The Dodgers

[Angel Oracle]

3 hours ago, yk9001 said:

I just looked at the NL West standings.  The Rockies are in second place and are 9-1 in their last 10 games.  With that, they are 9 games behind the Dodgers.  Because the Dodgers went 9-1.

Like I said, I wish the Angels could be that dumb and crappy a team, that the second place team goes nine and 1, and didn't gain a game on us.

Sounds like the A'th and Halos in 2002.   A'th win an AL record 20 straight late in the season, and still only gain some 3 games on the Halos, who were 17-3 during that time.  

[Angel Oracle]

2 hours ago, Troll Daddy said:

 

Hard to believe that was 2000, doesn't seem like 19 years have passed since Erstad's magical season.

[Blarg]

20 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

Built the Rays and the Dogs, the anti-Dumbpoto.

Friedman took over a franchise that went to the playoffs two years in a row. He inherited a top 10 farm system.

[Stradling]

What they did was smart, they spent ungodly amounts of money, money other teams can’t.  At one point I remember they were paying $86 million to guys that weren’t on the roster. They spent this so they never had to touch the farm system.  Since Friedman has been there I don’t believe he has given out a $100 million contract.  The beauty of this thread is it has all of the players playing their normal roles.  

[Docwaukee]

under Colletti from 2006-2014

2006 - kershaw 
2007 - no one of note
2008 - Dee  Gordon, Nate eovali
2009 - no one of note
2010 - joc pederson
2011 - no one of note
2012 - Corey Seager 
2013 - Cody Bellinger
2014 - Alex Verdugo

he had four division titles under his belt plus a WC 
payroll rank 

2006 - 6th (98m)
2007 - 6th (108m)
2008 - 7th (118m)
2009 - 9th (104m)
2010 - 12th (98m)
2011 - 12th (107m)
2012 - 12th (99m)
2013 - 2nd (224m)
2014 - 1st (235m)

Colletti also acquired Justin Turner, Ryu, and Urias.  

The vast majority of the core of their current team was under hit watch.  

 

[Docwaukee]

BTW, I don't have any particular interest in the Dogs winning.  I'd rather that not occur but they're not in our division and have very little impact on our fate other than a few head to head games.  

I think what some are trying to indicate with their recent approach isn't that they couldn't sustain it as much as the fact that they took a unique opportunity to spend their way through a rebuild and not just spend but crazy spend in order to maintain their farm.  Something that maybe 2-3 teams could actually pull off.  It worked, but it's not like that a model for most other teams including the Halos.  Who, mind you, have done a watered down version of the same approach in order to maintain their fan base yet it hasn't been nearly as successful.  The Angels just don't have the same financial resources sorry to say.  The Dogs also didn't have their previous GM essentially gut their entire org either.  He actually set the foundation.  The Angels had to build almost an entirely new with under much more strict constraints.  

So the Dogs played it smart yet I wouldn't mind seeing them continue to go without a championship.  Then, when we get good again in the next year plus we can demolish them in a freeway WS.  

[yk9001]

1 hour ago, Stradling said:

What they did was smart, they spent ungodly amounts of money, money other teams can’t.  At one point I remember they were paying $86 million to guys that weren’t on the roster. They spent this so they never had to touch the farm system.  Since Friedman has been there I don’t believe he has given out a $100 million contract.  The beauty of this thread is it has all of the players playing their normal roles.  

Any ownership team in major league baseball CAN choose to make an investment like the Dodgers did. The owner of the Tampa Bay Rays is worth 800 million dollars. And gets tons of money from the other major league teams every year.

[yk9001]

The owner of the Oakland A's, the cheapest team in major league baseball, is worth 2.4 billion dollars. He chooses not to invest in his team. The Dodgers choose to invest in their team.

[Slegnaac]

4 hours ago, Troll Daddy said:

 

I had forgotten that Darin Erstad and I share the same Birthday, thanks!

Edited June 5, 2019 by Slegnaac

[Mark68]

How many titles do the Dodgers have in the last 30 years?

[Stradling]

5 hours ago, yk9001 said:

Any ownership team in major league baseball CAN choose to make an investment like the Dodgers did. The owner of the Tampa Bay Rays is worth 800 million dollars. And gets tons of money from the other major league teams every year.

That is total bullshit.  The Dodgers have spent $1.7 billion on payroll since 2013.  The Dodgers have a TV contract in place that pays them  between $280 million and $300 million a year.  Tampa’s TV contract pays them about $15-20 million a year.   That team more than likely doesn’t even bring in the total revenue of the Dodger payroll some of those years.  

[Claude]

12 hours ago, Dochalo said:

BTW, I don't have any particular interest in the Dogs winning.  I'd rather that not occur but they're not in our division and have very little impact on our fate other than a few head to head games.  

I think what some are trying to indicate with their recent approach isn't that they couldn't sustain it as much as the fact that they took a unique opportunity to spend their way through a rebuild and not just spend but crazy spend in order to maintain their farm.  Something that maybe 2-3 teams could actually pull off.  It worked, but it's not like that a model for most other teams including the Halos.  Who, mind you, have done a watered down version of the same approach in order to maintain their fan base yet it hasn't been nearly as successful.  The Angels just don't have the same financial resources sorry to say.  The Dogs also didn't have their previous GM essentially gut their entire org either.  He actually set the foundation.  The Angels had to build almost an entirely new with under much more strict constraints.  

So the Dogs played it smart yet I wouldn't mind seeing them continue to go without a championship.  Then, when we get good again in the next year plus we can demolish them in a freeway WS.  

The one thing that’s become obvious is that the Dodgers don’t start their season with a second wild card mentality. The Cahill’s Harvey’s and Cozart’s don’t survive the smell test very long in a Dodgers uniform. 

Edited June 5, 2019 by Calzone 2

[fan_since79]

Ryu:

9-1, 1.35 ERA

He's pretty good.

[mulwin444]

1 hour ago, Calzone 2 said:

The one thing that’s become obvious is that the Dodgers don’t start their season with a second wild card mentality. The Cahill’s Harvey’s and Cozart’s don’t survive the smell test very long in a Dodgers uniform. 

"I think what some are trying to indicate with their recent approach isn't that they couldn't sustain it as much as the fact that they took a unique opportunity to spend their way through a rebuild and not just spend but crazy spend in order to maintain their farm.  Something that maybe 2-3 teams could actually pull off.  It worked, but it's not like that a model for most other teams including the Halos.  Who, mind you, have done a watered down version of the same approach in order to maintain their fan base yet it hasn't been nearly as successful.  The Angels just don't have the same financial resources sorry to say.  The Dogs also didn't have their previous GM essentially gut their entire org either.  He actually set the foundation.  The Angels had to build almost an entirely new with under much more strict constraints.  " - Dochalo

Since Eppler took over, the goal has been to rebuild the farm system and reestablish their international presence, both of which were blown out by Dipoto - 30th ranked farm and International money spent on Baldoquin.  The moves being made - not committing long term to FAs, not signing FA's that cost draft picks, not trading away top prospects - all reflect this intention.  

[Jay]

I love the whole, "Dodgers are dumb yet successful" argument.

[Claude]

36 minutes ago, mulwin444 said:

"I think what some are trying to indicate with their recent approach isn't that they couldn't sustain it as much as the fact that they took a unique opportunity to spend their way through a rebuild and not just spend but crazy spend in order to maintain their farm.  Something that maybe 2-3 teams could actually pull off.  It worked, but it's not like that a model for most other teams including the Halos.  Who, mind you, have done a watered down version of the same approach in order to maintain their fan base yet it hasn't been nearly as successful.  The Angels just don't have the same financial resources sorry to say.  The Dogs also didn't have their previous GM essentially gut their entire org either.  He actually set the foundation.  The Angels had to build almost an entirely new with under much more strict constraints.  " - Dochalo

Since Eppler took over, the goal has been to rebuild the farm system and reestablish their international presence, both of which were blown out by Dipoto - 30th ranked farm and International money spent on Baldoquin.  The moves being made - not committing long term to FAs, not signing FA's that cost draft picks, not trading away top prospects - all reflect this intention.  

Dumb decisions far outweigh the financial resources. How much financial resources are available to the Twins. Don’t look, the answer is $119M. 

[mulwin444]

24 minutes ago, Calzone 2 said:

Dumb decisions far outweigh the financial resources. How much financial resources are available to the Twins. Don’t look, the answer is $119M. 

Hmm, let's check out that roster:

Byron Buxton .263 .320 .828 OPS 2.3 WAR $1.75 Mil -  Drafted by the Twins,

Jorge Polanco .336 .402 .981 OPS 3.5 WAR $3.6 Mil - Signed by the Twins as an amateur free agent

Eddie Rosario .275 .310 .858 OPS 1.9 WAR $4.2 Mil - Drafted by the Twins

Max Kepler .257 .326 .826 OPS 1.6 WAR $6.0 Mil - Signed by the Twins as an amateur free agent

Miguel Sano .250 .355 1.009 OPS 0.7 WAR $2.7 Mil - Signed by the Twins as an amateur free agent

Mitch Garver .314 .410 1.108 OPS 1.5 WAR $575,000 - Drafted by the Twins

Kyle Gibson 6-2 3.75 ERA 1.219 WHIP 119 ERA+ $8.1 Mil - Drafted by the Twins

Jose Berrios 7-2 3.27 ERA 1.130 WHIP 136 ERA+ $620,000 - Drafted by the Twins

Besides Marwin Gonzales, no other older player is singed beyond next season.

Also, they traded Dozier last year to the Dodgers for OF/1B Luke Raley (.302 .362 .878 OPS in AAA, age 24) and SP Devin Smeltzer (1.15 ERA 0.896 WHIP in AAA, 2 starts in MLB so far).

A lot dumb decisions by the Angels' front office were made prior to 2016 that reverberate to this day...the answer is not to repeat those dumb decisions

 

[Stradling]

Someone is slowly morphing into what he’s always been, and that is without anyone antagonizing him.  Weird. 

[Stradling]

Oh and I’m quite sure if I’m the last 7 years Arte spent $1.7 billion and failed to win a World Series people here, especially the ones pumping up the Dodgers, would shit on the Angels for being failures. 

[Claude]

1 minute ago, Stradling said:

Someone is slowly morphing into what he’s always been, and that is without anyone antagonizing him.  Weird. 

My opinions, wrong or right are my opinions and not meant to antagonize anyone. I’m not always right but I’m able to openly admit that. Hope you’re having a great vacation. My son leaves next Sunday to attend the London School of Economics for the summer as part of his curriculum from Yale. He’s also going to catch one of the Red Sox / Yankees games that will be played there in a few weeks. Safe travels Stradling.

[Tank]

23 hours ago, GrittyVeterans said:

They have a dude who is in Rookie of the Year conversation every single year. First it was Puig. Then it was Pederson. Then it was Seager.  Then Bellinger. Then Beuhler.  This year it's Alex Verdugo.  

Not to mention turning mediocre players into good one's like they did with Turner, Taylor, Muncy.

Their player development is just ridiculous 

 

it's just a perfect storm for them right now. been rather impressive to watch. 

i hope it's our turn next.

[floplag]

7 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Oh and I’m quite sure if I’m the last 7 years Arte spent $1.7 billion and failed to win a World Series people here, especially the ones pumping up the Dodgers, would shit on the Angels for being failures. 

I have been a large voice about the lack of spending... and i wont revisit whether its right or not eetc... thats moot... but to your comment i dont think the Dodgers have been failures and i think anyone that does is nuts as frak.  
The last NL west winner not named Dodgers was in '12, 3 straight NLCS, .. i mean ok, no WS, but thats a crap shoot single series... they have literally dominated the NL in every other measure in the last few years and simple ran into some equally talented clubs in the WS.
If thats failing, bring it on let the angel fail please... 

[Claude]

1 minute ago, floplag said:

I have been a large voice about the lack of spending... and i wont revisit whether its right or not eetc... thats moot... but to your comment i dont think the Dodgers have been failures and i think anyone that does is nuts as frak.  
The last NL west winner not named Dodgers was in '12, 3 straight NLCS, .. i mean ok, no WS, but thats a crap shoot single series... they have literally dominated the NL in every other measure in the last few years and simple ran into some equally talented clubs in the WS.
If thats failing, bring it on let the angel fail please... 

October is what it’s all about. Winning it all is a tough thing to do but you have to be playing in meaningful games in October to have an opportunity to do that. 

[yk9001]

12 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Oh and I’m quite sure if I’m the last 7 years Arte spent $1.7 billion and failed to win a World Series people here, especially the ones pumping up the Dodgers, would shit on the Angels for being failures. 

Getting to the World Series is a substantial feat.  Always.

That's why the defining low moment of this franchise is the Donnie Moore loss.  Not losing a World Series.  But not getting there.  The second lowest moment is arguably 1982, after being up 2-0.

One can argue how impressive the six (now seven) division championships are.

And the RINGZZZ guys can mock the Dodgers not winning a World Series.

But if Arte got the Angels to two straight losing World Series, only idiots would call them failures.

[yk9001]

These Angels seasons suck.  Sorry.

The Angels have the best player in baseball, and we are totally, completely irrelevant.

Not playing important baseball games in September sucks.  Missing October sucks.