The spawn of Bundy continues the legacy...

[TobiasFunke]

[Spirit]

laugh...ok MT. You wonder why folks don't understand, or take the ranchers seriously, and then completely ignore one of the main reasons why they aren't.

 

You wonder why people aren't discussing the Hammonds, and it's because you have yokels who take over a remote building and then send out please for snacks and energy drinks (but on the plus side...apparently they remembered to bring free weights)

 

 

 

 

Makes sense.  It's the same reason why people don't take BLM or the Occupy movement seriously.  There's always bat-shit crazy people out in front getting the attention. 

[mtangelsfan]

Your analogy doesn't work.  The government isn't trying to build a shopping center.  It is trying to preserve what is already there, a wildlife refuge.  I believe nature was there well before any ranchers moved in.

 

The problem with the Hammonds is that they abused their privileges, so they lost them.  It is not the government taking away any land, it is land they already own.

 

That isn't the problem Rico.  You clearly didn't read what I attached.  This started long before any fires or anything else and the Hammonds aren't the only ones who have been effected negatively by the BLM.

 

Also, it is subjective to say that a wildlife preserve is somehow more important than a business.  Some people that the BLM have screwed have owned their land for over a hundred years and if they are ranchers, the land is pretty much preserved already.

[nate]

Except the three times they took it upon themselves to burn it all...

[mtangelsfan]

Two times and they didn't burn it all and if you don't know that fires are used by the government and land owners to control pests, to keep other fires from burning your land and to control invasive weeds you need some book larnin'

[TobiasFunke]

Three times MT. You obviously didn't read the article I posted a few pages back. I think most of us in here understand that controlled fires serve a purpose. But fires burned on federal land that were not allowed by federal authority is what we are talking about here.

[the dude abides]

It appears as though God instructed Ammon Bundy to occupy the bird sanctuary.

 

I guess that settles it then.

 

http://www.nola.com/crime/index.ssf/2016/01/man_behind_armed_oregon_band_s.html

[mtangelsfan]

Ammon Bundy's god isn't very smart.

[mtangelsfan]

Three times MT. You obviously didn't read the article I posted a few pages back. I think most of us in here understand that controlled fires serve a purpose. But fires burned on federal land that were not allowed by federal authority is what we are talking about here.

Except nate, who I was replying to, implied they somehow mistreated their own land.

[nate]

I actually have a cousin that works for the DNR in CA...  Specifically controlling invasive plants/weeds/etc on national park grounds.  Never once has she used fire to take care of them because the act also destroys the ecosystems good and bad.

 

Don't pretend that they cared about the sanctuary... the fires were self serving, and in one case they were malicious.

 

The only thing I don't agree with is using the terrorist threat law to prosecute them... wtf?

[Spirit]

Oh come on!  We know they don't use fires in CA because they don't have any water to put them out!

 

 

 

Not counting the down pouring of rain they're getting right now, of course. 

[Puget Sound Angel]

Just build a fence around these yahoos and call it a prison.

[Angelsjunky]

[Spirit]

AJ's meme is dead on.  The Federal Government is screwing these ranchers just like they screwed native americans. 

[arch stanton]

You fat asses are all gonna cry like babies when the price of your precious double doubles go up because BLM decides not to renew leases for grazing rights. If you want beef you have to have cattle.

[mtangelsfan]

I actually have a cousin that works for the DNR in CA...  Specifically controlling invasive plants/weeds/etc on national park grounds.  Never once has she used fire to take care of them because the act also destroys the ecosystems good and bad.

 

Don't pretend that they cared about the sanctuary... the fires were self serving, and in one case they were malicious.

 

The only thing I don't agree with is using the terrorist threat law to prosecute them... wtf?

 

I never once argued that they cared about the sanctuary.  I argued that they set the fires to protect their own land.  

 

However my larger point is that the BLM were screwing these guys long before any fires were set.  

[Spirit]

BLM = Bureau of Land Management

 

BLM = Black Lives Matter

 

 

 

 

[Crampknees]

Isn't Ammon a Muslim name?

 

Al Bundy was called Al but it was short for Allam-Sheik-al-shoesalesman.  

 

Bundy's are Muslims.  Nuke the Wildlife refuge. 

[ten ocho recon scout]

ive been staying out of this one, because i am not at all up to speed on the history that led to this, the laws about it, etc. But was thinking this same thing yesterday when i started reading this thread. The same people complaining about the govt taking the land (if i understand thtz what happening correctly) are there purely because the government took that land from someone else to begin with. The indian wars werent fought by settlers and militia, they were fought by the US Cavalry.

Thst said, in terms of those who point out we did the indians dirty, it also needs to be mentioned the natives who were here before us also routinely fought each other for land and resources. Sadly but factually, they were just on the losing end. What happened to them isnt really any different than what created every other border on earth. Humans are always going to compete, have babies, and expand.

[Angelsjunky]

Ocho, I also haven't commented on the issue because despite having read an article or two about it, I don't feel comfortable taking a solid stand - it seems like there are valid perspectives on either side of the equation. Which view is more correct? I have no idea.

 

As for Native people, you are right but it doesn't make it acceptable, in my opinion. This country was founded on violent colonialism and genocide.The native people were displaced, murdered, and enslaved, their culture and religion and even language deliberated squashed. Even to this day, many native Americans live in third world conditions. It is a shameful aspect of the American story that many to this day have no clue about.

[mtangelsfan]

1.  Native Americans got screwed.

2.  They are still being screwed because the reservation model does not work.

3.  What happened and is still happening to Native Americans has absolutely nothing to do with this story.

[Angelsjunky]

1.  Native Americans got screwed.

2.  They are still being screwed because the reservation model does not work.

3.  What happened and is still happening to Native Americans has absolutely nothing to do with this story.

 

I agree on all accounts. The picture was one I saw on Facebook that I thought was kind of funny, pointing out an irony.

[Kevin]

Isn't Ammon a Muslim name?

Al Bundy was called Al but it was short for Allam-Sheik-al-shoesalesman.

Bundy's are Muslims. Nuke the Wildlife refuge.

It's a Mormon name. Shifty people.

[mtangelsfan]

Its actually a Hebrew name.

 

http://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/Ammon.html#.Vo2LerYrKM8

 

 

 

Edited.  thanks nate.

Edited January 6, 2016 by mtangelsfan

[nate]

Hebrew*