the most credit for. The rest were either decent but not anything special, or bad like jepsen for joyce, pbj-grichuck for freese-salas, the hansen trade, etc.

 

Again, weve had one year in the past 7 with an actual bullpen.

Everyone always points to us failing as without acknowledging the other guy. Texas put together a powerhouse team just as ours came off a decade run of dominance. Oakland we a dominant team up until a year ago. If maddon wins this year with the cubs.....will it be because hes changed his ways since his TB days? He had great success at the beginning of his run there...then not so much. Did he change or the team?...

Ill put it this way. As someone who routinely converses with people on the inside, both "upstairs" and "downstairs", as well as people from the opposition, i can say that sosh is very well respected. Theres guys who hate him, but that could be said for anyone. 

 

We discussed this to death. Doesn't really address my post.

If Scioscia has more power and influence than any of the GMs, then he should be held accountable for the failures. The GM shouldn't always be the scapegoat.

 

I don't care if people like him. Being a good guy doesn't make him a good manager. 

I admit to being biased. I've wanted Scioscia gone for as long as I can remember. 

Edited April 8, 2016 by Mr. Meeseeks

[Stradling]

Scioscia is never held accountable to some of you guys.

I'm sick and ****ing tired of the "but the players/roster suck" argument. It's become the equivalent of "will anyone think of the kids".

Scioscia has had more power and influence than any GM on the Angels over the last 10 years. But please continue to place all the blame on the former GM.

How many ****ing GM's will we have to go through before you guys realize that maybe..just maybe.. Sciosca might be the problem..

I'll see your point as soon as you show me a manager that doesn't want talent on his team. This team isn't super talented and just a hunch a manager would want more and not less talent on his roster. Obviously Sosh dropped the ball as it relates to Napoli and his talent.

[Stradling]

We discussed this to death. Doesn't really address my post.

If Scioscia has more power and influence than any of the GMs, then he should be held accountable for the failures. The GM shouldn't always be the scapegoat.

I don't care if people like him. Being a good guy doesn't make him a good manager.

I admit to being biased. I've wanted Scioscia gone for as long as I can remember.

He has power or better put more trust than the GMs but to hold Scioscia accountable for roster construction is ridiculous. And this is coming from a guy that when it went down wanted to keep Dipoto over Sosh.

[NrM]

He has power or better put more trust than the GMs but to hold Scioscia accountable for roster construction is ridiculous. And this is coming from a guy that when it went down wanted to keep Dipoto over Sosh.

 

Really? You believe the most powerful manager in baseball(history?) doesn't have much to do with the construction of the roster? He can basically force a GM to resign, yet he doesn't have a large of amount of influence when constructing a roster?

Now that's ridiculous.

Edited April 8, 2016 by Mr. Meeseeks

[Stradling]

Show me a manager that wants a roster like this. Show me a manager that wants the bullpen he's had since Shields left.

[NrM]

Show me a manager that wants a roster like this. Show me a manager that wants the bullpen he's had since Shields left.

 

strawman

[tdawg87]

The weather sucks.

[Stradling]

Ok fine, Scioscia is the reason we suck. If Maddon was here with this roster we would be 2-0 against the Cubs and we would be winning this game infinity-0.

You've admitted to being biased, just perhaps that's the reason you think he sucks. It certainly isn't the opinion of others in the league.

[NrM]

Ok fine, Scioscia is the reason we suck. If Maddon was here with this roster we would be 2-0 against the Cubs and we would be winning this game infinity-0.

You've admitted to being biased, just perhaps that's the reason you think he sucks. It certainly isn't the opinion of others in the league.

 

perhaps.

[ten ocho recon scout]

Really? You believe the most powerful manager in baseball(history?) doesn't have much to do with the construction of the roster? He can basically force a GM to resign, yet he doesn't have a large of amount of influence when constructing a roster?

Now that's ridiculous.

firstly,he didnt force dipoto to leave. Dipoto did that himself. Not to mention dipoto dug his own hole...lot more went on behind the scenes than people know about. And ill add this, the comments made about eppler a few weeks back by the team were absolutely put out there for a reason, by the players...

As far as sosh having the power to construct a team, does the team the last few years resemble a scioscia team? Ask yourself that seriously, without bias. Scioscia has always been about pitching and manufacturing runs. Not playing station to station. And sure as hell not running out a shit bullpen.

[ten ocho recon scout]

If you do a thread search, i was pretty vocal about being team jerry. And ive also said going back to 2012 that i thought it was time to move on from sosh.

That said, take a step back and look at the team before and after dipoto. He gets slack because arte has ultimate say. But the farm arguably got worse, while the payroll skyrocketed. Blowing the wad on baldoquin remains to be seen if it was smart or not, but the early results dont look good. We gush over the trumbo trade, but it recently came out that was Az pushing for it. Which if you know anything about towers sounds about right. Street was a good move. Jepsen for joyce was bad. Pbj/grichuk for freese/salas was very bad. Walden fkr hansen (no offense) was bad. Our offense is worse today than when dipoto took over, our pitching is roughly the same. Our farm is worse. How much is that on Scioscia?

[Angels#1Fan]

Scioscia is responsible for tonights win. 

[nate]

I am looking pretty damn smart for arguing against firing him right now.

[Troll Daddy]

Eric, just because I believed free agency was the best way to solve a problem doesn't mean I just go with the crowd. If you have no minor-league system and you have no trade bait free agency with a logical answer. I also thought since they traded for Simmons they were trying to win now.

FYI They're trying to win now.