Breaking: Eppard and Picciolo let go - Scioscia and Dipoto staying

[Troll Daddy]

I prefer a aggressive hitting approach and not just looking for the walk. Walks are ok but a hit is twice as better.

Before you guys go sideways ... I'm not advocating swinging at balls out of the zone. Teaching pitch recognition is a good thing.

Btw I think the Angels had a better OBP than the A's this season.

[Blarg]

So who are all the pitchers who struggled here and went on to find greater success elsewhere? 

Time to drop this, it has been the same argument and silly list of players regurgitated over and over.

 

Lifetime, you never want to see a coach removed and never seem to be able to accept that they have a responsibility, no matter what group of players they get, to improve their performance. Unfair as it sounds that is the parameters of their job and Butcher led the Angels pitching staff to some of the worst performances we have witnessed in over  years. Rojas's article pointed out they nearly lead the league in starting off hitters 2-0.

 

Accountability is not always fair and Eppard would probably agree. But if you don't hold the coaching staff accountable then there is a breakdown in the chain of command and the players lose respect for the staff. Eventually they start eating fried chicken and drinking beer during the game and the Manager ends up on ESPN for a year.

 

Do you really want Scioscia on ESPN for a year in the broadcast booth?

[SoWhat]

I prefer a aggressive hitting approach and not just looking for the walk. Walks are ok but a hit is twice as better.

.

Mickey, is that you?

[AngelsAndRamsFan]

@MikeDiGiovanna: Troy Percival said #Angels "have not contacted me whatsoever." Wants to return to MLB but position "would have to be worth my while."

[WallyWorld]

Eppard being fired makes sense to me (the offense, while good, had some major problems, particularly with hitters' approaches or lack thereof), I just can't believe Butcher didn't get fired as well.

[Blarg]

Percival is probably not the answer unless the question is how to brew a stiff cup of coffee.

[happybat4]

No to Joyner. Keep the steroid users out of Anaheim

[WallyWorld]

No to Joyner. Keep the steroid users out of Anaheim

 

huh? did i miss something? did he ever admit to taking steroids?

[Blarg]

huh? did i miss something? did he ever admit to taking steroids?

 

Yes, he did. Got them from Caminiti in San Diego.

 

Time for a new screen name and avatar?

Edited October 9, 2013 by Eric Notti

[Lifetime]

Time to drop this, it has been the same argument and silly list of players regurgitated over and over.

You're out of line Blarg. Interesting that you address me with this comment. I am not the one who posed the statement yet again even though it has been dispelled several times already. But I need to drop calling it out? 

 

Lifetime, you never want to see a coach removed and never seem to be able to accept that they have a responsibility, no matter what group of players they get, to improve their performance. Unfair as it sounds that is the parameters of their job and Butcher led the Angels pitching staff to some of the worst performances we have witnessed in over  years. Rojas's article pointed out they nearly lead the league in starting off hitters 2-0.

 

More BS. I have said numerous times that as fans we are not capable of evaluating a coach's abilities or performance. I have also stated numerous times that I was fine with coach replacements (including Hatcher and Scioscia by the way) if the FO felt that they were no longer a good fit for the organization. They are the ones who can properly evaluate a coach/manager to determine whether they should continue. And it is not the role or expectation of a coach at the big league level to convert mediocre talent in to quality talent particularly veteran players. That pitching staff was not good to begin with. We all knew it going in. We all questioned the additions and subtractions and felt that pitching had not been adequately addressed. Then when they end up being crappy we blame the pitching coach? How is leading the league with a 2-0 count the fault of the pitching coach? 

 

Accountability is not always fair and Eppard would probably agree. But if you don't hold the coaching staff accountable then there is a breakdown in the chain of command and the players lose respect for the staff. Eventually they start eating fried chicken and drinking beer during the game and the Manager ends up on ESPN for a year.

 

You hold coaches accountable based on their abilities and performance - neither of which we have any clue about to pass judgment. Our perspective as fans is narrow and uniformed. Yet they guys that do know kept Butcher in place and decided Eppard was not a good fit. Sometimes coaches and managers are fall guys - that doesn't make it right and I certainly wouldn't advocate that. Holding a coaching staff accountable for things outside of their control does not break the chain of command or cause the players to lose respect. 

[Docwaukee]

I don't think anyone is going to even remotely mess with Trout.  We'll get him Napoli's ipod just to be safe. 

 

At this point, no one knows if these are the right moves.  All we know is that two guys who's jobs are on the line sat down and tried to decide the best way to proceed in order to keep their jobs. 

 

I think the moves that were made are a clear indication of what was thought of those let go and what is thought of those that were kept. 

 

It could easily be argued that the offense underachieved more than the pitching relative to their respective expectations.  It actually doesn't matter though.  The guys in charge (maybe for the time being) decided that it was in the best interest of the team to do what they did. 

 

Essentially what Mike and JD are telling us is that they are willing to bet their jobs on the fact that Mike Butcher was not the reason this pitching staff failed.  Because if it fails again, everyone is toast.  They have way more to lose in this than anyone. 

[Blarg]

First off, lifetime, everything you said is wrong.

 

Now that we have that cleared up we can move on.

[stormngt]

Ebel being moved to bench coach is interesting from the standpoint that he has a lot of minor league managing experience. This tells me, and I am not saying this is the case, but it appears that Ebel is in position to take over as interim manager if this team gets off to another pisspoor start next season.

 

I really hope this means MS is on a very short leash.

 

 

Wow a lot of speculation here.  Great imagination!

[Lifetime]

First off, lifetime, everything you said is wrong.

 

Now that we have that cleared up we can move on.

good form. Fine example of moderator behavior as usual.

[stormngt]

Arte sounds like a wonderful boss. Totally unwilling to look in the mirror. He should be happy Scioscia and Dipoto are willing to keep working for him.

 

You would think the fact that Sosh and Dipoto stayed on is an indication that Moreno blames himself for the season.  Thus he looked into the mirror!

[Kevin]

I might need to refresh my memory but I nevertheless Joyner said he started to take them and then felt bad. He said he flushed the rest down the toilet. Definitely took them but not a rampant user supposedly.

[Amazing Larry]

Percival is probably not the answer unless the question is how to brew a stiff cup of coffee.

Actually he's been at spring training at least for the last 4-5 years. He sits and talks with the coaches during each game. I wouldn't be surprised if they hired him.

[stormngt]

off the top of my head santana, rodney and walden.

 

Santana had some damn good years under the Angels, so I don't see how you point that.  Walden had a good first year and his year with the Braves wasn't that great.  Rodney still sucks!

[Torridd]

I don't think anyone is going to even remotely mess with Trout.  We'll get him Napoli's ipod just to be safe. 

 

At this point, no one knows if these are the right moves.  All we know is that two guys who's jobs are on the line sat down and tried to decide the best way to proceed in order to keep their jobs. 

 

I think the moves that were made are a clear indication of what was thought of those let go and what is thought of those that were kept. 

 

It could easily be argued that the offense underachieved more than the pitching relative to their respective expectations.  It actually doesn't matter though.  The guys in charge (maybe for the time being) decided that it was in the best interest of the team to do what they did. 

 

Essentially what Mike and JD are telling us is that they are willing to bet their jobs on the fact that Mike Butcher was not the reason this pitching staff failed.  Because if it fails again, everyone is toast.  They have way more to lose in this than anyone. 

I don't think Butcher will be the key to the season anyway. I think they essentially felt he wasn't at fault. Like you said, everyone is gone anyway if the season goes bad again. Does anyone feel that Mike and Jerry felt  they HAD to get rid of someone as "payment" for being retained?

Edited October 9, 2013 by Torridd

[stormngt]

Who cares what other people on this site think?  I form opinions based on the information at hand.  New information has come to light, info. that fits and explains why this org. has had some of the problems it has had recently.  No one was a bigger Reagins "hater" than me.  That was back when we all thought our front office and management had normal working relationships and hierarchy.  

 

Outside of the Napoli- Wells move, what was so bad that Reagins did? 

 

And since it has come out that the Wells move was one that Moreno dictated, can we really blame Reagins on that one?

 

 

Although I guess you can blame him for giving so much up for Wells.

[Blarg]

I might need to refresh my memory but I nevertheless Joyner said he started to take them and then felt bad. He said he flushed the rest down the toilet. Definitely took them but not a rampant user supposedly.

Most of the players used their deniability card of some sorts like they didn't know that huge container of supplements was powdered steroids or that needle Conseco stuck in their butt wasn't filled with vitamin B-12. In the end they admit and deny at the same time.

 

 

You don't become a virgin again just because you go celibate after the fact. Joyner admitted he used since he knew he was caught. The other part of his story is the one that cannot be confirmed.

[Amazing Larry]

Most of the players used their deniability card of some sorts like they didn't know that huge container of supplements was powdered steroids or that needle Conseco stuck in their butt wasn't filled with vitamin B-12. In the end they admit and deny at the same time.

 

 

You don't become a virgin again just because you go celibate after the fact. Joyner admitted he used since he knew he was caught. The other part of his story is the one that cannot be confirmed.

Dammit she lied to me!

[Blarg]

At least a hundred times.

[Hubs]

I think they are going to hire an experienced hitting coach and a younger assistant hitting coach. As for 3rd base, who knows. Could be Tim Bogar who did serve as the 3rd base coach for the Red Sox in 2010-11 and is currently the Travelers Manager.

 

Eddie Murray is a darkhorse candidate for the hitting coach job. As is Chili Davis (if the A's let him go) which is not likely. 

 

I also saw in a story that they are hiring two additional coaches. Is this an assistant hitting (Salmon) and an assistant pitching (Percival). 

[Hubs]

"In addition to the third base and hitting coach jobs, Dipoto said the team probably will add two new coaches, at least one of whom is likely to assist the hitting coach."

 

From the Fox Sports West Story.