Obamacare/Trumpcare Horror Stories

[red321]

1 hour ago, Make Angels Great Again said:

Thoughts on today's EO?

 

The fact that it has Rand's backing is pretty encouraging.

Laugh.  Why is it encouraging?

[Make Angels Great Again]

12 minutes ago, red321 said:

Laugh.  Why is it encouraging?

 

Because joining forces with him will at last set in motion our diabolical plan of killing poor people.

[nate]

Today's EO is good in the fact that it makes it so people have more freedom in what they buy.  The thing people don't get is this doesn't mean someone in CA can now get an AZ plan at AZ rates.  The cost of care in CA is still significantly more than it is in AZ and the rates will be adjusted for that.  The only difference is if AZ only has 50 mandates and CA has 60, you wont have to pay for the extra 10.

It is really a very insignificant change.

[red321]

1 hour ago, Make Angels Great Again said:

 

Because joining forces with him will at last set in motion our diabolical plan of killing poor people.

So, you don't know. 

[red321]

1 hour ago, nate said:

Today's EO is good in the fact that it makes it so people have more freedom in what they buy.  The thing people don't get is this doesn't mean someone in CA can now get an AZ plan at AZ rates.  The cost of care in CA is still significantly more than it is in AZ and the rates will be adjusted for that.  The only difference is if AZ only has 50 mandates and CA has 60, you wont have to pay for the extra 10.

It is really a very insignificant change.

The state lines thing isn't what is concerning. It's the associate health plans and short term plans that are more problematic, as they are designed to pull healthier people out of the risk pool, therefore leaving sicker people in the ACA plans, which will then have to have rates significantly increased as just the most expensive people are left. 

[nate]

7 minutes ago, red321 said:

The state lines thing isn't what is concerning. It's the associate health plans and short term plans that are more problematic, as they are designed to pull healthier people out of the risk pool, therefore leaving sicker people in the ACA plans, which will then have to have rates significantly increased as just the most expensive people are left. 

Yeah, I missed that part initially.

I have mixed feelings about that.  I don't think healthy people should necessarily be on the hook to pay for people who aren't.

For example, I don't smoke, rarely drink and am a reasonable weight.  I don't think I should have to pay for a chain smoker that shotguns soda and beer daily.  If you want to kill yourself, pay for it yourself.  For the exchanges, smoking only raised rates like 5% when in reality, smokers incur more than 2x the health costs of non-smokers.

[Make Angels Great Again]

24 minutes ago, red321 said:

So, you don't know. 

 

I just figured we'd skip past all the BS and get straight to your final talking point.

[nate]

30 minutes ago, red321 said:

So, you don't know. 

They haven't posted the full breakdown on the MAGA_Knob_Goblins 4chan yet.

[fan_since79]

Covered California has all the various rates for 2018 on their website now.

Most of the gold and platinum plans are through the roof. The silver ones are significantly higher too, but not quite as dramatic.

The bronze plans are more affordable but they cover very little. Full price for prescriptions and huge deductibles for medical.

Click on "Shop and Compare" for rates (individual plans):

https://www.coveredca.com/

Edited October 12, 2017 by fan_since79

[RallyMo]

17 minutes ago, Make Angels Great Again said:

 

I just figured we'd skip past all the BS and get straight to your final talking point.

You never skip past bullshit. Never.

[Make Angels Great Again]

14 minutes ago, RallyMo said:

You never skip past bullshit. Never.

 

You're right, I shimmy past it!

 

[Adam]

So how is forcing people who don't need something to buy something moral?

[mtangelsfan]

1 hour ago, nate said:

Yeah, I missed that part initially.

I have mixed feelings about that.  I don't think healthy people should necessarily be on the hook to pay for people who aren't.

For example, I don't smoke, rarely drink and am a reasonable weight.  I don't think I should have to pay for a chain smoker that shotguns soda and beer daily.  If you want to kill yourself, pay for it yourself.  For the exchanges, smoking only raised rates like 5% when in reality, smokers incur more than 2x the health costs of non-smokers.

What if I shotgun cigars and chain drink diet soda?

[UndertheHalo]

57 minutes ago, Adam said:

So how is forcing people who don't need something to buy something moral?

Quite a way of looking at it.  The something in question is a necessity for all human beings.  Even if you don't get value out of it RIGHT NOW. Eventually you will.  Never mind the small detail that maybe your contribution is good for your community. 

You don't have to make yourself feel like you're being robbed. 

Edited October 12, 2017 by UndertheHalo

[mtangelsfan]

But it is robbery.  Why should I feel any different if a poor person sticks a knife in my back and demands my money?

I mean, he needed it.

[UndertheHalo]

5 minutes ago, mtangelsfan said:

But it is robbery.  Why should I feel any different if a poor person sticks a knife in my back and demands my money?

I mean, he needed it.

This is such distortion and hyperbole MT. 

Paying into a healthcare model that you can also use.  That you will 100% use at some point, probably extensively if you're forunate and get old.  Or unfortunate and get injured.  Yep, that is exactly the same as getting mugged.  That's basically your point here.   Good grief man. 

Edited October 12, 2017 by UndertheHalo

[mtangelsfan]

I already pay for my insurance.  I have paid into my medicare my whole life, so what is this extra money I am supposed to pay doing for me?

BTW, for people to do something against their will for the benefit of society always ends up working out really well.

[red321]

Yeah. Fuck that kid who has leukemia. Screw that 30 year old who chose to be born with a genetic predisposition to heart disease. Slackers and thieves.  All of them. 

[Adam]

 

16 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

This is such distortion and hyperbole MT. 

Paying into a healthcare model that you can also use.  That you will 100% use at some point, probably extensively if you're forunate and get old.  Or unfortunate and get injured.  Yep, that is exactly the same as getting mugged.  That's basically your point here.   Good grief man. 

He’s not paying into it though. That’s the point.

[Adam]

Just now, red321 said:

Yeah. Fuck that kid who has leukemia. Screw that 30 year old who chose to be born with a genetic predisposition to heart disease. Slackers and thieves.  All of them. 

Lame

[red321]

No, it's reality. Just like walking down the street and getting hit by a bus. 

[UndertheHalo]

3 minutes ago, Adam said:

Lame

Sort of strikes at the heart of the issue though doesn't it ?

Edited October 12, 2017 by UndertheHalo

[UndertheHalo]

7 minutes ago, Adam said:

 

He’s not paying into it though. That’s the point.

And the argument is that we should have system where we all pay in.  So that everyone, including you, gets access to good care.  Obviously this is complicated and would require controls on the healthcare industry.  I support all that because I believe that the free market approach to health care has failed.  I don't think ACA went far enough.  We need single payer IMO. 

This represents in almost perfect form the basic ideological difference between conservatives and liberals.  

[red321]

Take a look at Iowa. 1 person has bills of a million per month. Genetic condition. That one person blows a market of 30,000 people out of whack, and we want to make pools smaller, which means less people can afford insurance. Stupid. Larger pools that spread the risk over larger amounts of people brings cost down in the long run.

you pay more now, understanding that you pay less in the future

[Adam]

Conservatives are all about SS and Medicare. Their opposition to ACA makes no sense to me